eBay buyer fraud advice needed
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Sorry to hear that happened to you. This is a big reason why I stopped using ebay and why I use amazon buyback for my textbooks when I am finished with them. It's much safer in my opinion. Of course, that doesn't work for everything.
OP:
That is too bad man. I had a feeling it would happen which is why I suggested you clean out your PayPal account of any method that could be used to let them take the money back.
I would continue to fight it myself. I wouldn't let the buyer get away with fraud like that nor E-Bay get away with stealing rom you which is what they did IMO. If I were you I would file a complaint with the BBB against E-Bay over this. Not that the BBB can do much but if enough people did it word would get out and E-Bay would have to respond
Some day E-Bay is going to screw over the wrong seller and they will get sued and lose. They are so far out of whack with what is fair and just with how they treat sellers vs. buyers there. I know no one has to go there and there is a user agreement and such( that they change every time you blink so you never know what is current ). BUT, you can't make people sign away basic rights protected under law and IMO these money grabs and refunds with no proof to justify them is one such case.
At the very least a big, messy, publicly followed law suit would do wonders to get them to make some fairness adjustment to things. I bet the media would be on it like a pack of wild dogs on a carcass too.
That is too bad man. I had a feeling it would happen which is why I suggested you clean out your PayPal account of any method that could be used to let them take the money back.
I would continue to fight it myself. I wouldn't let the buyer get away with fraud like that nor E-Bay get away with stealing rom you which is what they did IMO. If I were you I would file a complaint with the BBB against E-Bay over this. Not that the BBB can do much but if enough people did it word would get out and E-Bay would have to respond
Some day E-Bay is going to screw over the wrong seller and they will get sued and lose. They are so far out of whack with what is fair and just with how they treat sellers vs. buyers there. I know no one has to go there and there is a user agreement and such( that they change every time you blink so you never know what is current ). BUT, you can't make people sign away basic rights protected under law and IMO these money grabs and refunds with no proof to justify them is one such case.
At the very least a big, messy, publicly followed law suit would do wonders to get them to make some fairness adjustment to things. I bet the media would be on it like a pack of wild dogs on a carcass too.
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Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
They are so far out of whack with what is fair and just with how they treat sellers vs. buyers there. I know no one has to go there and there is a user agreement and such( that they change every time you blink so you never know what is current ). BUT, you can't make people sign away basic rights protected under law and IMO these money grabs and refunds with no proof to justify them is one such case.
eBay can make you agree to arbitrate in Delaware or some venue that's extraordinarily friendly to them. IDK if they do, but they could.
As a past user they email me trying to get me to sell stuff. Uh, no! They have a bunch of suits with MBAs who already made the call that being "customer friendly" was more important than having small fry businesses and their inventory.
One just has to take "shrinkage" into account when budgeting if ebay is worthwhile. 5-10% is probably a good place to start, with the state of humanity.
Sorry, OP.
They are so far out of whack with what is fair and just with how they treat sellers vs. buyers there. I know no one has to go there and there is a user agreement and such( that they change every time you blink so you never know what is current ). BUT, you can't make people sign away basic rights protected under law and IMO these money grabs and refunds with no proof to justify them is one such case.
eBay can make you agree to arbitrate in Delaware or some venue that's extraordinarily friendly to them. IDK if they do, but they could.
As a past user they email me trying to get me to sell stuff. Uh, no! They have a bunch of suits with MBAs who already made the call that being "customer friendly" was more important than having small fry businesses and their inventory.
One just has to take "shrinkage" into account when budgeting if ebay is worthwhile. 5-10% is probably a good place to start, with the state of humanity.
Sorry, OP.
Originally Posted By: eljefino
One just has to take "shrinkage" into account when budgeting if ebay is worthwhile. 5-10% is probably a good place to start, with the state of humanity.
Sorry, OP.
This is my rule.
You have to look at this from eBay's perspective, it is too difficult to tell if the seller or buyer are misrepresenting the transaction, so it's easier to just unravel it. Even if you took the buyer to small claims court, how do you prove it?
One just has to take "shrinkage" into account when budgeting if ebay is worthwhile. 5-10% is probably a good place to start, with the state of humanity.
Sorry, OP.
This is my rule.
You have to look at this from eBay's perspective, it is too difficult to tell if the seller or buyer are misrepresenting the transaction, so it's easier to just unravel it. Even if you took the buyer to small claims court, how do you prove it?
I had a similar, on a much smaller scale situation. Buyer claimed my description was way off, and the item was so terrible they had to throw it out immediately
. That set off the red flag to me so I just said send it back, full refund and have yet to hear back from them (or oddly get negative feedback).
But I've had a handful of other times where people have said an item is not as described, and my response is the same, full refund send it back. In my experience, ebay will typically side with the buyer if a case is opened by them with the same response the OP got.
One thing worth trying in the future for anyone might be calling up ebay and explaining the buyer is trying to use feedback extortion. It closed a case in short order once in my favor, but that was when I was on the buyer side of the equation.
But I've had a handful of other times where people have said an item is not as described, and my response is the same, full refund send it back. In my experience, ebay will typically side with the buyer if a case is opened by them with the same response the OP got.
One thing worth trying in the future for anyone might be calling up ebay and explaining the buyer is trying to use feedback extortion. It closed a case in short order once in my favor, but that was when I was on the buyer side of the equation.
Originally Posted By: dishdude
Originally Posted By: eljefino
One just has to take "shrinkage" into account when budgeting if ebay is worthwhile. 5-10% is probably a good place to start, with the state of humanity.
Sorry, OP.
This is my rule.
You have to look at this from eBay's perspective, it is too difficult to tell if the seller or buyer are misrepresenting the transaction, so it's easier to just unravel it. Even if you took the buyer to small claims court, how do you prove it?
Yep, I get that too.
But then why allow sellers to offer any return policy at all? I mean, as a buyer all I seemingly have to do is raise a stink and eBay will step in and grant me every demand, no questions asked. Have a "buyer pays return shipping" clause in you auction? Too bad, seller pays shipping! "no returns accepted"? Too bad, your taking the return! Lol, why bother with any verbiage trying to protect yourself at all? The way I see it, it seems that the seller should expect to take back and refund all money for any reason the buyer states. Pretty much sellers, on eBay, are akin to Amazon Prime...
IDK, I remember years ago when I first became an eBay member. It seemed then that the odds were stacked in the sellers corner, sometimes unfairly. I think the pendulum has swung too far the other way...
Originally Posted By: eljefino
One just has to take "shrinkage" into account when budgeting if ebay is worthwhile. 5-10% is probably a good place to start, with the state of humanity.
Sorry, OP.
This is my rule.
You have to look at this from eBay's perspective, it is too difficult to tell if the seller or buyer are misrepresenting the transaction, so it's easier to just unravel it. Even if you took the buyer to small claims court, how do you prove it?
Yep, I get that too.
But then why allow sellers to offer any return policy at all? I mean, as a buyer all I seemingly have to do is raise a stink and eBay will step in and grant me every demand, no questions asked. Have a "buyer pays return shipping" clause in you auction? Too bad, seller pays shipping! "no returns accepted"? Too bad, your taking the return! Lol, why bother with any verbiage trying to protect yourself at all? The way I see it, it seems that the seller should expect to take back and refund all money for any reason the buyer states. Pretty much sellers, on eBay, are akin to Amazon Prime...
IDK, I remember years ago when I first became an eBay member. It seemed then that the odds were stacked in the sellers corner, sometimes unfairly. I think the pendulum has swung too far the other way...
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Back in the day, I used to be an eBay power seller. I got below wholesale pricing on Honda ATF and Acura ATF, and was the cheapest seller of case quantities of Honda/Acura ATF for about a year on eBay before my supply ran dry.
My ad had pictures of Honda ATF, as well as pictures of Acura ATF, and my ad explicitly stated that the buyer would receive either Honda or Acura fluid depending on what was in stock in the warehouse at the time. Honda and Acura are the same company and the fluid was identical, coming from the same manufacturer, the only difference being the name (Honda or Acura) on the bottle.
One guy bought a case of fluid. When he received it, he put a claim in with eBay that it was not as described. He wanted Honda fluid, but received Acura fluid. (Remember, my ad specifically stated in bold large letters that you are purchasing either Honda or Acura fluid). eBay sided with him, refunded him his money, and he got a free case of fluid off of me. He got his item, exactly as described in the ad, and eBay still sided with him.
To add insult in injury, I was selling on eBay because I had recently lost my job. I was earning about $700/month from eBay sales, and this one idiot took $60-70 in income out of my very broke pockets. I stopped selling on eBay shortly after that.
eBay is evil and sides with 90% of the scammers. It is infuriating.
My ad had pictures of Honda ATF, as well as pictures of Acura ATF, and my ad explicitly stated that the buyer would receive either Honda or Acura fluid depending on what was in stock in the warehouse at the time. Honda and Acura are the same company and the fluid was identical, coming from the same manufacturer, the only difference being the name (Honda or Acura) on the bottle.
One guy bought a case of fluid. When he received it, he put a claim in with eBay that it was not as described. He wanted Honda fluid, but received Acura fluid. (Remember, my ad specifically stated in bold large letters that you are purchasing either Honda or Acura fluid). eBay sided with him, refunded him his money, and he got a free case of fluid off of me. He got his item, exactly as described in the ad, and eBay still sided with him.
To add insult in injury, I was selling on eBay because I had recently lost my job. I was earning about $700/month from eBay sales, and this one idiot took $60-70 in income out of my very broke pockets. I stopped selling on eBay shortly after that.
eBay is evil and sides with 90% of the scammers. It is infuriating.
Originally Posted By: eljefino
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
They are so far out of whack with what is fair and just with how they treat sellers vs. buyers there. I know no one has to go there and there is a user agreement and such( that they change every time you blink so you never know what is current ). BUT, you can't make people sign away basic rights protected under law and IMO these money grabs and refunds with no proof to justify them is one such case.
eBay can make you agree to arbitrate in Delaware or some venue that's extraordinarily friendly to them. IDK if they do, but they could.
As a past user they email me trying to get me to sell stuff. Uh, no! They have a bunch of suits with MBAs who already made the call that being "customer friendly" was more important than having small fry businesses and their inventory.
One just has to take "shrinkage" into account when budgeting if ebay is worthwhile. 5-10% is probably a good place to start, with the state of humanity.
Sorry, OP.
Not everyone who sells on E-Bay does it as a business. I don't. If a scammer pulled the stuff on me they did the OP that loss of money and loss of item would hurt.
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
They are so far out of whack with what is fair and just with how they treat sellers vs. buyers there. I know no one has to go there and there is a user agreement and such( that they change every time you blink so you never know what is current ). BUT, you can't make people sign away basic rights protected under law and IMO these money grabs and refunds with no proof to justify them is one such case.
eBay can make you agree to arbitrate in Delaware or some venue that's extraordinarily friendly to them. IDK if they do, but they could.
As a past user they email me trying to get me to sell stuff. Uh, no! They have a bunch of suits with MBAs who already made the call that being "customer friendly" was more important than having small fry businesses and their inventory.
One just has to take "shrinkage" into account when budgeting if ebay is worthwhile. 5-10% is probably a good place to start, with the state of humanity.
Sorry, OP.
Not everyone who sells on E-Bay does it as a business. I don't. If a scammer pulled the stuff on me they did the OP that loss of money and loss of item would hurt.
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
Originally Posted By: eljefino
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
They are so far out of whack with what is fair and just with how they treat sellers vs. buyers there. I know no one has to go there and there is a user agreement and such( that they change every time you blink so you never know what is current ). BUT, you can't make people sign away basic rights protected under law and IMO these money grabs and refunds with no proof to justify them is one such case.
eBay can make you agree to arbitrate in Delaware or some venue that's extraordinarily friendly to them. IDK if they do, but they could.
As a past user they email me trying to get me to sell stuff. Uh, no! They have a bunch of suits with MBAs who already made the call that being "customer friendly" was more important than having small fry businesses and their inventory.
One just has to take "shrinkage" into account when budgeting if ebay is worthwhile. 5-10% is probably a good place to start, with the state of humanity.
Sorry, OP.
Not everyone who sells on E-Bay does it as a business. I don't. If a scammer pulled the stuff on me they did the OP that loss of money and loss of item would hurt.
Yep, that's it right there. eBay is slanted towards the "power Sellers" or whatever...
And that's fine, just wish I new that sooner
Originally Posted By: eljefino
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
They are so far out of whack with what is fair and just with how they treat sellers vs. buyers there. I know no one has to go there and there is a user agreement and such( that they change every time you blink so you never know what is current ). BUT, you can't make people sign away basic rights protected under law and IMO these money grabs and refunds with no proof to justify them is one such case.
eBay can make you agree to arbitrate in Delaware or some venue that's extraordinarily friendly to them. IDK if they do, but they could.
As a past user they email me trying to get me to sell stuff. Uh, no! They have a bunch of suits with MBAs who already made the call that being "customer friendly" was more important than having small fry businesses and their inventory.
One just has to take "shrinkage" into account when budgeting if ebay is worthwhile. 5-10% is probably a good place to start, with the state of humanity.
Sorry, OP.
Not everyone who sells on E-Bay does it as a business. I don't. If a scammer pulled the stuff on me they did the OP that loss of money and loss of item would hurt.
Yep, that's it right there. eBay is slanted towards the "power Sellers" or whatever...
And that's fine, just wish I new that sooner
So I got the speakers back about an hour ago. Missing the original ADS box/paperwork & packing material.
I called eBay resolutions and they basically said that there is nothing they can do and they will be issuing the buyer a full refund...
I sent the buyer an email asking about the missing items, we'll see if he responds...
What a sh!t show!
I called eBay resolutions and they basically said that there is nothing they can do and they will be issuing the buyer a full refund...
I sent the buyer an email asking about the missing items, we'll see if he responds...
What a sh!t show!
You could always buy something from him or have one of your friends buy something. Not that I recommend revenge. Take the high road and you'll be a better person for it. Then down the road, in the future you'll look back on it and be proud of yourself.
Well that was fast. Here's the buyer's response...
"I advised you of this. I said that I would be packing them better than you did in returning them. Indeed, I wrapped them each in bubblewrap. I did not use your packing materials. Well, were they packed better than you sent them? Answer: Yes, they were. I'd say that both of the speaker grills being so bend diminishes the value. Wouldn't you? Question for you? How would you feel after spending almost $200, and getting them in this condition, and having the seller try to stiff you? Question? How did the speakers get this way? Well? Bad packing? Or you sent them to me already damaged? Well? Are they damaged badly? Yes, they are. You play games. You are unethical and irresponsible. I just talked to ebay today, again. They verified that you got the speakers back and that you have 6 days to refund me. If not, I get reimbursed by the ebay protection plan, just as I have stated I would all along. Wake up! I'm not playing this back and forth game you wish to play. Reimburse me, or I get my refund via ebay. No more games from you will be tolerated. They were returned exactly as received. Both speakers were damaged. Yes, or no !!!! Wake up!!!"
He admits that not all the items were returned which violates eBay's return policy as I understand it. Also, in his original complaint he was adamant that the speakers were not damaged in shipping and that I defrauded him by sending him something different, now he's saying that he packed them better because they were damaged in shipping. This guy is all over the place, how can eBay possibly side with him???
"I advised you of this. I said that I would be packing them better than you did in returning them. Indeed, I wrapped them each in bubblewrap. I did not use your packing materials. Well, were they packed better than you sent them? Answer: Yes, they were. I'd say that both of the speaker grills being so bend diminishes the value. Wouldn't you? Question for you? How would you feel after spending almost $200, and getting them in this condition, and having the seller try to stiff you? Question? How did the speakers get this way? Well? Bad packing? Or you sent them to me already damaged? Well? Are they damaged badly? Yes, they are. You play games. You are unethical and irresponsible. I just talked to ebay today, again. They verified that you got the speakers back and that you have 6 days to refund me. If not, I get reimbursed by the ebay protection plan, just as I have stated I would all along. Wake up! I'm not playing this back and forth game you wish to play. Reimburse me, or I get my refund via ebay. No more games from you will be tolerated. They were returned exactly as received. Both speakers were damaged. Yes, or no !!!! Wake up!!!"
He admits that not all the items were returned which violates eBay's return policy as I understand it. Also, in his original complaint he was adamant that the speakers were not damaged in shipping and that I defrauded him by sending him something different, now he's saying that he packed them better because they were damaged in shipping. This guy is all over the place, how can eBay possibly side with him???
Sell on Craigslist and avoid Ebay headaches.
Wow, HUGE turn of events.
Long story short after listening to the resolution rep again tell me again that there is nothing eBay can for for me I asked for a supervisor. After the supervisor looked into it and I explained the story, she told me that due to the sellers response to my last email (admitting that he did not return everything) that eBay would refund my money for the auction.
The way I understand it is that the buyer gets his refund from me and eBay reimburses me, so it's a wash. Awesome!
I stuck to my guns on this, Justice has been done here.
Long story short after listening to the resolution rep again tell me again that there is nothing eBay can for for me I asked for a supervisor. After the supervisor looked into it and I explained the story, she told me that due to the sellers response to my last email (admitting that he did not return everything) that eBay would refund my money for the auction.
The way I understand it is that the buyer gets his refund from me and eBay reimburses me, so it's a wash. Awesome!
I stuck to my guns on this, Justice has been done here.
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