Cold temps, blown engine

[DuckRyder]

I'm a little surprised the dealer agreed to this.

If 5/30 is recommended oil, I think the manufacturer is on the hook for this. I don't know that I would send an oil sample off, if it proves to be other than 5/30 (assuming 5/30 is recommended) you've given them ammunition against you and there is no way to prove it is what the Florida dealer put in.

Blackstone is pretty fast as long as you mail it some other way than the prepaid bottle, ALS (Napa/Wix) not so much. Don't CAT dealers sometimes have on site analysis?

Why is he going to sign the oil pan and filter?

Keep us up to date.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted by billt460
If people are this ignorant / stupid in operating a motor vehicle, there is no reason a manufacturer should be required to pay for it.

There's only one problem with that. Owners manuals these days are always warning against warming up a vehicle. Now, granted, they don't tell you to emulate John Force 30 seconds after starting on the coldest day of the year.

 

[billt460]

Originally Posted by DuckRyder
If 5/30 is recommended oil, I think the manufacturer is on the hook for this.

Originally Posted by rubberchicken
It appears he was in South Florida until recently, had the oil change at the original dealer a few times, records show it was 5w30.

Why should they be? The dealer maintenance records show the engine had the proper oil in it. That only leaves the way it was operated as the reason for the engine blowing. By putting it under maximum load and RPM, immediately after starting it in -15F weather. People in frigid climates operate motor vehicles all the time. They manage to do it without blowing them up. That leaves only one variable left. The operator was an idiot.

 

[TiGeo]

This isn't overly complicated, service records showing the oil changes which will show the type of oil are all that should have been required. Seems WAY extreme with all the chain-of-custody stuff and needing a friend involved....Why in the world did he admit to abusing it? Yes, now that he has stated that, I'm not sure the manufacture has to do much however, this could be a lawyer thing b/c where does it state anywhere in the manual that you can't do that?

 

[demarpaint]

While I agree with most of what was said here. There is also a chance the engine was defective too, it happens. More info is needed.

 

[TiGeo]

^^^This, I can't believe an under-warranty car wouldn't be covered here with service records if required. I mean, you blow it, take it and say "my car doesn't work"...shouldn't be an issue.

 

[Shannow]

another Billtt460 bag full of hammers thread intervention.


typing slowly....


the oil was (pending information) as per the manual, and installed by a certified dealer....what's Billt460s "proof of burden' ??

 

[billt460]

Originally Posted by TiGeo
I'm not sure the manufacture has to do much however, this could be a lawyer thing b/c where does it state anywhere in the manual that you can't do that?

The manual doesn't state a lot of things. That doesn't mean if someone is stupid enough to do it, the manufacturer should be forced to pay for the consequences.

We're right back to where we always end up in these type of incidents. At what point does the operator of a motor vehicle have to assume personal responsibility for his or her actions? Common sense has to enter into the picture at some point. A certain amount of personal responsibility is required when operating machinery. None was displayed here. Just complete stupidity. And let's not forget the fact it is stupidity that the owner / driver has admitted to. So there is zero speculation the guy is not just an idiot. But he is a proven idiot by his own admission.

 

[Shannow]

Originally Posted by demarpaint
While I agree with most of what was said here. There is also a chance the engine was defective too, it happens. More info is needed.



machinists, even aerospace ones are known to leave tools and swarf anywhere and everywhere...
conjecture here, it could have been an aerospace machinist leaving garbage in a gallery that lead to a singular failure.

And again my point that if the oil was as per manual, the owner's pressing of the gas pedal does not constitute liability for the failure.

 

[TiGeo]

^^^I agree with you - not sure why anyone would admit to abusing their car to a dealer when seeking warranty coverage?

 

[Donald]

Originally Posted by rubberchicken
I had a coworker call me out of the blue: he had a car problem and somebody suggested he contact me. New car- famous Japanese make, still under base warranty. He is in northern USA. After talking to him, I called the dealer service dept and spoke to the service manager: car was brought in with a bad tick and squealing, rough running and numerous engine codes. They initially thought it was a bad belt or frozen pulley, but after much investigation found that it appears to have engine damage: probably a rod or main bearing damage. After much discussion with the service dept it turns out the guy was late to work, jumped in the car and as soon as it was started he floored it as he was late for work. Temps were around -10 to -15 as best as I can gather that morning. P0301 and P0304 engine misfire cyl 1 and 4, and quite a few other codes. Service guys were actually really nice overall, and this is what they got from the owner, who confirmed the story to me.

It appears he was in South Florida until recently, had the oil change at the original dealer a few times, records show it was 5w30. Mechanic feels it was a thicker oil than that. They are blaming the owner for mistreatment of the car and are indicating they will not cover it, and they are talking to the dealer in Florida trying to get some more info. I am due to talk to them again tomorrow, and I told them to be prepared to have me speak to the zone rep. Car only has about 4k miles on the last change, and maintenance records seem fine.

I instructed them to leave the car on the lift, and find a clean container to take an oil sample but wait for the owner to get there so he can witness it. Plan is to have the owner write his signature on the oil filter with a Sharpie (perm marker), sign the oil pan as well, witness the oil coming out of the crankcase, send it off to a oil analysis place that does rush service and review the results. Have his wife video it with her phone. If he gets any flak at all to the process, then raise [censored] and call me. Service guys were fine with the plan, but after much negotiation it was agreed for 1 hour labor to cover this, which I got the owner to agree.

No way I can get up there, but I like the guy as a coworker so I am trying to help. Two questions: 1) am I missing anything ? 2) Anybody know of a reputable oil analysis that does rush service ? 3) Extra credit- should I have them do 2 samples and have 2 different labs run a UOA ?


Not sure why you are involved unless there is a English language problem. I would think the dealer and zone manager would want to talk to the owner. Both the dealer and the owner should send out their own oil sample.

 

[billt460]

Originally Posted by Shannow
another Billtt460 bag full of hammers thread intervention. typing slowly....the oil was (pending information) as per the manual, and installed by a certified dealer....

Which is exactly what I stated........
Originally Posted by billt460
......The dealer maintenance records show the engine had the proper oil in it. That only leaves the way it was operated as the reason for the engine blowing.

So once again you need to stop concerning yourself about typing, and focus on reading. (Most definitely not your strong suit).

 

[Eddie]

I would not mess with the vehicle but, go directly to the highest person in the manufactures line. Regional or Zone manager or higher if possible. If no positive response from the manufacture then get an Attorney involved. JMO. Ed

 

[billt460]

Originally Posted by Shannow
And again my point that if the oil was as per manual, the owner's pressing of the gas pedal does not constitute liability for the failure.

And yet again we enter into another thread were you not only defend stupidity, but expect others to accept the blame, and pay for it. Your track record of this sort of thing is becoming legendary around here. It should be interesting to see exactly how you manage to get Swiss Cheese involved in this one.

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/4726508/5

 

[Dallas69]

The owner caused this.
Stupid to do it.
Real stupid to admit to doing it to dealer.
I don't know why the dealer is even talking to the op about a car that's not his.
Does the actual owner need his hand held?

 

[aquariuscsm]

Originally Posted by ZeeOSix
Originally Posted by Shannow
Originally Posted by billt460
Your car doesn't know your late for work. But it does know when it's cold.

hmmmm...sentient vehicles coming soon to a theatre near you.


Christine ... https://youtu.be/oezKQEF0deY


1:25 gave me chills! BEST scene in that movie!!

 

[Trav]

Originally Posted by demarpaint
While I agree with most of what was said here. There is also a chance the engine was defective too, it happens. More info is needed.




^This or the dealer used cheap bulk thick oil to pad the profits and it didn't do the job.

 

[aquariuscsm]

Both my 3000GT's and my 300ZX's owner's manuals said to allow temp gauge to begin moving before driving the vehicle. I wonder if any current manuals state the same verbiage? I'll have to look in my Accord's to see if it does.

 

[aquariuscsm]

I remember my neighbor's Mustang V6 sounded like it was going to explode every time she'd get into it on a cold morning,start it up,and immediately floor it leaving her driveway. Knocking and smoking.

 

[Virtus_Probi]

I've never seen a UOA that tested for the W grade of an oil.
Are they going to do something special for this case?
Doesn't matter even if they decide it's an XW50 as there are 0W50s available out there...