Change the oil filter every other oil change?

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Originally Posted By: Apollo14
Actually, I'd say engines are putting greater and greater requirements on oil due to increased heat for greater efficiency and wanting thinner oil for greater efficiency.

So engines and oils improve together and the vehicle and oil companies work together. Modern oils are superb, mainly because the requirements of modern engines.

Therefore, if you put a modern oil in an older car, you will for sure obliterate the need for 3000 mile oil changes as well as the manufacturer oci at the time the car was made.

Whereas using lower quality oils even if they are modern, in certain modern engines, would in some cases require more frequent ocis than manufacturer's currently specify.

Eg 0w20 in a Toyota allows double the oci of modern conventional oil. Eg dexos is a modern oil vastly improved over just API standard but you can't put it into most German cars that require full synthetics.


Of course, I agree that the answer to the OCI question is: it depends. What another poster rejected as too many variables was exactly my point; however, many cars, even modern, can expect to achieve conventionally extended intervals (>> 3k miles; >> means much greater than,) especially if higher quality "synthetics" and synthetics are used.

The emissions control systems due add more solids and higher temperatures into the equation, but newer engines are also digitally-designed, with computers changing coolant and oiling channels, thicknesses and materials to minimize stresses, hot spots, etc. I'll state now that I don't know that for a fact how today's engines are designed, but I'd guess that they're a heckuva lot more sophisticated than engines of yesteryear, which means cooling channels, oiling passages and patterns, etc. are all probably a heckuva lot more efficient than before.

In the end, I'd have to guess that the better designs and oil technology far outweigh the increased demand.
 
So is the consensus that changing the oil filter every other oil change gets you better oil filtration when using a modern oil and a high quality oil filter?
 
I haven't seen the UOA particle counts comparing the filter's performance when at 5k, 10k, and 15k. Data means more to me than internet consensus. Filters are cheap enough to change.
 
I would be interested in reviewing the data that Chrysler, VW, Honda and ? generated that lead to the 2X filter change recomendation. The data was not generated by some self-appoint-expert in his garage. Ed
 
Originally Posted By: OneEyeJack
So is the consensus that changing the oil filter every other oil change gets you better oil filtration when using a modern oil and a high quality oil filter?

Definatly.....Assuming you use a top-tier filter (Fram Ultra, M-1, RP etc>)....and a quality name-brand oil.
 
Originally Posted By: Oregoonian
Originally Posted By: Clevy
Originally Posted By: OneEyeJack
And it's possible that the filter filters better as it ages.



It's not only possible it's exactly what happens.

I've been running oil filters for 2 or 3 oil changes for many,many years now and every vehicle I own goes to the wrecker with a great running engine,so let's be serious here.
I'm not nickel and diming here,it's not about cost for me. It's about filtration and the oil filters trap smaller and smaller particulate as the filter loads,which means better filtration.
Considering my work vans have in excess of 400k on them,and my personal vehicles are quickly getting there I'll just keep doing what I'm doing.
Now I'm not saying run the cheapest filter you can find 20000 miles here,but I am saying a mid and top tier filter is built to last that long so why not use it to the max.
Filtration efficiency increases as the filter loads. It's just that simple.


Amen brother CLEVY.....preach it.

My last OCI was at 9200 miles using M-1 0w20 AFE.....and I will do the next OCI when my OD reaches about 1800 miles....using the same Fram ULTRA filter.

I'm a big believer that the efficiency of mid and top-tier filters INCREASES.....as the filter loads.

Thanks Clevy....for stating it so well.


This is not what I was told when I asked filter company.

The response was that yes this is true for air filters but not true for oil filters, oil filter efficiency is fairly linear through it's lifespan.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: cp3
Originally Posted By: Oregoonian
Originally Posted By: Clevy
Originally Posted By: OneEyeJack
And it's possible that the filter filters better as it ages.



It's not only possible it's exactly what happens.

I've been running oil filters for 2 or 3 oil changes for many,many years now and every vehicle I own goes to the wrecker with a great running engine,so let's be serious here.
I'm not nickel and diming here,it's not about cost for me. It's about filtration and the oil filters trap smaller and smaller particulate as the filter loads,which means better filtration.
Considering my work vans have in excess of 400k on them,and my personal vehicles are quickly getting there I'll just keep doing what I'm doing.
Now I'm not saying run the cheapest filter you can find 20000 miles here,but I am saying a mid and top tier filter is built to last that long so why not use it to the max.
Filtration efficiency increases as the filter loads. It's just that simple.


Amen brother CLEVY.....preach it.

My last OCI was at 9200 miles using M-1 0w20 AFE.....and I will do the next OCI when my OD reaches about 1800 miles....using the same Fram ULTRA filter.

I'm a big believer that the efficiency of mid and top-tier filters INCREASES.....as the filter loads.

Thanks Clevy....for stating it so well.


This is not what I was told when I asked filter company.

The response was that yes this is true for air filters but not true for oil filters, oil filter efficiency is fairly linear through it's lifespan.


As someone who almost always does two OCI's on a single filter, I think folks need to be careful about drawing conclusions from air filters and applying it to oil filters. A positive-displacement oil pump is not an airbox, and liquid is not air...

There also seems to be some equivocation on published data, so the answer is most likely "it depends" when it comes to the question of whether an oil filter increases in efficiency. Purolator published some data which suggest their filters increase in efficiency--until the don't, and then efficiency drops. Donaldson published something that suggested their synthetic media increases slightly over time, vs. cellulose media, which declines. That seems reasonable to me given the more 3-dimensional nature of synthetic media.

That said, if you look through the UOA's with particle counts on the site which were done on the same oil during an OCI (there are a few out there in the archives), PPM per mile almost always seems to drop over time--and sometimes there's an absolute drop.

My reason for using a filter twice are simple: I hate the start-up death rattle one of my engines gets after an oil filter change (the oil pump seems to drain completely on a 3.0 Duratec), and the filter is no where close to being loaded to its capacity--so I see no reason to change it. I'll bet that any change in efficiency, up or down, is in the noise.
 
Originally Posted By: JOD
Purolator published some data which suggest their filters increase in efficiency--until the don't, and then efficiency drops. Donaldson published something that suggested their synthetic media increases slightly over time, vs. cellulose media, which declines. That seems reasonable to me given the more 3-dimensional nature of synthetic media.


Do you have a link to this published information? I emailed Purolator back in April 2011 asking about oil filter efficiency changes with use, and this is what they replied"

"The rating of a filter is the average efficiency during the life of the test. The test is terminated at a predetermined differential pressure across the element. The report writer of the equipment will print a graph which will show typically the filter starting with higher efficiency, dropping slowly and then increase efficiency in the latter part of the test – a “hockey stick” visual effect. The reporting is automatic with the test stand and cannot be adjusted externally.

The efficiency is highest at the beginning (before the media is attacked by oil and acidity) and again at the end as contamination does improve efficiency. We cannot correlate the change of efficiency to predict the change during the life cycle on a car.

The test duration is based on filter size and termination differential. For benchmarking, we use 8 psi increase in pressure across the filter as the self-termination point. Based on the size of the filter, media area, media design, test can run as short as 15 minutes for a small 65mm filter for over 1 day for a class 8 full flow filter. Typically from the graphs I see, efficiency at the end of life is slightly less than a new filter."
 
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