anti seize on spark plugs

[kschachn]

If any remains eight years down the road when its spark plug time.

I would say it does, at least in my experience.

 

[The motor guy]

That's what I have noticed. Ungreased boots can get stuck really good on the ceramic spark plug insulator. With the insulator having a film of dielectric grease on it, the boot comes off smoothly and goes on easily. The addition of a thin film of grease will certainly make for a better seal against moisture ingress than the boot alone.

You're supposed to twist the boots first before trying to pull them straight off

 

[kschachn]

You're supposed to twist the boots first before trying to pull them straight off

If they are really stuck that will just twist them in half. My Tiguan was assembled without grease on the boots and I had to buy the VW tool to remove the coils. VW issued service information to add the grease to the boots to prevent that from happening in the future.

There is no reason I can think of why one would not use it in this application.

 

[vavavroom]

You're supposed to twist the boots first before trying to pull them straight off

Twist until cracks appear all you want. I'm a physically weak specimen! Decrepit even. I'm an old man, get off my back. Im also not a glutton for punishment and am very much into prevention.

 

[The motor guy]

I'm a physically weak specimen! Decrepit even. I'm an old man, get off my back.

Me too. I weight 125 pounds at most lol

 

[vavavroom]

Me too. I weight 125 pounds at most lol

I weigh only 195 right now. I also have shrunk 1/4" over the past 28 years. I'm basically fading away.

 

[JeffKeryk]

Stuck plug boots are a drag. I never know if I am gonna break something twisting and pulling. I have far more trouble with boots than plugs. All them heat cycles makes them dang boots stick!

 

[Mackelroy]

Why not use it? I hurts absolutely nothing, and adding a little insurance to making them easier to remove is a good thing...you don't want to strip out threads in an aluminum head...

I already mentioned fragments of antiseize, metal compounds dropping into combustion chamber, when removing the plug.

Have you ever seen a 2 stroke frozen plug?

I havent cause they have oil on the threads

Anything will work as well as antiseize, without the risks of metal compound clumps. Dielectric works also, just fine.

What ever used, unnecessary to flood the threads , thin film more than enough.

 

[SHOZ]

I doubt if the metal in anti seize is going to cause any wear issues if falls into the combustion chamber. Most would be vaporized. Nickle might make it through.

 

[Mackelroy]

I doubt if the metal in anti seize is going to cause any wear issues if falls into the combustion chamber. Most would be vaporized. Nickle might make it through.

Yeah alittle gravel down the cylinder unlikey to hurt anything.

 

[KrisZ]

Yeah alittle gravel down the cylinder unlikey to hurt anything.

Sure, start comparing it to gravel, rocks, metal shavings and your fears will be validated.

How about pieces of hard carbon breaking off when removing the plugs, do you fear those too?

 

[930.engineering]

I doubt if the metal in anti seize is going to cause any wear issues if falls into the combustion chamber. Most would be vaporized. Nickle might make it through.

Yeah alittle gravel down the cylinder unlikey to hurt anything.

Oh, I think you do. 'A little of anti-seize' won't be 'vaporized', but it
probably partially congest your catalyst with its tiny fine pores. Not
really desirable.
Diminished flow, diminished power and increased fuel consumption.
.

 

[SHOZ]

If you are gobbing so much on the threads it's falling off you must look like the tin man every time you use the stuff. LOL

 

[John105]

Dielectric grease is an insulator, so that’s a very, very, terrible, horrendous idea.

Agreed. I am not exactly sure why, but for some reason we often think we’re connected online and therefore we know best. Even better than the mfg and engineers who design products. This was really beaten to death on a BMW forum where a member had access to a really expensive torque wrench from work and when plugs broke on the way in, he went as far as calibrating the wrench. Anti seize was the reason.

It’s interesting that if a plug mfg has a tsb stating do not use anti seize, people do it anyway. The tsb even explains why not.

 

[cb450sc]

I changed the plugs for the the first time in both of my cars this week. Both had original plugs. The manual for my 2005 Civic states to change them at 180,000 km. It has 149,000km but being 19 years old I thought I would change them. They came out easily. My 2021 Kia K5 manual states to change the plugs at 72,000 km, the car is at 80,000 km right now. I didn't expect any removal issues with this car and there were none. I followed NGK's advise and did not apply anti-seize on either. I don't know if either car had it applied in the factory. What blew me away was the price of the plugs. I was able to get the Honda plugs at Can. Tire for $40 but the best price for the Kia plugs was at kiacanada website for $120. The dealer wanted $160!! NGK doesn't show the Kia plugs on their website in Canada. There must be ferry dust in the Kia plugs!

 

[grampi]

To you guys saying anti-seize is bad, that hasn't been my experience over the last 40 years of changing my own plugs. I use it on every plug I install and never a problem...

 

[KevinMalone]

If you must use it, be sure to adjust your torque target to account for the decreased friction

Came across this in the Denso spark plug manual. Seems like the biggest risk with antiseize is over-tightening. So yeah, I think the use of anti-seize is fine as long as you account for it

 

[John105]

Came across this in the Denso spark plug manual. Seems like the biggest risk with antiseize is over-tightening. So yeah, I think the use of anti-seize is fine as long as you account for it

View attachment 233537

One has to realize. Using a perfectly operational and calibrated torque wrench, one can go beyond the click with little effort at 90 or 140 ft lbs dry.

Now imagine something that’s 17 ft lbs and anti seize is applied. Not too many people own a torque wrench that’s accurate around 10 ft lbs etc. Torque wrenches are only calibtrated down to 20% of the max of the range.

In other words, big opportunity for human error. At least the guy on the bmw forum who snapped plugs using anti seize when not recommended admitted it was his action that caused the damage. At first he blamed the plugs, then the work torque wrench. Why can’t we learn from him, I guess it would be too easy.

 

[KevinMalone]

One has to realize. Using a perfectly operational and calibrated torque wrench, one can go beyond the click with little effort at 90 or 140 ft lbs dry.

Now imagine something that’s 17 ft lbs and anti seize is applied. Not too many people own a torque wrench that’s accurate around 10 ft lbs etc. Torque wrenches are only calibtrated down to 20% of the max of the range.

In other words, big opportunity for human error. At least the guy on the bmw forum who snapped plugs using anti seize when not recommended admitted it was his action that caused the damage. At first he blamed the plugs, then the work torque wrench. Why can’t we learn from him, I guess it would be too easy.

I agree, which is likely why the use of antiseize isn't advised by manufacturers. I personally don't use antiseize but can understand the desire to. As long as users know how to do it properly (this is starting to sound like a safe sex talk).

Also, I recall seeing excerpts from the Honda FSM where lower than usual torque targets were specified since they call for the use of antiseize. So I think the whole to antiseize or not to antiseize argument really comes down to proper torque specs.

 

[JeffKeryk]

One has to realize. Using a perfectly operational and calibrated torque wrench, one can go beyond the click with little effort at 90 or 140 ft lbs dry.

Now imagine something that’s 17 ft lbs and anti seize is applied. Not too many people own a torque wrench that’s accurate around 10 ft lbs etc. Torque wrenches are only calibtrated down to 20% of the max of the range.

In other words, big opportunity for human error. At least the guy on the bmw forum who snapped plugs using anti seize when not recommended admitted it was his action that caused the damage. At first he blamed the plugs, then the work torque wrench. Why can’t we learn from him, I guess it would be too easy.

As you point out, there are numerous ways to make mistakes. But too much anti-seize and over-torquing fasteners are the fault of the operator.