A tale of 2 charts
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First one international, second one domestic.
All you need is TGMO, and you're golden. ROW is laying! Don't be fooled!
What are the differences in OCI's between foreign and domestic?
That's a lot of 5W-40 straight on through 2011 on the top graph!
What you can see is that the engines will tolerate a wide range of different viscosity oils.
I see a good case for a 5w30 synthetic with many of these applications.
I see a good case for a 5w30 synthetic with many of these applications.
Originally Posted By: laserred96gt
They seem to agree on one vehicle, the S2000.
i noticed that too. why would that be?
They seem to agree on one vehicle, the S2000.
i noticed that too. why would that be?
Nick1994
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Outside of warranty I'd probably use 5w30 in all of the 5w20 & 0w20 applications.
Quote:
What you can see is that the engines will tolerate a wide range of different viscosity oils.
That is the bottom line. Years ago I remember reading an article where GM said viscosity wasn't that important.
From an SAE paper where Mobil did testing"
"wear rates were significantly correlated differences to engine design and build quality (tolerances, metallurgy, etc) and not with lubricant viscosity."
What you can see is that the engines will tolerate a wide range of different viscosity oils.
That is the bottom line. Years ago I remember reading an article where GM said viscosity wasn't that important.
From an SAE paper where Mobil did testing"
"wear rates were significantly correlated differences to engine design and build quality (tolerances, metallurgy, etc) and not with lubricant viscosity."
Originally Posted By: buster
Originally Posted By: buster
Quote:
What you can see is that the engines will tolerate a wide range of different viscosity oils.
That is the bottom line. Years ago I remember reading an article where GM said viscosity wasn't that important.
From an SAE paper where Mobil did testing"
"wear rates were significantly correlated differences to engine design and build quality (tolerances, metallurgy, etc) and not with lubricant viscosity."
i searched for that quote and got nothing. you must have paraphrased it a lot. but, it makes a lot of sense.
Quote:
What you can see is that the engines will tolerate a wide range of different viscosity oils.
That is the bottom line. Years ago I remember reading an article where GM said viscosity wasn't that important.
From an SAE paper where Mobil did testing"
"wear rates were significantly correlated differences to engine design and build quality (tolerances, metallurgy, etc) and not with lubricant viscosity."
i searched for that quote and got nothing. you must have paraphrased it a lot. but, it makes a lot of sense.
That doesn't change the fact that every engine should wear less with Euro 40 grade than with 20 grade SN stuff...
What would be real life difference is another matter.
What would be real life difference is another matter.
Originally Posted By: chrisri
That doesn't change the fact that every engine should wear less with Euro 40 grade than with 20 grade SN stuff...
What would be real life difference is another matter.
Not really. It depends on how the vehicles are operated. In Europe some are driven at much higher speed with engine ran at near reline some of the times so that oil temp can be above 130-140C, in North America most vehicles are running at 70-80 MPH or slower and RPM are around 3k or less and oil temp is as low as 90-100C or less. Higher oil temp in Europe and elsewhere dictates thicker oil.
Honda S2000 is a little different, they are used to track in North America as well as elsewhere by some owners, when you track your S2000 the engine speed is usually above 6000 RPM and oil temp is way above 100-110C and it needs a little thicker oil than xW20.
Honda knows and tests their engines more extensive than anybody else. They first recommend conventional 10W30 for S2000 in all weathers and all locations the first 4 years from 2000 till 2003, then they found out that some drivers drove their S2000 even in winter when temperature can dip below 0F(-18C), they recommended 5W40 for cold start. There was no conventional 5W40 back in 2004 only synthetic, and synthetic 5W40 flows faster than conventional 10W30(according to Honda). Because of this 5W40 recommendation some S2000 drivers use it for tracking and normal driving in summer, the reason is at 80 MPH the engine is spinning at fairly high 4300-4400 RPM, with ambient temperature in desert can be as high as 120F the oil temp can be above 120-130C.
Personally, I mixed M1 0W40 with 0W20 to get HTHS north of 3.3 compares with 3.0-3.1 HTHS of most conventional 10W30, because whenever possible my speed on open roads is north or 85-90 MPH and RPM is north of 4800-5000. With this high RPM I like to have slightly thicker oil.
Oil viscosity depends on how/where you operate your vehicle(s).
That doesn't change the fact that every engine should wear less with Euro 40 grade than with 20 grade SN stuff...
What would be real life difference is another matter.
Not really. It depends on how the vehicles are operated. In Europe some are driven at much higher speed with engine ran at near reline some of the times so that oil temp can be above 130-140C, in North America most vehicles are running at 70-80 MPH or slower and RPM are around 3k or less and oil temp is as low as 90-100C or less. Higher oil temp in Europe and elsewhere dictates thicker oil.
Honda S2000 is a little different, they are used to track in North America as well as elsewhere by some owners, when you track your S2000 the engine speed is usually above 6000 RPM and oil temp is way above 100-110C and it needs a little thicker oil than xW20.
Honda knows and tests their engines more extensive than anybody else. They first recommend conventional 10W30 for S2000 in all weathers and all locations the first 4 years from 2000 till 2003, then they found out that some drivers drove their S2000 even in winter when temperature can dip below 0F(-18C), they recommended 5W40 for cold start. There was no conventional 5W40 back in 2004 only synthetic, and synthetic 5W40 flows faster than conventional 10W30(according to Honda). Because of this 5W40 recommendation some S2000 drivers use it for tracking and normal driving in summer, the reason is at 80 MPH the engine is spinning at fairly high 4300-4400 RPM, with ambient temperature in desert can be as high as 120F the oil temp can be above 120-130C.
Personally, I mixed M1 0W40 with 0W20 to get HTHS north of 3.3 compares with 3.0-3.1 HTHS of most conventional 10W30, because whenever possible my speed on open roads is north or 85-90 MPH and RPM is north of 4800-5000. With this high RPM I like to have slightly thicker oil.
Oil viscosity depends on how/where you operate your vehicle(s).
Originally Posted By: chrisri
That doesn't change the fact that every engine should wear less with Euro 40 grade than with 20 grade SN stuff...
What would be real life difference is another matter.
My take is viscosity does not cause AS MUCH wear as quality of build of an engine.
Good engine + bad oil > Bad engine + good oil
That doesn't change the fact that every engine should wear less with Euro 40 grade than with 20 grade SN stuff...
What would be real life difference is another matter.
My take is viscosity does not cause AS MUCH wear as quality of build of an engine.
Good engine + bad oil > Bad engine + good oil
Originally Posted By: 00Max00
Originally Posted By: chrisri
That doesn't change the fact that every engine should wear less with Euro 40 grade than with 20 grade SN stuff...
What would be real life difference is another matter.
My take is viscosity does not cause AS MUCH wear as quality of build of an engine.
Good engine + bad oil > Bad engine + good oil
true. this reminds me a true story from my youth. when i was a teenager, i had no car and I would borrow my father's fiat uno diesel for various trips. once i was caught in a blizzard in the mids of winter. i could not start the car. then i remembered there was 15W40 oil in the crankcase (required viscosity year round). i went to a gas station and bought some "winter" diesel oil. it was probably 20W API CD. i changed the oil and returned it to my father, but forgot to explain the details about the oil. that spring was unusually hot and my father was complaining about low reading on oil pressure gauge (remember those?). he thought it was broken. then i remembered the 20W oil. no damage to the engine that I could see. but, it doesn't mean that 20W was a proper thing to run in that engine in summer.
Originally Posted By: chrisri
That doesn't change the fact that every engine should wear less with Euro 40 grade than with 20 grade SN stuff...
What would be real life difference is another matter.
My take is viscosity does not cause AS MUCH wear as quality of build of an engine.
Good engine + bad oil > Bad engine + good oil
true. this reminds me a true story from my youth. when i was a teenager, i had no car and I would borrow my father's fiat uno diesel for various trips. once i was caught in a blizzard in the mids of winter. i could not start the car. then i remembered there was 15W40 oil in the crankcase (required viscosity year round). i went to a gas station and bought some "winter" diesel oil. it was probably 20W API CD. i changed the oil and returned it to my father, but forgot to explain the details about the oil. that spring was unusually hot and my father was complaining about low reading on oil pressure gauge (remember those?). he thought it was broken. then i remembered the 20W oil. no damage to the engine that I could see. but, it doesn't mean that 20W was a proper thing to run in that engine in summer.
If that quote was accurate how come GM was so slow to get on the 20 grade bandwagon then I wonder?
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