2024 Jetta Oil

[Hamltnblue]

The green marker is in there for a reason, what do you think that could be?

I know one thing this site if full of threads reworded 1001 ways about oils to thin who wants it thicker. Well since I don’t understand physics I turned to my search engine here’s what I’m told.

Never said anything about hydraulic lifter noise. I said the engine ran smoother. Everything from the cam to pistons etc are better lubricated. Simply reduces normal vibrations even further.

 

[Hamltnblue]

Auto makers recommend oil based on legal environment (CAFE), exploitation, climate variables etc.
BMW etc. say that fluid in ZF transmission is lifetime. ZF, which, you know, makes that transmission, says to change fluid every 60-75k. So, isn’t in auto manufacture’s interest to have transmission that last as long as rest of the vehicle?

No. The auto Manufacturer‘s best interest is to find the best middle point between longevity, while meeting the environmental regulations. in addition, a customer who’s car lasts 150k miles will return to the show room a lot earlier than the one who’s car lasts 250k.

 

[Hamltnblue]

Wouldn't this be the opposite effect..??? I would think moving a heavier oil would create more noise. Anyway between a 0w20 and 30 you'll hear no difference also with a 0w16 and 20. I had a Toyota that was "recommended to use 0w16" I switched back and forth between 16 and 20 with no audible difference. Lets take a bigger leap my friend has a 96 ss impala its not stock, he ran redline 20w50 for years had it in storage for sometime decided to get the car back on the road switched to Mobil 1 10w30 no sound difference either. Btw the 10w30 much better oil choice for the impala

It’s funny you mention Toyota. I just sold my 2021 Camry. The US owners manual and under the hood said to only use 0w16 oil. The car owners manual in Australia allows up to 15w40. The engine part number is the same. A quick google and you can verify for yourself.
I ran 5w30 and it ran much smoother in the summer. I also ran 0w20 in the winter.

 

[TimeFlies]

Excuse my ignorance, but what is HTHS, and why do vw engines need more of it than others.

 

[edyvw]

Excuse my ignorance, but what is HTHS, and why do vw engines need more of it than others.

That is actually what matters:

https://360.lubrizol.com/2019/Impact-of-High-Temperature-High-Shear-HTHS-Viscosity#:~:text=HTHS%20measures%20the%20viscosity%20(resistance,parts%20in%20a%20hot%20engine.

HTHS matters in all vehicles. Basically, higher HTHS, more protection. However, you really do not want too high of HTHS. 3.5mpas to 4mpas IMO in Euro, especially any turbo vehicles is ideal.
For consumers, labeling oils using HTHS would be too confusing.

 

[edyvw]

It’s funny you mention Toyota. I just sold my 2021 Camry. The US owners manual and under the hood said to only use 0w16 oil. The car owners manual in Australia allows up to 15w40. The engine part number is the same. A quick google and you can verify for yourself.
I ran 5w30 and it ran much smoother in the summer. I also ran 0w20 in the winter.

2GR-FE Toyota engine had 20W50 recommendation for some desert areas of Australia, while in the US it was specd. for 0W20.

 

[edyvw]

No. The auto Manufacturer‘s best interest is to find the best middle point between longevity, while meeting the environmental regulations. in addition, a customer who’s car lasts 150k miles will return to the show room a lot earlier than the one who’s car lasts 250k.

Well yeah, it is what auto manufacturers consider the projected lifespan of a vehicle.
In EUrope, ACEA A3 and C3 oils were always the preferred way, but with the witchhunt on speed, they are moving to lower HTHS too.

 

[Chief119]

FYI
Today I visited a local VW service department to pick up a quart of 508 00 oil. The dipstick on my car is halfway down the hatch but I didn’t see it when new a week ago.
Both managers behind the desk noted it was just 0w20 oil. They took my keys and had it topped off for free.
Both were very friendly and eager to answer questions.
I asked what the their policy was on using 0W30 or oil in that car. They said that 0w30 is authorized to be substituted. All you have to do is ask. One noted that the 0W20 gives a couple of more MPG.

I noted that I used 5W30 in my 21 Camry and the motor was noticeably quieter with less vibration. He agreed this would be the same in the VW.

After break in they will be seeing me for an oil change to 0W30.

Owners Manual will probably tell you the same thing too.

I would run HPL EURO no VII 5w30 in it, but that’s me.

 

[kschachn]

I don’t take forums to heart this site is a form of entertainment and escape. Funny how frustrated man gets himself over oil viscosity and you know a textbook example of insanity repeating the same thing over and expecting different results. So let’s keep posting 0w20 is too thin auto makers want to sell cars they want you to blow your engine. 5w30 is quieter than 0w20. Oh the famous my 5w30 is thicker than your 5w30.

Not frustrated at all. Just working to correct error and gross misconceptions which is rampant on this site at times, often from new(?) members that think there are alternate forms of physics that somehow apply.

 

[Rogueman2016s]

Not frustrated at all. Just working to correct error and gross misconceptions which is rampant on this site at times, often from new(?) members that think there are alternate forms of physics that somehow apply.

Merry Christmas . Have yourself a cup a cheer today you’re way to grouchy over the internet.

 

[mattwithcats]

Rock Auto has Liqui Moly Top Tec 6200

Drop an oil filter, air filter, and cabin filter, enough for 2-4 changes, but watch the shipping costs…

LIQUI MOLY 20238 Oil | RockAuto

RockAuto ships auto parts and body parts from over 300 manufacturers to customers' doors worldwide, all at warehouse prices. Easy to use parts catalog.

www.rockauto.com

 

[ARCOgraphite]

I would have to say that I find it hard to believe any differences in HTHS can cause audible knocking. Not doubting that you heard something, but the physics of it don't seem possible for that to be the mechanism.

Try to clap your hands underwater, then complete the experiment by exiting the pool, then trying to clap your hands in atmosphere at sea level.

This is not an example of HTHS at that moment per se, but quite related to an operational viscosity difference.

There is reasoning behind manufacturers specifying a "minimum" HTHS. One of those is to maintain
a minimum oil film thickness under anticipated operational stressors. The other is efficiency and economy.

It is quite the balancing act.

 

[chris719]

Try to clap your hands underwater, then complete the experiment by exiting the pool, then trying to clap your hands in atmosphere at sea level.

This is not an example of HTHS at that moment per se, but quite related to an operational viscosity difference.

There is reasoning behind manufacturers specifying a "minimum" HTHS. One of those is to maintain
a minimum oil film thickness under anticipated operational stressors. The other is efficiency and economy.

It is quite the balancing act.

I really don’t think this analogy is valid. I understand what you’re getting at though.

 

[Triple_Se7en]

Merry Christmas . Have yourself a cup a cheer today you’re way to grouchy over the internet.

Be happy you don't drive the new 2023 Rogue.
I was standing at my driveway gate last night, helping my daughter load her presents from us in that new Rogue with 3k miles on it

When she entered the vehicle and started the three cylinder engine, I thought my wife was standing next to me holding a bag of marbles and shaking the bag. It's not a diesel engine BTW, but one would never know that standing next to it....lol

Someone in Japan forgot to put some HTHS in her factory oil.
Thank Goodness she only leased it for three years. It'll likely only accumulate 24k miles by then.
Happy New Year

 

[Rogueman2016s]

Be happy you don't drive the new 2024 Rogue.
I was standing at my driveway gate last night, helping my daughter load her presents from us in that new Rogue with 3k miles on it

When she entered the vehicle and started the three cylinder engine, I thought my wife was standing next to me holding a bag of marbles and shaking the bag. It's not a diesel engine BTW, but one would never know that standing next to it....lol

Someone in Japan forgot to put some HTHS in her factory oil.
Thank Goodness she only leased it for three years. It'll likely only accumulate 24k miles by then.
Happy New Year

Nothing is perfect , on the good note she’s covered under warranty.

 

[Hamltnblue]

Try to clap your hands underwater, then complete the experiment by exiting the pool, then trying to clap your hands in atmosphere at sea level.

This is not an example of HTHS at that moment per se, but quite related to an operational viscosity difference.

There is reasoning behind manufacturers specifying a "minimum" HTHS. One of those is to maintain
a minimum oil film thickness under anticipated operational stressors. The other is efficiency and economy.

It is quite the balancing act.

Another is to think of oil molecules as small pillows. Would a pillow that is 50 percent thicker absorb shock more or less?

 

[DuckRyder]

Another is to think of oil molecules as small pillows. Would a pillow that is 50 percent thicker absorb shock more or less?

Man that's gonna give you a crick in your neck.

 

[bigjl]

It's a dye to help prevent the techs at dealerships from putting the lighter 508 oil into engines that call for 502 or 504. The older speced engines will not do well on the 508. Or at least, not for very long. The theory it's put into the oil for verification in the event of oil related failure is blown way out of proportion. The dye usually dissipates within a short time and is no longer visible. Now if your referring to a marker in the oil, that would be the zirconium additive. It does help with compliance, but the other way around than is normally thought, ie; that 508 is used in older engines and causes damage or failure.

Must be raining conspiracy in London.

So what do you think the reason for the massive cost difference between 502/504 and 508/509?

Is that a conspiracy?

I never realised American Mechanics were so stupid they couldn’t read the side of an oil can….

 

[bigjl]

Exactly correct and VAG noted this.

This has been explained to that poster multiple times. Yet he keeps posting the same garbage over and over.

You do realise the World is a big place?

And 508/509 was always green.

So are you saying that VAG engineers knew that American Mechanics would struggle to tell the difference between different oils before the engine was sold in the USA!

Amazing

 

[bigjl]

Let’s not forget the comments on the previous 508/509 thread where kschachn reckoned the clearly green oil was blue.

Luckily back in 2018 Wemay had the correct opinion.

It was done to ensure people didn’t use the wrong oil, but not because American Mechanics struggled to read the bottle.

But rather so they could bond Warranties of people who think they know better.

What is the PAO of 508/509 when compared to older specs……