2001 Suburban 5.3L 130K 0W-30 TSO Amsoil 9,812 mi.

[cfromc]

This oil was put in at a little over 120K and taken out at exactly 130,000.0 miles. It is the Amsoil 0W-30 Series 2000. The filter is an Amsoil EaO30 which is a little longer than the OEM spec'd filter. There are a lot of variables with this OCI but I ran the sample anyway just to see how the oil held up. There was a K&N air filter installed for the first 7,000 miles until I took it out and replaced it with an AC Delco paper element. I also added 6 ounces of VSOT at 7,000 miles. So the new air filter and the VSOT were in for about 3,000 miles. The truck was used for a mix of highway and city for the first 7K and mostly highway on vacation for the last 3K.

The sample did not look bad except the TBN was depleted and I think I reached the limit of the oil in this V8 engine. I left the filter in but changed the oil to Amsoil ASL 5 qts and the rest VP racing 5W-30. Universal averages were for wear levels after an average of 5,085 miles:
Sample/Universal
Al 5/4
Chr 1/2
Fe 22/24
Copper 9/64
Lead 18/9
Tin 0/1
Mo 65/50
Nickel 1/1
Manganese 1/2
Silver 0/0
Ti 0/0
Potasium 3/1
Boron 11/57
Silicon 13/13 (surprised not higher due to K&N)
Sodium 9/9
Calcium 2651/1680
Magnesium 16/387
Phos 599/789
Zinc 725/955
Barium 0/0

SUS visc 66.3/55-67
Flashpoint 380/>375
Fuel Antifreeze 0/0
Water 0/0
Insolubules .3/ TBN 1.0

I am switching to ASL 5W-30 for one run then I will either go to HDD 5W-30, ATM 10W-30, or XL 10W-30. Originally I was thinking about running one year (15K) on this oil but, after listening to advice on BITOG I decided to only go 10K and then to run this sample. I think that was good advice since it appears 10K is about the limit with this engine (just due to the low TBN). I would like to run the HDD but I doubt if I would get too much more than 10K out of it but I still may run it.

Overall, I think it looks like a pretty good UOA for 10K miles although I think it might not have looked as good if I went much past 10K. I'm a little surprised at the low TBN though.

 

[cfromc]

Forgot to add, I used approximately .5qt of make-up oil.

 

[Donald]

I would think you should plan on not running your next oil down to a TBN of 1.0. You have a mix of stuff in the current change, some old oil left in the filter, mostly Amsoil ASL and some racing oil that I assume is non synthetic.

Amsoil ASL in theory will not run as long as the Amsoil Series 2000.

You might consider taking a sample (via pump) at 7500 and see how things look.

 

[ConfederateTyrant]

Keep a check on your sodium and potassium levels, as it could indicate a slight coolant leak, which will indeed deplete the TBN rapidly. Amsoil has 2-4 ppm of sodium and 0 ppm of potatssium in it, or at least it used to.

The HDD 5w-30 would most likely last longer than this, as it is better designed to handle the contamination of V8 engines. But that will only happen as long as you do not have any coolant ingestion, or other issues.

Do another sample between 5,000-7,500 miles.

 

[jmac]

Nobody has mentioned the lead reading as well in this, which is higher than it should be. and with the VSOT all of the additive levels seem low, I wouldn't expect the TBN to be so far down, so maybe a coolant weep in the head gasket? Something seem snot quite right here, definately shorten the OCI.

 

[Steve S]

I thought the oil was guaranteed for up 35,000 miles? what is up?

 

[buster]

Yeah were is TimVipond? This $9+ qt of oil rarely looks good at 15k miles let alone 35k miles. He did add VSOT which would void the Amsoil warranty and a small coolant lead could potentially exist. I would also run a treatment of autoRx on this engine before extending drains.

 

[Pablo]

What kind of driving? Why the VSOT?

In ideal cases the oil warranty is 35K miles. In some cases it's 6 months. No warranty with a coolant leak.

I rarely recommend TSO. And almost never in a GM V8. For sure never in a GM V8 that does any city driving.

 

[Steve S]

Quote:

---

What kind of driving? Why the VSOT?

In ideal cases the oil warranty is 35K miles. In some cases it's 6 months. No warranty with a coolant leak.

I rarely recommend TSO. And almost never in a GM V8. For sure never in a GM V8 that does any city driving.

---

An ideal case warranty is like no warranty at all.

 

[TeeDub]

If you want to compare various Amsoil formulations, I'd leave the oil additives like VSOT out of the sump. I don't like the Pb levels here and the additive may be contributing to the bearing wear. You are not going to improve any fully formulated lube by dumping in a bottle of snake oil and trying to play organic chemist in your garage....

I would stick with the paper filters, or an Amsoil EAA air filter. I think you can get these Si levels < 10 ppm and drive down the Fe/Cr/Ni a bit more.

I"d expect the results with the HDD to be at least as good, with perhaps better TBN retention. I think you can get 12,000 miles out of the HDD in this motor.

 

[cfromc]

I'll try to answer some of questions here, and I have one or two of my own. First, I would never plan to run any oil to 1.0 TBN, I'd say about around 2.0 is when I'd start to think about changing the oil, I will be monitoring this until I find an oil that consistently performs (or fix any problems I find). The VP racing is a group V synthetic and I only "topped" if off with it since it needed a little over the 5 full qts to be full. Why VP and why VSOT for that matter? Because the engine seems to like moly and reward me with a little better MPG-or maybe the VSOT thickens the oil up enough to where the engine likes it. I plan on using a thicker oil next time to test that theory. (FYI, IIRC, the VSOT thickens it up into the next grade-I did run the viscocity calculator but I forget the result off the top of my head). Also, keep in mind that I only added 6oz., not the whole bottle, I believe this only gave most of the additives a slight boost, and delivered about the exact amount of moly, in ppm, that the UOA indicated.

I just don't see the coolant leak at all-the sodium is equal to the UA, potassium is 3ppm, the antifreeze shows zero, and the flashpoint and viscocity do not seem to be affected. Also, I changed the coolant about 1 year ago and have lost none since.

The driving habits during this OCI are listed in the OP. As far as the lead, well I don't know, but I did forget to mention that I used Lucas UCL in nearly every tank of gas at the recommended dosage (or a little less) of 3 oz. per 10 gallons. I have changed the filter to a paper element, although the K&N was there for 70% of this OCI, yet the silicon was equal to the UA and not more as would be expected. I still plan to use either AC Delco's or the Amsoil EAAs from now on though since I did not lose any MPG with the change and this is not a performance vehicle.

I know there IS a lot of snake oil out there but I happen to believe that VSOT is not snake oil. Having said that, if I find an oil that the engine seems to like as well as after I add VSOT to the thinner oils, I will no longer use it. I'm really leaning toward a thicker oil since the engine seems to respond better as I move to thicker 5W-30s and worse when I use thin 5W-30s/0W-30a. I really don't think this is a bad UOA except for the lead and I'm wondering if 18ppm is really that bad. My question is, could the Lucas UCL have caused the lead? Also, of the three mentioned oils: 10W-30 ATM, 10W-30 XL, or 5W-30 HDD, which would be recommended for 10K changes? I know the HDD is probably the best, but is it really needed? Or, perhaps it is time to move to a thin 40 weight. I can tell already from the current mix that it does not like the ASL/VP racing mix (no VSOT yet) as the engine is slightly noisier and runs a little rougher. Its too early to say about the MPG but it doesn't look good so far.

BTW, the 25K or 35K warranty was never any consideration by me when choosing an oil. I want an oil that meets my requirements and have never wanted to rely on an oil warranty with all of its (possible) associated headaches. If I really were worried about warranty coverage I would have followed Amsoil's requirements to the letter and then run the oil for 35,000 miles. As we know, very few cars and drivers can take any oil (excluding diesels) out to 35,000 miles. I would have been happy with 15K, but with a gas V8 with 130K, I will be satisfied with 10K and 20K filter changes.

P.S. Thanks for all of your comments

 

[TimVipond]

TimVipond was enjoying a motorcycle trip in Arkansas with 11 buddies.

A few thing I notice.
1. Amsoil oil itself is not warranted. Only the parts and labor should it fail. They didn't. Nothing broke and wear metals look good.
2. The Amsoil warranty is good for 1 year maximum in this case, unless it was recommended he go further by the oil analysis as he would not achieve 35,000 miles.
3. Amsoil recommends in engines with over 100,000 miles, that for the first use it be considered severe mileage as it needs to cope with whatever was in there before so it would max out at 17,500 miles or 1 year, whichever is first.
4. I'm sure the K&N filter did not help with oil life. Paper is better for filtration.
5. Amsoil does not recommend additives to the oil. Not desired or needed.
The oil did it's job, just like Amsoil said it would.

 

[TeeDub]

The Series 3000 is about 10% thicker than the Amsoil 0w-30 or 5w-30, so you may find it quiets down the engine a bit. Since it's diesel formulation it does not contain moly or boron, but does have very high levels of ZDDP and calcium detergent/dispersant.

Lead is not that bad for a V-8 after 10k miles, however I generally like to see Pb < 50% of the Fe levels in a normal analysis. Overuse of strong fuel additive can cause an increase in Pb levels, so that may be a contributing factor here.

TS