What Exactly Makes An Oil "European Formula"

[OVERKILL]

On the D-4S engine:
https://www.motorreviewer.com/engine.php?engine_id=127

The oil system was also upgraded. The main innovation is the second generation variable-pressure oil pump controlled by ECM electronics.

ECM controlled (dual-stage pressure) does not equal electric and of course is exceedingly common nowadays from all marques.

It has, unexpectedly, a traditional crank-driven oil pump:

But, I'm unsurprised that this claim, like all the others, was excrement.

 

[930.engineering]

ECM controlled (dual-stage pressure) does not equal electric and of course is exceedingly common nowadays from all marques.
But, I'm unsurprised that this claim, like all the others, was excrement.

I couldn't agree more, exactly what's to be expected. Thanks!
.

 

[930.engineering]

Just like all Yaris (not Mazda 2) already come with Radar cruise control, peditrian detection, etc. as standard.

It was standard on my GTI when I custom ordered it in 2017 and you'll have
a very hard time finding any European car without pedestrian detection etc.
today. That's definitely not something the Japanese are ahead.
In 2012 the VW Golf VII started with (optional at that time) ACC (radar-based
adaptive cuise control), DCC suspension, adaptive headlights (permanent high
beam with dazzling oncoming traffic) and many more safety tech. I don't think
any Corolla/Civic etc. of that time came with that. Audi has used electronically
controlled thermostats and oil pumps at least since 2011 btw. and these were
also used in any Golf Mk VII, regardless if it has a EA211, EA888 3G or a EA288
TDI engine under its hood.
.

 

[yowps3]

Lol. Tells us which Japanese cars are “smoother” than European models?
I will take my BMW or VW (especially BMW, and that one has track suspension) on a road trip anytime over my Toyota minivan.

Even pedestrian cars like Camry's /Corollas are smoother.
Every German car I've ever driven is more or less the same with those unnecessarily strange quirks, or should I say German way of doing things.

The 2012 Lexus IS350 has an ultra smooth power train, goes fast, rides smooth yet handles well and is comfortable.
Similar year BMW 3 series is not the same. In fact that same generation Lexus was released since 2005 with dual injection. Way ahead of its time.

Same with transmissions - Aisin was the first to release the 8 speed back in 2005. Yet in typical Aisin fashion, it's silky smooth with a flawless reliability record.

The European ZF 8 speed released years later has been plagued with issues.

 

[rondhol]

It was standard on my GTI when I custom ordered it in 2017 and you'll have
a very hard time finding any European car without pedestrian detection etc.
today. That's definitely not something the Japanese are ahead.
In 2012 the VW Golf VII started with (optional at that time) ACC (radar-based
adaptive cuise control), DCC suspension, adaptive headlights (permanent high
beam with dazzling oncoming traffic) and many more safety tech. I don't think
any Corolla/Civic etc. of that time came with that. Audi has used electronically
controlled thermostats and oil pumps at least since 2011 btw. and these were
also used in any Golf Mk VII, regardless if it has a EA211, EA888 3G or a EA288
TDI engine under its hood.
.

GTI is $35k plus, Yaris hybrid is $20k. You need to compare to Polo or Golf with 1.0 TSI that still use primitive Torsion beam suspension today. All civic and corolla now use independence rear suspension. Corolla qlso come with safety sense 2 as standard, other often need to pay extra for that.
For the same price, you get much better quality and durability from any Honda, Mazda, Toyota, KIA/Hyundai or Subaru.
Take a look KBB value after 4 or 5 years old. Those brands are more valuable %wise than any Germans or GM/Crysler and sold in real market above internet price .
Those are based on statistical number. Only fools buying German cars more than 200k miles, ups I meant 100k miles. Meanwhile, Toyota or Honda are still sold easily at that mileages, especially Truck and SUV.
The fact that more than 80% of Toyota/HOnda older than 20 years old still roaming around is undeniable. There are more European cars in junkyards than on the road after 10 years. BEcause they are indeed junks and loved by junkies.

Back to EUROPEAN OIL, It is great and can save these junks long enough before it falls apart.

Funny enough, TESLA took over BMW 3 and Benz C in Europe because TESLA has the same principle to build car with motors, gears, and internal parts to last 1 million miles. Not like ID3, 4, or Ugliest of all BMW i3.
Yaris is no. 2 in sub-compact defeating everything but Peugeot 208. It is offered only 1 type, Hybrid 1.5L. People in the world are generally smart. Only a few fools are still in denials.
https://carsalesbase.com/european-sales-2021-first-half-subcompact-cars/
https://carsalesbase.com/european-sales-2021-first-half-midsized-cars/

In America, the number is even scarier for European junkies.
https://carsalesbase.com/us-car-sales-analysis-2021-q1-q3-midsized-cars/
https://carsalesbase.com/us-car-sales-analysis-2021-q1-q3-midsized-cars/
https://carsalesbase.com/us-car-sales-2021-q1-q3-compact-cars/

 

[rondhol]

On the D-4S engine:
https://www.motorreviewer.com/engine.php?engine_id=127


ECM controlled (dual-stage pressure) does not equal electric and of course is exceedingly common nowadays from all marques.

It has, unexpectedly, a traditional crank-driven oil pump:

But, I'm unsurprised that this claim, like all the others, was excrement.

On the D-4S engine:
https://www.motorreviewer.com/engine.php?engine_id=127


ECM controlled (dual-stage pressure) does not equal electric and of course is exceedingly common nowadays from all marques.

It has, unexpectedly, a traditional crank-driven oil pump:

But, I'm unsurprised that this claim, like all the others, was excrement.

I am glad it still used a true and tested mechanical oil pump system, only some parts are upgraded with controllable durable mechanism via ECU. Otherwise, it cannot be used as an Official UN SUV for the warzone. The reliability of the Land Cruiser cannot be compromised, unlike X5, Range Rover, or GLS that can be used only during warranty period. The one in 2.5L is similar to the one in Land Cruiser. Not so cheap SUV.

 

[2EHA]

Same with transmissions - Aisin was the first to release the 8 speed back in 2005. Yet in typical Aisin fashion, it's silky smooth with a flawless reliability record.

The European ZF 8 speed released years later has been plagued with issues.

opinion discarded

 

[mightymousetech]

The European ZF 8 speed released years later has been plagued with issues.

Uh, what? In what vehicles? Please, enlighten me.

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

Even pedestrian cars like Camry's /Corollas are smoother.
Every German car I've ever driven is more or less the same with those unnecessarily strange quirks, or should I say German way of doing things.

The 2012 Lexus IS350 has an ultra smooth power train, goes fast, rides smooth yet handles well and is comfortable.
Similar year BMW 3 series is not the same. In fact that same generation Lexus was released since 2005 with dual injection. Way ahead of its time.

Same with transmissions - Aisin was the first to release the 8 speed back in 2005. Yet in typical Aisin fashion, it's silky smooth with a flawless reliability record.

The European ZF 8 speed released years later has been plagued with issues.

GTI is $35k plus, Yaris hybrid is $20k. You need to compare to Polo or Golf with 1.0 TSI that still use primitive Torsion beam suspension today. All civic and corolla now use independence rear suspension. Corolla qlso come with safety sense 2 as standard, other often need to pay extra for that.
For the same price, you get much better quality and durability from any Honda, Mazda, Toyota, KIA/Hyundai or Subaru.
Take a look KBB value after 4 or 5 years old. Those brands are more valuable %wise than any Germans or GM/Crysler and sold in real market above internet price .
Those are based on statistical number. Only fools buying German cars more than 200k miles, ups I meant 100k miles. Meanwhile, Toyota or Honda are still sold easily at that mileages, especially Truck and SUV.
The fact that more than 80% of Toyota/HOnda older than 20 years old still roaming around is undeniable. There are more European cars in junkyards than on the road after 10 years. BEcause they are indeed junks and loved by junkies.

Back to EUROPEAN OIL, It is great and can save these junks long enough before it falls apart.

Funny enough, TESLA took over BMW 3 and Benz C in Europe because TESLA has the same principle to build car with motors, gears, and internal parts to last 1 million miles. Not like ID3, 4, or Ugliest of all BMW i3.
Yaris is no. 2 in sub-compact defeating everything but Peugeot 208. It is offered only 1 type, Hybrid 1.5L. People in the world are generally smart. Only a few fools are still in denials.
https://carsalesbase.com/european-sales-2021-first-half-subcompact-cars/
https://carsalesbase.com/european-sales-2021-first-half-midsized-cars/

In America, the number is even scarier for European junkies.
https://carsalesbase.com/us-car-sales-analysis-2021-q1-q3-midsized-cars/
https://carsalesbase.com/us-car-sales-analysis-2021-q1-q3-midsized-cars/
https://carsalesbase.com/us-car-sales-2021-q1-q3-compact-cars/

Did you even read what you posted?

All the euros were doing well, even with models which are on their way out (IE. C-class).

 

[rondhol]

Did you even read what you posted?

All the euros were doing well, even with models which are on their way out (IE. C-class).

I read tables not comments. All midsize european cars combined is still less than Accord sale alone in America.

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

I read tables not comments. All midsize european cars combined is still less than Accord sale alone in America.

Of course they would be. The Accord is 33% cheaper and consequently has a wider pool of customers to pull from.

 

[OVERKILL]

Same with transmissions - Aisin was the first to release the 8 speed back in 2005. Yet in typical Aisin fashion, it's silky smooth with a flawless reliability record.

The European ZF 8 speed released years later has been plagued with issues.

You have that reversed. Toyota has had a horrible time with programming on their 8spd, whereas the ZF8 has been bomb-proof and put behind applications making north of 800HP.

Now, the ZF 9spd had some early teething pains in both Honda and Jeep applications in case you might have been confused...

 

[OVERKILL]

I am glad it still used a true and tested mechanical oil pump system, only some parts are upgraded with controllable durable mechanism via ECU. Otherwise, it cannot be used as an Official UN SUV for the warzone. The reliability of the Land Cruiser cannot be compromised, unlike X5, Range Rover, or GLS that can be used only during warranty period. The one in 2.5L is similar to the one in Land Cruiser. Not so cheap SUV.

Dude, you completely lied, again. You've manufactured the vast majority of your "facts" in this thread and have now gone as far as calling people who buy European cars "junkies":

There are more European cars in junkyards than on the road after 10 years. BEcause they are indeed junks and loved by junkies.

You've passed trolling and are now trawling.

 

[rondhol]

We should stop, and back to the topic. I am amused enough with the responds. No need to argue.

My point is simpe, European oil is great. use it if it is cheap enough. Does not matter what grade, 0w-20 or 0w-50 as long as the viscousity match.

ZF is a great company especially the torque converter ZF8HP, just like Aisin with 10 speed and its ancient E-CVT.

We are glad that American consumer can get a free replacement from Ford Direct Shxt transmission, problematic DSG, Toyota unintended acceleration, Hyundai granaded engines, cheating TDI, and other kind of defects by manufacturer.

We should work together and support all manufacturers making better, reliable, and more fun cars by buying what we like and hit hard when they made problematic products

 

[930.engineering]

GTI is $35k plus, Yaris hybrid is $20k. You need to compare to Polo or Golf with 1.0 TSI that still use primitive Torsion beam suspension today. All civic and corolla now use independence rear suspension. Corolla qlso come with safety sense 2 as standard, other often need to pay extra for that.

While you do a citation of my post you seem to have passed on reading it.
I didn't talk about the GTI only, I provided an example of the Golf MkVII in
general when it was released in 2012. That said, even the Polo comes with
"Front Assist"as standard, which is front collision warning and emergency
braking along with pedestrian detection.
Now as you seem to realize that safety features actually aren't a weak point
on German cars contrary to your former claim, you are trying to muddy things
with switching to rear axles. Are you actually claiming suspension being a weak
pont on German cars? It's getting even more funny then....

For the same price, you get much better quality and durability from any Honda, Mazda, Toyota, KIA/Hyundai or Subaru.
Take a look KBB value after 4 or 5 years old. Those brands are more valuable %wise than any Germans or GM/Crysler and sold in real market above internet price .
Those are based on statistical number.

Look for values in Europe. It's contrary. My conclusion is that depreciation
has less to do with technical quality but more so with image. Japanese lost
market share in Europe in recent 25 years, probably because they're no more
cheaper. There share was substituted by Korean and Skoda, Seat and French.

Only fools buying German cars more than 200k miles, ups I meant 100k miles.

You're kind of brave at least getting that personal and perhaps banned
from this forum.

BEcause they are indeed junks and loved by junkies.

Haters gonna hate!

Back to EUROPEAN OIL, It is great and can save these junks long enough before it falls apart.

Well, thanks to your great contribution nobody's gonna want to go back to
any oil discussion. It's just pointless as long as you're here.

Why don't/can't you just admit that you were wrong with that idiotic 'electric
oilpump'?
.

 

[rondhol]

It is indeed funny, Corolla and Hyundai Elantra used to have a torsion beam before 2019, just like lower-trim Golf. Only higher trim Golf with 1.4TSI or higher now gets full independence rear suspension.
We are in a free world, I prefer the current American-made Civic, Corolla, ancient 4runner, Accord, or large 35MPG hybrid minivan for simple durability reasons. The improvements in safety standards and rear independent suspensions are welcomed.

Unfortunately, newer cars in the USA use 0W-16, not so easy to find them from European ACEA certified oil.

 

[kschachn]

Unfortunately, newer cars in the USA use 0W-16, not so easy to find them from European ACEA certified oil.

They may recommend that (per their CAFE award letter requirements) but it won't say an oil grade is a new-car warranty. There's no reason you have to use the grade they list.

 

[edyvw]

Even pedestrian cars like Camry's /Corollas are smoother.
Every German car I've ever driven is more or less the same with those unnecessarily strange quirks, or should I say German way of doing things.

The 2012 Lexus IS350 has an ultra smooth power train, goes fast, rides smooth yet handles well and is comfortable.
Similar year BMW 3 series is not the same. In fact that same generation Lexus was released since 2005 with dual injection. Way ahead of its time.

Same with transmissions - Aisin was the first to release the 8 speed back in 2005. Yet in typical Aisin fashion, it's silky smooth with a flawless reliability record.

The European ZF 8 speed released years later has been plagued with issues.

Lol what?
Have you ever paid attention on Toyota’s debacle with Aisin 8 speed in Highlander, Sienna?
What “issues” ZF8 has? Tell us please, bcs. ZF8 is most widely used transmission in the world.
Number of fears is not indicative of performance or progress. ZF6 is more stout transmission than Aisin 8 speed in Lexus. GM 6 speed has better performance in many vehicles than Aisin 8 speed. BMW is no stranger to buying Aisin, GM. Yet in Rolls Royce they went GM some time ago NOT Aisin. BMW for example uses Aisin in its “fake” BMW’s (FWD platforms) and unlike Toyota never had issue with it.
What power smoothness you are talking about? 2GR-FKS engines have some of the narrowest torque band of all similar engines. I will take Lexus IS350, overweight, understeer monster (somehow it understeers same like Audi which is FWD platform) with my 328 anytime you want.
Smoothness in Camry? My Raynolds aluminum foil is thicker than body on Camry. Suspension is as simple McPhearson as possible. My Sienna on that platform crashes over bumps etc. like it doesn’t have dampers (actually at 80k they are leaking).
So spare me that BS about Toyota. Don’t forget that Toyota is using BMW engines, not other way around.

 

[sohccammer427]

Take 0W20 as it's pretty much the new CAFE oil. I'd say there's no difference in a Dexos1 gen 3 and the ACEA C5/C6 in terms of specs. Interchangeable.

 

[mightymousetech]

Man, this thread is a train wreck.