Varnish Article

[JAG]

Here's another article.
http://www.practicingoilanalysis.com/art...oup=OilAnalysis

According to the link below, dispersants help control varnish and sludge caused by low temp operations better than metallic based detergents. I found that interesting.
http://www.lubrizol.com/LubeTheory/prop.asp
"Dispersants

A major development in the additive field was the discovery and use of ashless dispersants. These materials may be categorized into two broad types: high-molecular weight polymeric dispersants used to formulate multigrade oils and lower molecular weight additives for use where viscosity modification is not necessary. These additives are much more effective than the metallic types in controlling sludge and varnish deposits that result from intermittent and low-temperature gasoline engine operation."

 

[buster]

http://theoildrop.server101.com/forums/s...9506#Post959643

Molekule just posted a good article on varnish.

 

[JAG]

Cool, I'll check it out. Thanks buster.

 

[ericthepig]

I recently chged the oil in my mom's '98 Ford Taurus (brought an oil sample home and finally sent it to Black Stone last Sat. - will post the results - 1 yr/~10k on M1 EP) - I think this is the fourth year I've chg her oil (using M1 10w30 and 10w30 EP - 1 yr/7-10k OCIs). Anyway, I realize that the consensus is that a Synth won't do much w/ varnish, BUT I'm almost positive that when I started this process, the shelf that you pour the oil on was varnished. I really think I remember wondering if the Synth would have any affect on it. Last yr and this yr I noticed that that piece of metal is PERFECT. I mean it looks like the last thing that touched it was a Ford robot. It's a shinny, almost mirror like piece of stainless looking metal - and it looks like factory stainless steal - kid you not!! This is normally an area on engines that doesn't get much oil flow and is therefore crusty carbonization (as w/ my other cars). The metal was so clean that I took a picture of it - if I can figure out how to post pics, I will do so when I post the UOA results.

Also, the dipstick on my Sienna (which has seen 80k of M1 reg. and EP) is perfect (except it may be just a touch discolered at the edge of the meter bumps - hard to tell - otherwise zero discoloration). My Toyota mech also told me my engine was clean - they've been under the valve cover and timing belt area (I wish I would've gone over there and looked when they had it broken down). All this on a Sienna that's not supposed to be breathing right. Yet I may have gummed oil springs.

 

[JAG]

I believe you Eric. I'm 100% sure that some synthetics in some engines can clean up some of the old deposits.

 

[BrianWC]

If you have the oil, I have the engine. Not saying it didn't work for anyone else but EP was the first oil I used in my saab.....Didn't do much for me....

I guess I'll be using M1 0W40 next, lol....But not without arx....

 

[JAG]

I believe you too Brian. This matter isn't as simple as whether salt dissolves in water!

 

[ericthepig]

I'm wondering if it's that particular type of metal - you don't often see what looks like stainless steel inside an engine. Perhaps Ford put it there on purpose (to give a prestine feel), and perhaps the type of metal is known for staying relatively clean of varnish w/ any kind of proper maint (my mom bought it w/ ~60k - no idea of previous maint). Just some thoughts. Meanwhile my other two vehicles appear to have iron hot plates as the oil shelf.

 

[G-MAN]

Quote:

---

I've yet to see a "normal" engine ran with short OCIs on dino that looked clean inside after 100,000 miles.

---

Well, you should have seen my 86 Honda Civic. It had a 110,000 miles on it when I sold it. The oil used since new was Quaker State 10w30 (SuperBlend) at 5000 mile OCIs. Under the valve cover was absolutely pristine with no varnish, sludge, or anything. The aluminum was as bright as factory new.

 

[ericthepig]

This varnish vs. oil vs. engine vs. mileage issue seems inordinately convoluted. No ones thinking gremlins are they?

 

[JAG]

Things get even more convoluted when you read this thread below. Low group number basestocks can create more varnish particles than higher ones (except Group 5) but keep more of them in solution rather than falling out and sticking to surfaces. But additives have a huge effect too so don't conclude that we should be using cheap Group 1-based motor oils. Plus an engine environment is different than other environments like occured in the test below. But it does show how funky nature is.

http://theoildrop.server101.com/forums/s...ge=0#Post794605

 

[ericthepig]

Pity the poor guy that never ventured over a 3k OCI w/ his trusted dino, and oft told others of his convictions. Only to take his car to the mech at 100k for a valve adjustment - and to be told "you're valves are ready. BTW, you really should start changing your oil at 3k."

 

[Steve S]

GPI oils are the bottom of the barrel when it comes to crud deposits .After seeing the results of well additized GPII {+?} oils "HDEO's" at work I quit using syn oils . And haven't looked back. Although when syn is recommended or required I use it.