US probes electronics in Toyota recall.

[crinkles]

Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Yeah Bubba and Jim-Bob are lucky to be able to tie their own shoes in the morning let alone assemble a gas pedal for a superior company like Toyota

It amazes me that the SR-71 was able to get off the ground with all its inferior American engineering; it would have done Mach 30 with some Japanese engines in there..... Too bad it had to have Pratt & Whittney.

And then we talk about COMPUTER hardware? I'm amazed Toyota hasn't developed a CPU to obsolete everything "dumb 'ol American Intel" has developed in the last decade, since they obviously have the superior Japanese engineering advantage....

Yeah, we are all just a bunch of bumbling retards on this continent who've managed to be leaders in Aerospace, computing power, and networking equipment..... I can't wait for the Japanese to teach Cisco a lesson.

don't be so sensitive.

the faults could have been from a six sigma engineer just pushing things a bit far to make an extra penny. in the western world, that is the norm. in japan, you're expected to fall on your sword (literally) if you are to blame for any kind of stuff up of this scale..

 

[KrisZ]

Originally Posted By: crinkles
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Yeah Bubba and Jim-Bob are lucky to be able to tie their own shoes in the morning let alone assemble a gas pedal for a superior company like Toyota

It amazes me that the SR-71 was able to get off the ground with all its inferior American engineering; it would have done Mach 30 with some Japanese engines in there..... Too bad it had to have Pratt & Whittney.

And then we talk about COMPUTER hardware? I'm amazed Toyota hasn't developed a CPU to obsolete everything "dumb 'ol American Intel" has developed in the last decade, since they obviously have the superior Japanese engineering advantage....

Yeah, we are all just a bunch of bumbling retards on this continent who've managed to be leaders in Aerospace, computing power, and networking equipment..... I can't wait for the Japanese to teach Cisco a lesson.

don't be so sensitive.

the faults could have been from a six sigma engineer just pushing things a bit far to make an extra penny. in the western world, that is the norm. in japan, you're expected to fall on your sword (literally) if you are to blame for any kind of stuff up of this scale..

I think OVERK1LL is right on the money, why should the American or Canadian worker take the blame for Japanese penny pinching, especially when there is no proof of supplier wrong doing.

Oversensitive, tell that to Toyota apologists trying to blame everybody but Toyota.

 

[Nick R]

Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Yeah Bubba and Jim-Bob are lucky to be able to tie their own shoes in the morning let alone assemble a gas pedal for a superior company like Toyota

It amazes me that the SR-71 was able to get off the ground with all its inferior American engineering; it would have done Mach 30 with some Japanese engines in there..... Too bad it had to have Pratt & Whittney.

And then we talk about COMPUTER hardware? I'm amazed Toyota hasn't developed a CPU to obsolete everything "dumb 'ol American Intel" has developed in the last decade, since they obviously have the superior Japanese engineering advantage....

Yeah, we are all just a bunch of bumbling retards on this continent who've managed to be leaders in Aerospace, computing power, and networking equipment..... I can't wait for the Japanese to teach Cisco a lesson.

LMAO. +1 million

There are so many "The Japanese are gods" people out there that it makes me sick. Face it, toyota screwed up. They tried to save a buck and it turned around and bit them on the rear end. Don't blame the supplier, toyota designed the part and submitted it to them. Enough with all this "American/Canadian stuff is inferior" bull. We have Boeing, best commercial jets in the world. We have General Electric who makes Jet engines, Light bulbs, Naval Nuclear Reactors (The reactors in all US Submarines and Nuclear ships are GE designed and manufactured), we have General Dynamics whoes Electric Boat division builds the quietest and best Nuclear submarines in the world. We have the numerous Naval yards that build the best naval ships in the world.

We have Intel, AMD, NVIDIA, Western Digital, Goodyear, and a thousand more companies that make quality products.

 

[Durango]

As reported by the newspaper the electronics is the real cause of crashes but Toyota seems to have a track record of covering it up. Their flag ship cars is heavily controled by on-board computers.

So they replace the gas pedals. Toyota better be prepared for a wild ride.

 

[ARB1977]

This was my first thought from day one.

 

[VNTS]

Originally Posted By: PT1
I see a government that owns 2 car companies attacking the competition.

The resident toyota kool aid drinker pops in on queu LOL

I hope the Feds make sure that Toy does not do some secret Flash on the computers while they put the metal part on the gas pedal.

Toyota has a sleazy history of hiding things and does the secret recalls so they dont get burned in the public eyes.

Also I think toyota cars are better today, just that they are nothing special, oh their cars from the 90s were rot buckets up here, my family had bought Corrollas, Camrys and the joke SR5's. All I can say is they had more issues than the domestics in our family and throw in Toytota's body integrity issues with rust, they never impressed me.

 

[brianl703]

Originally Posted By: JDD
Electronics do not pull the pedal down unless cruise is on


I guess you're not familiar with drive by wire systems, because that's not how the cruise control works in those. The pedal doesn't move in a drive-by-wire system with cruise control on.

 

[CROWNVIC4LIFE]

Originally Posted By: ARB1977
This was my first thought from day one.


+1

I think the bulk of the people here did also.

 

[brianl703]

Oh, BTW, my Saab 93 uses a dual potentiometer on the gas pedal, not a hall effect sensor. I wonder how many DBW implementations besides Toyotas use a hall-effect sensor?

 

[Kiwi_ME]

Originally Posted By: brianl703
... Saab 93 uses a dual potentiometer
So does my Suzuki. There are comments here about a business (Empire Performance and Off-road) that tried influencing the Toyota pedal with a magnetic field. The home page is here.

 

[caravanmike]

Originally Posted By: PT1
I see a government that owns 2 car companies attacking the competition.

i did see black helicopters over the camry plant last week! anybody seen my tin foil hat?

 

[Challenger71]

Customers who have experienced accidents. For the one fortunate soul who lived to tell, the one gentelman toward the end of this slideshow, he seems 100% confident his foot was on the brake pedal. I now wonder why there have been so many stories of vehicles ramming thru through the front of convenience stores and businesses.Connection?

http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/RunawayToyotas/slideshow?id=8978778

 

[Win]

Originally Posted By: brianl703
Oh, BTW, my Saab 93 uses a dual potentiometer on the gas pedal, not a hall effect sensor.


Looks to be the same on my G8 with the 3.6L high feature V6 (only set of service manuals I keep here at the office).

Each potentiometer has its own discrete 5 volt reference as an extra redundancy (sp?).

Looks to be about a five minute job to replace the accelerator pedal position sensor should the need ever arise.

The hall effect setup looks like a bad idea done badly and it would be interesting to know who else specified this type of a design.

 

[PT1]

Originally Posted By: rudolphna
Originally Posted By: PT1
I see a government that owns 2 car companies attacking the competition.


So the NHTSA was wrong to force Toyota to recall those cars, and to investigate further to make sure they aren't pulling the wool over our eyes to save money? (As many large companies have done in the past to save a buck)


I never said that you did.

 

[PT1]

Originally Posted By: Rickey
Originally Posted By: PT1
The denso ETC unit in my Toyotas has no steel plate. You might be onto something.

I have read UE reports concerning Denso equipped vehicles as well.

IMHO the problem is the lack of a cross check circuit.
Leaving out the cross check saves money per vehicle and compromises safety in a very bad way.
(Deceased drivers do not testify against the car manufacturer.)

There are no bad denso ETC's in the recall sense.

 

[brianl703]

I was thinking that the hall effect sensor would never wear out...BUT the rest of the pedal would. (This is aside from the issue of hall effect sensor glitches due to external magnetic/electric fields or other reasons).

The dual potentiometers will wear out, but so will the rest of the pedal. Ideally, you'd want the dual potentiometers to wear out first, so that you get a check engine light before a pedal with worn bushings that freezes and won't return.

 

[Win]

Originally Posted By: brianl703
I was thinking that the hall effect sensor would never wear out...BUT the rest of the pedal would.


Agreed. The only possible benefit I can think of from this type of setup would be the potential longevity of the hall effect sensor and cheaper manufacturing and assembly cost to the maker.

That's why I looked at the replacement procedure the for the dual pot system. It looks to be about a five minute job.

A cheapo non redundant setup probably will not play out very well in a courtroom when benchmarked against a better system like GM's.

 

[Rickey]

Originally Posted By: Win
Originally Posted By: brianl703
I was thinking that the hall effect sensor would never wear out...BUT the rest of the pedal would.


Agreed. The only possible benefit I can think of from this type of setup would be the potential longevity of the hall effect sensor and cheaper manufacturing and assembly cost to the maker.

That's why I looked at the replacement procedure the for the dual pot system. It looks to be about a five minute job.

A cheapo non redundant setup probably will not play out very well in a courtroom when benchmarked against a better system like GM's.


+1

 

[PT1]

Originally Posted By: caravanmike
Originally Posted By: PT1
I see a government that owns 2 car companies attacking the competition.


i did see black helicopters over the camry plant last week! anybody seen my tin foil hat?


I see you are a Mopar guy....I used to be one until they hired the guy from Kenworth to design their cars & trucks. Had 3 old style Durangos which were absolutely the very best vehicles. Reliable, trouble free, low cost, drove through anything, then they sold the company to the Germans and all went down the toilet. Too bad.

 

[PT1]

Originally Posted By: caravanmike
Originally Posted By: PT1
I see a government that owns 2 car companies attacking the competition.


i did see black helicopters over the camry plant last week! anybody seen my tin foil hat?


No I meant this way:

WASHINGTON/DETROIT (Reuters) – The Obama administration stepped up the pressure on Toyota Motor Corp on Wednesday to address a range of safety issues as investors and consumers reacted to the deepening crisis for the world's largest automaker.

"Our ... people will hold Toyota's feet to the fire to make sure they are going to do everything they said they were going to do to make the vehicles safe," U.S. Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood said at an appearance in Washington.

LaHood said he would take the unusual step of calling Toyota President Akio Toyoda to emphasise how seriously the Obama administration is taking investigations into reports of uncontrolled acceleration in Toyota vehicles.

Toyota shares hit a new low on LaHood's comments, including a statement he later clarified that had been interpreted as a warning for consumers to stop driving the more than 5 million Toyota vehicles covered by two sweeping recalls.

At Wednesday's low of $71.90 in New York trade, Toyota shares had dropped more than 17 percent since January 26 when it suspended sales of eight models in the United States, including its two most popular cars, the Camry and Corolla. The shares were down 5 percent at $74.24 on Wednesday afternoon.