Under valve cover & sump pictures - 2014 Dodge Durango 174,000 miles total, 34,000 miles on HPL HDEO 5w-20

[wpod]

That would take over $500 for the Baxter kit …
You might say Wayne got his money’s worth already

It wouldn't be about the $$$ cause what is the cost of the UOAs? The bypass would be about seeing how long the oil change interval could be pushed.

 

[wpod]

Nope, not doing it.

You life would be happier with a by pass filter.

 

[4WD]

It wouldn't be about the $$$ cause what is the cost of the UOAs? The bypass would be about seeing how long the oil change interval could be pushed.

Go for it …
I looked hard at the Baxter and only liked the remote kit - but it’s not going to stop that cooler from failing one day … seems inevitable …
Thats what it would take so all in close to a grand …
And it’s the easiest to change filter already …

 

[4WD]

Yes and I've changed the filter every 5k, except the previous change which was 9k. This filter ran for 5k.

Wayne - the filter thread is locked - but was the (failed) filter perhaps the version that replaced this circa 2021 (note the reinforced mesh)

 

[wwillson]

And I hate you for that

Thinking outside the box is a gift, you're welcome!

 

[wwillson]

I’m assuming you sliced prior filters? and this was a big jump in loading?

Yes, you can find all of the filters used in this run in separate threads.

What’s your take on cold weather vs hot weather operating, given what might be 30k OCI’s going forward. I realize this has a heat exchanger on the oil, so oil temperature is pretty well controlled year round—once warmed up—but increasingly cold starts in winter are different than so-so starts in summer. I’m guessing you’d know, if you continue with 5k filter changes, slicing open, and letting that be a guide to things.

I was concerned about cold weather starts and pumpability, since the viscosity was increasing. We did an MRV and found it was still within the 5w spec, which frankly surprised us.

Call me crazy, but at end of life for this engine I’d be more curious about chain guide wear and chain wear (aka “stretching”) than bearing wear and/or crosshatch wear.

I don't believe the Pentastar has had problems with guides or chains. There is a thread about a very high mileage Pentastar that finally had a guide fail. I think it had 650k miles.

 

[wwillson]

You life would be happier with a by pass filter.

Maybe, but I'm not going to find out on this vehicle.

I think you are referring to this adapter?

Pentastar 3.2L and 3.6L 2014 to present. MS-201-BK Cartridge to Spin-on Adapter

Pentastar Cartridge to Spin-On Oil filter adapter fits 2014 + 3.2 and 3.6-liter Pentastar engines. Cartridge Filters have no anti-drainback valve. This product provides faster oil pressure at startup by keeping the upper oil system flooded. The adapter contains full flow check valve and unique...

www.baxterperformanceusa.com

 

[wwillson]

Wayne - the filter thread is locked - but was the (failed) filter perhaps the version that replaced this circa 2021 (note the reinforced mesh)

View attachment 197040

No, the failed filters had no wire backing or glue/metal closure on the crimp.

 

[4WD]

No, the failed filter had no wire backing or glue/metal closure on the crimp.

Okay - what I have are like a nylon mesh backing - nylon cage - and made in Korea - so should be just fine - bought 6 and 4th in motor now …
The others have done fine at 10k runs …

 

[drtyler]

Okay - what I have are like a nylon mesh backing - nylon cage - and made in Korea - so should be just fine - bought 6 and 4th in motor now …
The others have done fine at 10k runs …

You have the good ones, made in Korea.

The poorly constructed filters are the latest ones made in Brazil.

 

[Mewbs]

Nope, I just followed the data.


Driving that many miles per day, you are primed to do extended OCIs. How about joining the club?


Yes, however long the data supports.

Thats nice, I normally follow my gut. Its good you sampled and monitored the oil health and engine during this long experiment if It was me, would hesitate to go any further than 10k even if the numbers looked good on the reports.


I plan to this to year and first time in my current vehicle life to try out extended drains to reduce maintenance cost. The problem was finding the right oil until I found this website. However I am searching to work closer to home so my driving situation may change again. I did drove 20k miles this year and went through 4 oil changes, draining every 5k in 3 months of driving each.


I will keep a watchful eye on your future progress. Thank you for posting your data and related engine under cover photos proving the oils run clean in a very long service life.

 

[wwillson]

Inside sump pictures added to first post

 

[demarpaint]

Maybe, but I'm not going to find out on this vehicle.

I think you are referring to this adapter?

Pentastar 3.2L and 3.6L 2014 to present. MS-201-BK Cartridge to Spin-on Adapter

Pentastar Cartridge to Spin-On Oil filter adapter fits 2014 + 3.2 and 3.6-liter Pentastar engines. Cartridge Filters have no anti-drainback valve. This product provides faster oil pressure at startup by keeping the upper oil system flooded. The adapter contains full flow check valve and unique...

www.baxterperformanceusa.com

Flame suit on. I see that having it's own set of problems with the added weight, and possibly causing leaks [over time] where the filter housing/cooler assembly mount to the engine. I'm also not a fan of blowing compressed air into it before unscrewing the filter.

 

[wwillson]

I see that having it's own set of problems with the added weight, and possibly causing leaks where the filter housing cooler assembly mount to the engine.

That was my first thought. Think about the moment arm with that heavy adapter and a filter cranking on the base when you drive on rough roads.

I'm also not a fan of blowing compressed air into it before unscrewing the filter.

Or just wait a few minutes.

 

[demarpaint]

That was my first thought. Think about the moment arm with that heavy adapter and a filter cranking on the base when you drive on rough roads.


Or just wait a few minutes.

The vibration and movement imo would be a problem for sure. I'm not sure about waiting a few minutes, I thought the whole purpose of it was to use a filter that wouldn't drain back into the engine after shutting the engine off. I could be wrong, so if waiting is the case then the weight, movement, and increased potential for leaks would be my only concerns, and warranty issues in a vehicle under warranty.

 

[dnewton3]

Inside sump pictures added to first post

Wow, those look very clean given the mileage and the OCI duration.
Borescope sure makes getting those shots easy, right?
Curious the point of entry for those sump/crankcase shots?

Let us know what brand and model of scope if you don't mind.

 

[wwillson]

Wow, those look very clean given the mileage and the OCI duration.

Yeah, zero varnish anywhere. I'm pleased!

Borescope sure makes getting those shots easy, right?

No, it takes a lot of patience because it's not a straight path. You have to push the camera head up against a part, then turn the camera to ramp the snake past that part. You also need to watch out for oil in the sump and clinging so that you don't get it on the camera. The next challenge is if the engine is hot, which it was, you can only have the light on for a short duration before you get the LEDs too hot. Lots of laying there with oil running down your arm.

Curious the point of entry for those sump/crankcase shots?

Drain plug hole.

The sump on the Durango is so easy to remove, that I just might remove it when I drain the oil next time. The Charger sump is completely different and impossible to remove probably without removing the front differential.

Let us know what brand and model of scope if you don't mind.

https://a.co/d/9UuRej4

 

[The Critic]

What needs to be taken into account is that not all engine series have the same issues. In the case of the 3.6L in the Durango, it's not known for piston/ring issues.

Certain engine families are more prone to developing piston ring issues, but that doesn't make the rest of the engines (on the market) immune. Oil Control Rings are very similar in design across all IC engines.

To be fair, wwillson could take some compression readings from the cylinders, but as the engine isn't known for this problem, it would likely be useless info.

Oil control ring issues will rarely impact static compression readings.

If the bores were scored, you'd think Fe and Cr would be showing up in the UOA.

To be fair, not all oil burners will have scored cylinder walls, but I have seen some.

So the under valve cover photos are sufficient to track varnish, etc.

You are entitled to your opinion, but I think it is a bit misleading to conclusively rely on a few UOA's and the visual condition of a valvetrain to validate drain intervals that are more than 3x the OEM recommendation.

 

[doublebase]

What’s the old and new numbers ?

Previously 5,000 using whatever synthetic on sale, then 10,000 using Mobil1 EP…now? Well I’m not sure, depends on if I chicken out, but I was thinking 15,000.

 

[KEVINK0000]

This is from years ago. 500k mile BMW with 30k Redline oil changes. I was never swayed to do likewise, but, like WW’s excellent documentation of his engines, interested to see these kind of results.

Celebrating 500K miles in a BimmerWorld-serviced BMW E46

BimmerWorld-serviced 2000 E46 323Ci just came in to celebrate a huge milestone... 500,000 miles!

www.bmwblog.com