True, but when I say "numbers game" I'm talking about the actual number of similar failures. It's easy to deny a claim but a hundred for the same issue is more difficult.
Toyota balking at engine warranty for RTV in oil pickup on GR86
- Thread starter TiGeo
- Start date
This is a predictable consequence of the risk Toyota took partnering with a car manufacturer that has less of a focus on quality control. Unfortunately, many think the GR86 is a Toyota product, and the company's reputation for QDR will take a hit. It's a similar situation with the Bupra - a very risky endeavor on the part of Toyoda-san.
If he ran a thicker oil this wouldn't have happened. 
I think the big escape clause for Ford on that one is the off-roading supplement indicated to always pre-run before doing any high speed running.
I'll be the one to bite and say that doing an auto-x is not putting the car under any real stress that a normal morning commute would do. My group of friends took our Lemons CRX and a Crown Vic on coilovers to a Porsche club one and we with no experience whatsoever set quick time and got kicked out. Especially something with not a lot of power like a GR86. Its not like a high hp car running lap after lap at Road America or COTA.
Driving around a parking lot at redline while drifting hardly counts as "every day driving". Speed has very little to do with engine wear: One could easily cruise at 100 MPH in their Accord all day long with little to show for it other than the fuel bill. Drive that same Accord at 100 MPH in 3rd gear while it turns 5k RPM for a few hours and see how well it holds up.
Granted, that's a poor comparison. Show me a Honda engine that isn't content running high RPM for long stretches... they were the pioneers of rev-happy engines.
The stress on that NA engine that is rev-happy is no differnet was my point. Sure it's harder on tires/suspension but the motor? If Toyota/Subaru can't build a track-focused car that can handle this they should be embarrassed...this isn't "high stress" by today's standards. Good lord I'd hate to see it handle 24 min at full tilt during a single HPDE session.
I understand the joke.If he ran a thicker oil this wouldn't have happened.
But we'll see after 10 years of sharp use..
Oh BTW, trannies are sealed for life ?
I have had more consequential issue with Toyota than Subaru over the Years. Regardless, FHI (now: SC) do need to get their engine manufacturing shtick together. They have had lapses - but haven't they all. Surprising given the Japanese Industry's traditionally robust quality system. The dispensing process may be well controlled, but maybe oil is going into the sump before the RTV is cured? Maybe contamination along the parting line?
I have a Honda story bout a garbage engine in a Civic ...
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Good points; no manufacturer is immune. My greater point is the reputational risk inherent to partnerships among car companies, wherein manufacturing processes are not necessarily under the direct oversight and control of the brand affixing its logo to the product.
(Without derailing the thread, which engine gave you trouble in the Civic?)
According to Motor Trend, Toyota did respond and contacted the owner.. They offered to repair the engine under warranty..
From Motor Trend...
"Update, August 4, 2022: Speaking to The Drive, Alvarado has confirmed that Toyota's executive office reached out to him after all of the social media coverage of his blown engine and has ultimately decided to cover the issue under warranty. The Drive reports a Toyota representative said Alvarado and others should be able "to use the vehicle at future autocross and track day events without putting [the] warranty in jeopardy. "
https://www.motortrend.com/news/toy...1EEFF7D2C7F16C865D3248B7199A937143C4A1A3533A7
From Motor Trend...
"Update, August 4, 2022: Speaking to The Drive, Alvarado has confirmed that Toyota's executive office reached out to him after all of the social media coverage of his blown engine and has ultimately decided to cover the issue under warranty. The Drive reports a Toyota representative said Alvarado and others should be able "to use the vehicle at future autocross and track day events without putting [the] warranty in jeopardy. "
https://www.motortrend.com/news/toy...1EEFF7D2C7F16C865D3248B7199A937143C4A1A3533A7
Wait till stuff starts going awry with the BMW built Supra. Y'aint seen nuthin' yet!
The automotive manufacturing industry has an extremely robust quality system in IATF 16949 .
Toyota's quality standard bearer days are long since gone - though they are still in the top 1/3
But know that Toyota are a majority stakeholder and affiliate of Subaru now. Subaru used to build Camry for Toyota in the Mid 2000's in Indiana. Not the best Camry I might add.
At least the toyobaru is purportedly a fun to drive car - something toyota can't get their heads around designing.
I can feel toyota influence on current Subaru and it doesn't taste good. But Maybe I am mistaken and that influence is Fed requirements and regulation.
Im curious if the report is accurate that Gulf States Toyota Distributor actually denied coverage and not Toyota itself. Toyotas are still sold through 2 distributors that I’m aware or Gulf States and Southeast.
edyvw
$50 site donor 2025
BMW is specific that warranty covers track and autocross. Also, engine in Supra is already 6 years spinning on tracks with no issues.
That is why on track on Thursday I only saw 3 Miata’s representing Japanese racing pride. Rest were European and American vehicles.
What BMW won’t cover, and that is where that reputation comes from, is little Billy down the street changing twin turbo set up to single turbo set up, changing direct injection to port injection, producing 200% of original power, and then going to dealership to complain about fuel-air mixture.
edyvw
$50 site donor 2025
And I told my wife: look, simple, stick shift RWD. Not bad idea.
I should stick with 10yrs old second hand BMW’s.
If the claim is through Toyota’s distributor(Gulf States Toyota) it’s not actually Toyota. It’s a private distributor that is outside of Toyota’s control. Which is why there is disconnect between the car being marketed as a sports car yet the warranty claim is denied. Different entity, different interests.
Ever wonder why you can’t order a Toyota to spec? Or why there are different packages available in different parts of the country? It’s the distributors. They are the middle man between your local Toyota dealer and Toyota corporate. This is why the Subaru version doesn’t get its warranty claim denied. I think there is only 1 region in the US that is under control by Toyota themselves. I think they tried to dissolve the distributor contracts a few years ago but lost in court.
edit: gulf states Toyota and Toyota south east are privately owned. Rest of the country is under control of Toyota.
Ever wonder why you can’t order a Toyota to spec? Or why there are different packages available in different parts of the country? It’s the distributors. They are the middle man between your local Toyota dealer and Toyota corporate. This is why the Subaru version doesn’t get its warranty claim denied. I think there is only 1 region in the US that is under control by Toyota themselves. I think they tried to dissolve the distributor contracts a few years ago but lost in court.
edit: gulf states Toyota and Toyota south east are privately owned. Rest of the country is under control of Toyota.
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My Club Sport was my HPDE Instructor car from 1996 to 2012. I retired it from track use because I was as getting carpal tunnel syndrome from all of the point-bys I was having to give. It's still running great, and the engine has needed nothing more than a thermostat and a valve cover gasket. It's still on the original cooling system hoses and the struts/shocks are original as well. I did replace the LCABs twice and the pinion seal once. Otherwise its running great at 149k miles.I understand the joke.
But we'll see after 10 years of sharp use..
Oh BTW, trannies are sealed for life ?
In 2016 when I was preparing to instruct at an HPDE I brought my 2er to the dealer for a coolant change and a brake fluid flush; it was still under warranty and had complementary maintenance. Without any prompting my Service Advisor said, "I'll do a pull-ahead on your next covered oil change- that way you will hit the track with a sump full of fresh oil."
I once had a Nissan dealer honor a warranty on a Transmission where I had an obvious aftermarket supercharger on my 350Z.
They said verbatim " we sell it as a sports car we have to honor the warranty for a car that's driven hard even on a track".
It was the relatively well know syncro on the 2-3 shift that probably helped (otherwise the Nissan 6M is hard as nails and the syncro was modified from 2005 on.
Car had multiple stickers from the different racetracks it's been on on it and a large and obvious supercharger on it.
Nissan dealer: No problem, warranty honored.
Nissan gets sports cars.
Here is a pic:
edyvw
$50 site donor 2025
BS. Toyota is on it. I tried to build Sienna, and they want you to go through local dealers. Toyota could mitigate all that easily.
But Toyota is company that will do everything before going to recall . First thing in their vocabulary is: it is your fault. It is Toyota, impossible to be our fault.
Look at the guy who spun his Corvette C7 at a speedway. On Star frantically called him asking if he needed medical assistance. They repeatedly assured him that they could send someone. He said no, I'm out practicing laps.
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