Thinking about a 2004 GTO
- Thread starter 04SE
- Start date
- Status
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
The early 'eighties savior of Chrysler was invited to leave Ford by the grandson of the founder.
Ahhh yes, that's right. But I still recall that he heavily opposed what happened to the Mustang.
The early 'eighties savior of Chrysler was invited to leave Ford by the grandson of the founder.
Ahhh yes, that's right. But I still recall that he heavily opposed what happened to the Mustang.
FWIR, Lido had in mind a smaller and sportier Mustang than what was actually introduced, maybe on its own platform.
The production Mustang was a Falcon in drag with enough rear seat room for a couple of kids as well as enough trunk space for the weekly shopping.
Using a cheap, high volume platform allowed Ford to price the car quite low while still earning a nice bit on sales.
Making the car the size that it was made the Mustang a practical second or even primary car for a middle class family not flush with cash.
The Mustang hewed to this theme for a few generations, with the second gen based on the Pinto platform, while the third was of course a Fairmont coupe, although Ford did offer a Fairmont coupe as well.
Fords of the 'sixties had pretty rich looking interiors, as compared to the bland interiors of GM cars, as well as the cheap looking ones found in Chryslers.
What is surprising is that while you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear, Ford did a pretty good job of making very nice sow's ears of both the Falcon and the Fairmont based cars.
The Fox body car can be very nice to drive.
It was also really awful in base six cylinder form.
Europe's Mustang, the Capri, may have been closer to Iaccoca's orignal concept.
A nice little car that sold in decent volume over two generations through the Mercury channel, which also offered something really neat from Italy with a 351C behind the driver.
The production Mustang was a Falcon in drag with enough rear seat room for a couple of kids as well as enough trunk space for the weekly shopping.
Using a cheap, high volume platform allowed Ford to price the car quite low while still earning a nice bit on sales.
Making the car the size that it was made the Mustang a practical second or even primary car for a middle class family not flush with cash.
The Mustang hewed to this theme for a few generations, with the second gen based on the Pinto platform, while the third was of course a Fairmont coupe, although Ford did offer a Fairmont coupe as well.
Fords of the 'sixties had pretty rich looking interiors, as compared to the bland interiors of GM cars, as well as the cheap looking ones found in Chryslers.
What is surprising is that while you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear, Ford did a pretty good job of making very nice sow's ears of both the Falcon and the Fairmont based cars.
The Fox body car can be very nice to drive.
It was also really awful in base six cylinder form.
Europe's Mustang, the Capri, may have been closer to Iaccoca's orignal concept.
A nice little car that sold in decent volume over two generations through the Mercury channel, which also offered something really neat from Italy with a 351C behind the driver.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
A nice little car that sold in decent volume over two generations through the Mercury channel, which also offered something really neat from Italy with a 351C behind the driver.
Are you speaking of the Pantera?
A nice little car that sold in decent volume over two generations through the Mercury channel, which also offered something really neat from Italy with a 351C behind the driver.
Are you speaking of the Pantera?
I think the GTO is a great car who cares where it was designed, it's just not my cup-o-tea, lol. Good friend of mine has a 2004 black on black. It is a demon on the highway. It was more comfortable that the 07 GT I had for long trips. When my stang was in stock form it would run away from me on the highway. My stang felt alot more sporty, and was alot cheaper to moddify. I'm a Ford guy so I still choose the mustang, but i'd drive a GTO!
Yes.
A gorgeous car with a heart of gold.
Unfortunately, that lovely body and fine Cleveland came with awful low volume Italian systems, expecially the electrics.
The unit construction body also featured poor build quality and no rust proofing at all.
There was a guy featured in Car&Driver maybe a few years back who loved Panteras and actually had one that he'd driven past 200K.
A great concept and a gorgeous car that failed to live up to the expectations of most buyers, who thought they were getting a mid-engined Corvette, not a rolling project.
IIRC, these cars were priced around 12K.
Plenty cheap for the work that went into them.
Still, there beats no heart in any enthusiast breast not lusting for one of these.
Unlike a Ferrari, these cars have a cheap and common engine that can be rebuilt for pocket change and that can be built to produce more power with more reliability than any Ferrari V-12.
A gorgeous car with a heart of gold.
Unfortunately, that lovely body and fine Cleveland came with awful low volume Italian systems, expecially the electrics.
The unit construction body also featured poor build quality and no rust proofing at all.
There was a guy featured in Car&Driver maybe a few years back who loved Panteras and actually had one that he'd driven past 200K.
A great concept and a gorgeous car that failed to live up to the expectations of most buyers, who thought they were getting a mid-engined Corvette, not a rolling project.
IIRC, these cars were priced around 12K.
Plenty cheap for the work that went into them.
Still, there beats no heart in any enthusiast breast not lusting for one of these.
Unlike a Ferrari, these cars have a cheap and common engine that can be rebuilt for pocket change and that can be built to produce more power with more reliability than any Ferrari V-12.
I didn't like the 2004-2006 Pontiac GTO for 1 reason:
It should have looked more like The Judge.
It should have looked more like The Judge.
ls1mike
$50 Site Donor 2025
Originally Posted By: MuzzleFlash40
was alot cheaper to moddify. I'm a Ford guy so I still choose the mustang, but i'd drive a GTO!
Cheaper to modify a Mod motor than an LS1? Interesting. A Cam swap is half that price, heads are cheaper, blowers cost the same, headers cost the same. How is the Mod motor cheaper to modify. My cam and valve springs were 400 bucks. My Patriot heads were 1200.
What part is cheaper to modify on a Mod motor?
was alot cheaper to moddify. I'm a Ford guy so I still choose the mustang, but i'd drive a GTO!
Cheaper to modify a Mod motor than an LS1? Interesting. A Cam swap is half that price, heads are cheaper, blowers cost the same, headers cost the same. How is the Mod motor cheaper to modify. My cam and valve springs were 400 bucks. My Patriot heads were 1200.
What part is cheaper to modify on a Mod motor?
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
Umm,
I think the formula belonged to John Delorean before the midwife of the Mustang discovered it.
In fact, that formula was arguably created with the original Tempest GTO.
OTOH, there were plain Jane cars with big motors before the first GTO, like the 409 Chevy.
You are absolutely correct!
Got my old timer's history mixed up! Yes, it was (snort!) DeLorean (sniff!).
Umm,
I think the formula belonged to John Delorean before the midwife of the Mustang discovered it.
In fact, that formula was arguably created with the original Tempest GTO.
OTOH, there were plain Jane cars with big motors before the first GTO, like the 409 Chevy.
You are absolutely correct!
Got my old timer's history mixed up! Yes, it was (snort!) DeLorean (sniff!).
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
Unlike a Ferrari, these cars have a cheap and common engine that can be rebuilt for pocket change and that can be built to produce more power with more reliability than any Ferrari V-12.
Having seen many a Pantera I will respectfully advise anyone that more power simply turns them into a crazy man's car. They have so much chassis flex as delivered they run the risk of falling apart when you hit the railroad tracks!
Another HUGE advantage for the Ferrari is their outrageous structural strength and integrity. There are few better street cars to have a high speed wreck in.
Unlike a Ferrari, these cars have a cheap and common engine that can be rebuilt for pocket change and that can be built to produce more power with more reliability than any Ferrari V-12.
Having seen many a Pantera I will respectfully advise anyone that more power simply turns them into a crazy man's car. They have so much chassis flex as delivered they run the risk of falling apart when you hit the railroad tracks!
Another HUGE advantage for the Ferrari is their outrageous structural strength and integrity. There are few better street cars to have a high speed wreck in.
Originally Posted By: ls1mike
Originally Posted By: MuzzleFlash40
was alot cheaper to moddify. I'm a Ford guy so I still choose the mustang, but i'd drive a GTO!
Cheaper to modify a Mod motor than an LS1? Interesting. A Cam swap is half that price, heads are cheaper, blowers cost the same, headers cost the same. How is the Mod motor cheaper to modify. My cam and valve springs were 400 bucks. My Patriot heads were 1200.
What part is cheaper to modify on a Mod motor?
You would be correct when talking about engine work, but every bolt on part for the GTO (exhaust, CAI, pullies etc) was alot more expensive than mine. Atleast they were in 2007 when I first got mine and he got his Goat about the same time, the availability of the bolt ons were just so much less so the prices were more. Were not talking about the bolt on parts for the LS1 camaro that had been around for 10 years prior to this. Thats what I meant by cheaper.
Originally Posted By: MuzzleFlash40
was alot cheaper to moddify. I'm a Ford guy so I still choose the mustang, but i'd drive a GTO!
Cheaper to modify a Mod motor than an LS1? Interesting. A Cam swap is half that price, heads are cheaper, blowers cost the same, headers cost the same. How is the Mod motor cheaper to modify. My cam and valve springs were 400 bucks. My Patriot heads were 1200.
What part is cheaper to modify on a Mod motor?
You would be correct when talking about engine work, but every bolt on part for the GTO (exhaust, CAI, pullies etc) was alot more expensive than mine. Atleast they were in 2007 when I first got mine and he got his Goat about the same time, the availability of the bolt ons were just so much less so the prices were more. Were not talking about the bolt on parts for the LS1 camaro that had been around for 10 years prior to this. Thats what I meant by cheaper.
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
Unlike a Ferrari, these cars have a cheap and common engine that can be rebuilt for pocket change and that can be built to produce more power with more reliability than any Ferrari V-12.
Having seen many a Pantera I will respectfully advise anyone that more power simply turns them into a crazy man's car. They have so much chassis flex as delivered they run the risk of falling apart when you hit the railroad tracks!
Full rollcage FTW!
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
Unlike a Ferrari, these cars have a cheap and common engine that can be rebuilt for pocket change and that can be built to produce more power with more reliability than any Ferrari V-12.
Having seen many a Pantera I will respectfully advise anyone that more power simply turns them into a crazy man's car. They have so much chassis flex as delivered they run the risk of falling apart when you hit the railroad tracks!
Full rollcage FTW!
Before we get into some kind of dispute over nothing here, things might be different now I dont know but in 2007 there were a big difference in price when it came to bolt-ons for the two. I had to call him up to refresh my memory, but we both walked into the jegs store in columbus to get our stuff.
August 2007
2007 Mustang
K&N CAI $239
Full exhaust $1075
Underdrive pu $229
MDS Coils $405
Gears $209
2004 GTO
K&N CAI $279
Full exhaust $1450
Pullies $249
MSD COILS $685
GEARS $325
The funny thig is we got a price quote on superchargers that day on ebay, he still has his I dont, but I remember my price.
Procharger for the GTO was $6,700. $5,600 for the Mustang.
When it come to internal engine work, the LS1 is hands down easier and cheaper to do, but when it comes to bolt-ons for the gto it was just alot more expensive to modd, I would guess it is still true today since there just isn't that many out there. Love american muscle of all brands!!!
August 2007
2007 Mustang
K&N CAI $239
Full exhaust $1075
Underdrive pu $229
MDS Coils $405
Gears $209
2004 GTO
K&N CAI $279
Full exhaust $1450
Pullies $249
MSD COILS $685
GEARS $325
The funny thig is we got a price quote on superchargers that day on ebay, he still has his I dont, but I remember my price.
Procharger for the GTO was $6,700. $5,600 for the Mustang.
When it come to internal engine work, the LS1 is hands down easier and cheaper to do, but when it comes to bolt-ons for the gto it was just alot more expensive to modd, I would guess it is still true today since there just isn't that many out there. Love american muscle of all brands!!!
Last edited:
My 2006 GTO has the following mods, done by the PO...
- Maggie 112 Supercharger @ 7psi
- JBA shortie headers, Corsa X-pipe, Borla XR1 mufflers and 4in Borla tips
- Billet Pro shifter
- Full Pedders Suspension (LOVE it)
- 18 in Boyd Coddington rims
- Rear backup sensors
Love the JHP gauges, they blend in tastefully:
- Maggie 112 Supercharger @ 7psi
- JBA shortie headers, Corsa X-pipe, Borla XR1 mufflers and 4in Borla tips
- Billet Pro shifter
- Full Pedders Suspension (LOVE it)
- 18 in Boyd Coddington rims
- Rear backup sensors
Love the JHP gauges, they blend in tastefully:
If I could find a low mileage, unmodified, adult owned, 2004, preferably in Cosmos Purple (an impossible dream, I know) I'd buy another 2004.
I'd have to build a new storage building / shop first. I have indoor space for the two Jags and three Pontiacs, but the truck and some unregistered retired vehicles have to sit outside at the warehouse of junk.
And I sort of like the new Camaro - sometimes I do, sometimes I don't. If I already had a new storage building, I might have one of those in the fleet.
I'd have to build a new storage building / shop first. I have indoor space for the two Jags and three Pontiacs, but the truck and some unregistered retired vehicles have to sit outside at the warehouse of junk.
And I sort of like the new Camaro - sometimes I do, sometimes I don't. If I already had a new storage building, I might have one of those in the fleet.
Originally Posted By: MuzzleFlash40
Originally Posted By: ls1mike
Originally Posted By: MuzzleFlash40
was alot cheaper to moddify. I'm a Ford guy so I still choose the mustang, but i'd drive a GTO!
Cheaper to modify a Mod motor than an LS1? Interesting. A Cam swap is half that price, heads are cheaper, blowers cost the same, headers cost the same. How is the Mod motor cheaper to modify. My cam and valve springs were 400 bucks. My Patriot heads were 1200.
What part is cheaper to modify on a Mod motor?
You would be correct when talking about engine work, but every bolt on part for the GTO (exhaust, CAI, pullies etc) was alot more expensive than mine. Atleast they were in 2007 when I first got mine and he got his Goat about the same time, the availability of the bolt ons were just so much less so the prices were more. Were not talking about the bolt on parts for the LS1 camaro that had been around for 10 years prior to this. Thats what I meant by cheaper.
Also, when one is talking of suspension/handling/braking mods, both the Fox platform, AND the latter 'Stang platforms win in the 'bang for the buck' and choice departments, hands down, as compared to the Holden platforms.
That top drawer Pedders/Harrop stuff ain't quite cheap.
Originally Posted By: ls1mike
Originally Posted By: MuzzleFlash40
was alot cheaper to moddify. I'm a Ford guy so I still choose the mustang, but i'd drive a GTO!
Cheaper to modify a Mod motor than an LS1? Interesting. A Cam swap is half that price, heads are cheaper, blowers cost the same, headers cost the same. How is the Mod motor cheaper to modify. My cam and valve springs were 400 bucks. My Patriot heads were 1200.
What part is cheaper to modify on a Mod motor?
You would be correct when talking about engine work, but every bolt on part for the GTO (exhaust, CAI, pullies etc) was alot more expensive than mine. Atleast they were in 2007 when I first got mine and he got his Goat about the same time, the availability of the bolt ons were just so much less so the prices were more. Were not talking about the bolt on parts for the LS1 camaro that had been around for 10 years prior to this. Thats what I meant by cheaper.
Also, when one is talking of suspension/handling/braking mods, both the Fox platform, AND the latter 'Stang platforms win in the 'bang for the buck' and choice departments, hands down, as compared to the Holden platforms.
That top drawer Pedders/Harrop stuff ain't quite cheap.
This was a love it or leave it car. Pretty pricey at the time and with all the retro going on, people were expecting something that resembled a GTO. Taking an Aussie Holden, drop in a Corvette engine and putting a Pontiac badge on it does not make it a GTO. Plenty of power but the exterior styling left a lot. The rear tail lights look more like a Cavalier or Cobalt. I think this car was never planned as something other than an experiment. Sales were soft and they kept making changes on the appearance, but if you are slow at the start, you're never going to gain any steam. If you like the car, you have a nice ride. Things looked more promising for the G8, but the writing was on the wall for Pontiac. Renaming your line-up G3, G5, G6 and G8 is a sign of a GM division in trouble.
Originally Posted By: PhillyJoe
I think this car was never planned as something other than an experiment. Sales were soft and they kept making changes on the appearance, but if you are slow at the start, you're never going to gain any steam. If you like the car, you have a nice ride.
The only changes made to appearance were dual exhausts with the introduction of the LS2 and hood scoops becoming standard instead of an option. The 2006 got clear tails. Agreed otherwise.
I think this car was never planned as something other than an experiment. Sales were soft and they kept making changes on the appearance, but if you are slow at the start, you're never going to gain any steam. If you like the car, you have a nice ride.
The only changes made to appearance were dual exhausts with the introduction of the LS2 and hood scoops becoming standard instead of an option. The 2006 got clear tails. Agreed otherwise.
- Status
