The Lyrics charge curve is in and......

UncleDave said:
It's not entirely true, but it mostly is and thats ok.

No one's telling me what to drive and I dont believe mandates will stick, but I get that rage and share it. I just dont think it has teeth.
The governments been telling us what to drive for decades, go buy a 2 stroke street bike, a DEF free diesel, a 5 speed big block bench seat car if you think otherwise.

I could care less what anyone else feels about EV any more than they do about GM, Hondas, or cherry pie.
Especially a guy that has no experience, doesn't know anything about them outside of what fits their narrative which is often wrong or distorted.
They just cant share much knowledge and get stuck on association tropes that dont apply, while losing their minds when people do the same thing to them.

The association game many here play is utterly juvenile. Saying anyone that likes a tesla or electric car loves Elon Musk, or believes they will save world is something I read endlessly here, and its just as stupid as saying all gun owners are fanatics, or jewish people are all thieves, and on an on with the tropes.

These same guys have decided improving our grid is an insurmountable obstacle, but somehow think we dont actually have a huge problem today with oil.
They give no answers to these problems, have no solutions while selectively whining about little subsidies.

I've had one car that could go 500 miles on a tank, and never once drove that far, I wonder how many really do?

Ease of use is in the eye of the beholder so I appreciate your IMO at the end.
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I totally get where you’re coming from and like I’ve said I love EVs. I’m not buying $100k cars no matter who makes them so 500 miles especially at the coldest point of the year is not something I’ll have access to. I just haven’t seen the math that gets me to my furthest point at the worst time of year without charging in time to not be late for my call. Extreme example for sure which 99% of people don’t do so as far as I can figure if it doesn’t work for me and I want it to, you’ll never get a positive answer out of an anti EV person because they’ll always cite worst case scenario even if it’s well beyond their usage.


I’m just never in that big of a pinch with my family so it’s fine for that, so it works fine for the family car. You’ll just find the person who hates EVs enough that will tell you it works in no scenario for them because of “insert any ridiculous scenario”.
 
I NEED a Model 3 Highland Performance so I can make all the exotics in town lives miserable. Hopefully the acceleration will be even better than the current car, which is already an 11.5 second qtr mile car.
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I wouldnt mind an electric as second car.. let me know when you get a 250 mile winter range one for 15k.. ok 25k.. with inflation now.

Dont include first 5 years GAS SAVINGS, federal or state rebates as part of your price..

When I can drive off the lot at 25k+ tax let me know.
 
Rand said:
I wouldnt mind an electric as second car.. let me know when you get a 250 mile winter range one for 15k.. ok 25k.. with inflation now.

Dont include first 5 years GAS SAVINGS, federal or state rebates as part of your price..

When I can drive off the lot at 25k+ tax let me know.
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Let's compare apples to apples. Not many nice ICE cars at that price point nowadays. You're talking econobox.
 
Leo99 said:
Let's compare apples to apples. Not many nice ICE cars at that price point nowadays. You're talking econobox.
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Exactly.. what we need for mass adoption.
2020 elantra isnt the econobox of 2001.
heated seats, sunroof, emergency braking(with camera etc)
blind spot detection, cruise, 40mpg 16" alloy wheels.
15k in 2019.

Instead we have a ton of cars approaching 50k.. at least in Ohio.

The majority of people wanting EV's are younger.. if you are renting and have a kid who can afford that.
answer: A small percentage.

Also what would you consider the leaf or bolt? thats an econobox eh?
We considered a bolt.. but with interest rates now its about 30k... that buys alot of gas at 35-42mpg.

I am not anti-EV. Maybe the tesla model 2.
 
AZjeff said:
If you're renting and have a kid you probably shouldn't be looking at new cars. We sure weren't when in that position.
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They shouldnt be buying a truck that gets 14mpg either.. but we know they do that.
Back when cars were 15k it was worth it to look new for a variety of reasons. Financing, warranty etc.
 
Cujet said:
Is that simply a matter of charger programming? Or is it that the higher voltage can "force" more power into the cells when they are closer to full? Much like putting a 12V charger on a 6V battery, it smokes it "full" in short order. And if so, what's the downside, if any?
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If you have higher voltage, you can use less amperage for the same result, which equals less heat. Less throttling which can mean you can charge faster longer. It's heat mitigation that is why charging gets slower the higher the charge level gets. It's not really forcing more power, it's just having a bigger headroom of available power and 800V vehicles can take advantage of that.

It's also why 800V cars on 400V chargers are slower to charge than a 400V car on a 400V charger. The 800V car has to step up the power to 800V onboard to charge and it can only draw so much amperage until it hits the ceiling of the charger.
 
Torrid said:
The 800V car has to step up the power to 800V onboard to charge and it can only draw so much amperage until it hits the ceiling of the charger.
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This is also why charge at home losses tend to be greater for 800V cars. It's even further from 240V.

All signs point to skipping right by 800 and go to 1K so that trucks and vehicles with 200KWH batteries and up can charge quickly.

The higher the voltage sent from the grid to charge point the more expensive and longer the transition.
 
Torrid said:
I know it's been mentioned many times and I find induction charging to be very interesting, but the same people that complain about birds being killed by windmills will go on about the squirrels that get cooked between the car charging and the road surface. Still freakin' cool tech. You make a great point though. Even if range was subpar, which would also likely save weight of the vehicle it would make adoption of EVs that much easier and less of an inconvenience. Less weight, more efficient, and less expensive for using less battery in those cases. There's definitely room for improvement.

The market is weird. It's funny how quickly things can change seemingly overnight. Detroit is an excellent example. It's sad what happened to that city. It was a point of pride in our auto industry. Auto manufacture there is almost non existent compared to what it used to be.
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Once upon a time we have EV one with induction charging, the result is bad because you can't charge too fast compare to how much capacity your battery can hold and how much current you can provide, so now everyone is going through DC fast charging and water cooled cables, etc.

If anything I think the future might be dedicated fast charging lot with a fence for each spot. The charging will start at very high voltage once everyone is out and the gate is closed, and the car detects no living organism inside (pet, human, stray animals, etc), like how they fence off substations.
 
Rand said:
I wouldnt mind an electric as second car.. let me know when you get a 250 mile winter range one for 15k.. ok 25k.. with inflation now.

Dont include first 5 years GAS SAVINGS, federal or state rebates as part of your price..

When I can drive off the lot at 25k+ tax let me know.
Click to expand...
I'm not sure about US, but in China, from what I read, they have these "buy the car, rent the battery plan, we will swap for free" programs, that practically charge you by the number of swaps or energy you use, and the companies own the battery and swap station. You just drive like a normal car and you swap when your charge is low, and the EV is very affordable as a result (because it has no battery), and the company can make money in many other ways (use the pack as energy storage in the grid).

The biggest cost of EV is not the electricity to charge it, it is the depreciation of the battery pack, whether you drive it or not.
 
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