The Lyrics charge curve is in and......
- Thread starter UncleDave
- Start date
Yes, because they are building them very cheaply. This shows with interior, panel gaps, defect rate, etc. This is my EV6 GT's interior.
This is a Model Y performance's interior:
Then you throw in things like adjustable suspension, serviceable battery pack, heads up display, actual 360* cameras, electronic rear diff, and the fact that the QC on Tesla is abysmal. Go look at a Model X or a Model S on a lot. They look like kit cars the gaps are so bad. Consumer Reports lists the 2023 Model Y as 2/5 predicted reliability, the 2022 as 3/5, and the 2021 as 2/5. Conversely, the EV6 is rated at 5/5 for 2022 and 2023.
Then we compare their performance on-track, which most people won't care about, and the only way Tesla competes is if you throw the Model S and MSP into the mix.
Literally all that Tesla has going for it is NACS, and the fact that they are sole-source on their electronics, which Kia/Hyundai really aren't having issues with too much, but it's really killing GM and Ford as this thread will show. K/H just did everything themselves and isn't running into the mish-mash compatibility stuff. Still, the Tesla offers "FSD"...someday...maybe. And that is appealing to some people.
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It will probably just charge at 100kw as a flat curve because the Tesla is based on older 400V architecture, and the Kia is an 800V car. Tesla charging stations will just be emergency backup only, but STILL at 100kw flat curve, you're only looking at maybe 30 minutes 20-80. I know I stopped at a few 50KW stations in Oklahoma, and it was just a flat curve of course that took about 55 minutes for 20-80. SO overall, it will basically match Tesla charging performance at Tesla stations, more or less, when comparing overall charge time.
That said, I don't care about CCS vs. NACS, whichever way it goes, adapters will easily be had, and cars can use both at that time.
Just google "tesla seat bubble" or "tesla steering wheel wearing out" or better yet "tesla steering wheel falls off". Teslas are roughly what you can expect from a decent kit car thrown together by a handy novice.
This is exactly why taxpayer dollars, spent at the whim of politicians, should be used to pick winners and losers in any market.
Competition breeds the best product for the consumer; government handouts breeds subpar ideas with zero incentive to deliver the best anything. Let capitalism deliver!
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
$38 vs 52 is kindof a big difference...
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Is anybody buying the $39K one though? Or are they all buying the $46K long range? At which point... There isn't a big price difference there for a lot more creature comforts. Also, if you want a different colour, it's $1,500.00. If you want self-parking and more drive aides, it's another $6K, if you want "FSD", it's $12K.
I changed the paint, added the nicer wheels and the self parking stuff and I'm at $48,000.00 and I'm still on the 2WD standard range version. At that point the $4K difference with the bimmer, does that matter? I went through the same exercise with the bimmer, changed the paint (free), changed the trim to brushed aluminum (free), then added the Premium packaged (upgraded audio, power bolsters, heated seats, HUD) for $1,900 and it ended up $54,100.00.
But, to your point, the Y is a bit closer, that's what I was cross shopping.
So, you go through that same exercise I just described with the Y, and you are even closer.
The caveat comes in to play when you note that you have to spend an extra $16K to get the i4 M50 to beat the Model Y Performance. And there are options on the i4 M50 too.... But, when I was cross shopping them here, the price difference at the time, wasn't as much. And I'd pick the i4 M50 every time.
Yeah just not great.
As goes the Lyric, goes the blazer and the equinox. The smaller batteries are likely to be worse.
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I’m really curious about the Honda Prologue and Acura ZDX. Can Honda engineers make this better? Is Honda even involved to that degree in this family of cars?
We’ll see I guess…I’m really curious about the Honda Prologue and Acura ZDX. Can Honda engineers make this better? Is Honda even involved to that degree in this family of cars?
I don't think that the Honda versions will be any better/different. The OS and hardware is the same so it will have the same charging performance. All we can hope for is software updates and more software updates. But GM has had a while to get this right so it's sad they haven't got it right yet. They need to get their stuff together!!
I’m really curious about the Honda Prologue and Acura ZDX. Can Honda engineers make this better? Is Honda even involved to that degree in this family of cars?
This is the big question -GM is balls deep into this battery and platform and to make configuration changes now would set them back considerably.
If Honda alters the curves - they own the warranty liability.
We're well over a year in and at this stage this performance isn't good at all.
This was all supposed to be super easy right? Remember how Lutz said it was supposed to be?
Batteries a complex things and different versions of a given architecture can work better or worse.
The silverado is a dual stack of the lyric battery - it doesn't seem to have this dip at least that we can tell - charging hasn't really been charted extensively yet.
The Lyric is just over 100KWH and the smaller or slight;ly bigger versions may work better - the fact that we dont know doenst bode well.
Then they need to fix the HVAC -it's apparently really bad.
Im hoping they can get this nailed - If the products didnt have these problems they'd be super appealing.
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