Tesla Truck will need power of 4,000 homes!

[SHOZ]

Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
Cujet,

Who is responsible for setting up charging stations at truck stops and having the dedicated parking area ?

Will the government pass some bull [censored] law requiring accommodations for Tesla trucks ?
More than likely Tesla itself.

 

[ragtoplvr]

Fuel is about 35% of operating costs in USA. Maintenance of electric tractor could be less or MUCH MUCH more if battery does not live 500K miles.

Rod

 

[Mr Nice]

Originally Posted By: SHOZ
Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
Cujet,

Who is responsible for setting up charging stations at truck stops and having the dedicated parking area ?
Will the government pass some bull [censored] law requiring accommodations for Tesla trucks ?
More than likely Tesla itself.


Good luck with that.

Again, easy to dream it and very difficult to execute this Tesla concept.

 

[SHOZ]

Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
Originally Posted By: SHOZ
Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
Cujet,

Who is responsible for setting up charging stations at truck stops and having the dedicated parking area ?
Will the government pass some bull [censored] law requiring accommodations for Tesla trucks ?
More than likely Tesla itself.


Good luck with that.

Again, easy to dream it and very difficult to execute this Tesla concept.
Who pays to build the gas stations? Who will make money off the chargers?

 

[bubbatime]

Uses the power of 1000 to 4000 homes? What? My home, your average 2000 square foot home, cost about $7 per day for electricity. That's about 29.1 cents per hour. Times 1000 similiar homes, thats $7000 a day to power 1000 homes. Or $292 per hour.

If it really takes that much power (from the grid), would it not cost hundreds/thousands of dollars to charge the truck? Seems like a tank of fuel would be MUCH cheaper.

 

[Mr Nice]

Originally Posted By: bubbatime
Uses the power of 1000 to 4000 homes? What? My home, your average 2000 square foot home, cost about $7 per day for electricity. That's about 29.1 cents per hour. Times 1000 similiar homes, thats $7000 a day to power 1000 homes. Or $292 per hour.

If it really takes that much power (from the grid), would it not cost hundreds/thousands of dollars to charge the truck? Seems like a tank of fuel would be MUCH cheaper.


Shhhh, the Greenies and Solyndra type minded people might get offended and mad if you do simple math.

 

[StevieC]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
Here's what I posted 10 days before that...
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/4577295/Re:_New_Tesla_Truck_-_500mi_Ra#Post4577295

Musk/Tesla not commenting on what's simply fundamental math (or coming out with what exactly their amazing new technology) is PT Barnum behaviour at it's best.

I get ragged as a luddite naysayer, but facts are facts...

Originally Posted By: Shannow
Here's the tractive effort curves from Cummins...
https://cumminsengines.com/uploads/docs/cummins_secrets_of_better_fuel_economy.pdf

Given the close coupled electric motors, say 200hp for a first approximation...150KW makes the math easier.

500 miles at 60 miles per hour is 8.3 hours...1.25MWh of storage...

Six of these...mira alto substation has nearly 400 of these cubicles at 210KWh each...



https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/4577260/%22Gas%22_Station_of_the#Post4577260



Yeah I know... Just commenting that someone else seemed to do the math and it doesn't make sense.

 

[LoneRanger]

Originally Posted By: Ethan1
Elon Musk is not P.T. Barnum, he is more like Edison or Tesla himself. He founded PayPal, he is creating cars that defy conventional wisdom at Tesla, he is working on a human vacuum tube transportation system like you see in The Jetsons or Futurama, and some people believe that he is also the anonymous inventor of bitcoin.

If any BITOGers have grave concerns about the viability of his new trucks, they can contact him directly on twitter. Might get a highly-paid engineering job if you can show him where they're wrong.


Oh what a load of bologna.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
Re the solar powered claim...
I looked up Central Tech Stadium, in Toronto...(It's in Bathurst Street, I drive around Bathurst a few times per year - next town along).

Using google Maps, there's a total of 15,000 square metres available to play with.

Using
http://www.nrcan.gc.ca/18366

And 25% efficient solar cells, gives 1KWh of electricity available for every one of those square metres, making it a potential 15MWh per day generating station...enough for 12 trucks on my calcs, or 10 on the linked article.

OF COURSE it has to be grid connected...to throw it into batteries and then reclaim it loses 10% up front, and costs of the order of 25c/KWh round trip.
https://www.lazard.com/perspective/levelized-cost-of-storage-analysis-20/

But assuming he is battery focused...which he appears to be, needs to find a spot for 72 of those refigerator looking batteries, and drop the number of vehicles that can be fueled by one...

But, as they keep saying, technology will fix all those things...


And to make this "solar charging" work, you would need that amount of installed capacity (minimum) at every truck stop, no? Or would it be more as this banks on a static fleet of 11 being charged once daily?

 

[ecotourist]

Notwithstanding the problems of high initial cost and time to "refuel", the big advantage is going to come from self driving technology. Imagine a truck that drives itself 24 hours a day. If you can dispense with the driver, there will be huge savings in labour costs. And avoidance of (expensive) down-time because the driver is taking some time off or sleeping. It would be like having 3 trucks for the price of 1 (very expensive) truck.

I don't advocate these things, but I see them coming.

"Truck driver" is apparently the single largest occupational group in Canada. It is today anyway.

 

[Danno]

Originally Posted By: ecotourist
Notwithstanding the problems of high initial cost and time to "refuel", the big advantage is going to come from self driving technology. Imagine a truck that drives itself 24 hours a day. If you can dispense with the driver, there will be huge savings in labour costs. And avoidance of (expensive) down-time because the driver is taking some time off or sleeping. It would be like having 3 trucks for the price of 1 (very expensive) truck.

I don't advocate these things, but I see them coming.

"Truck driver" is apparently the single largest occupational group in Canada. It is today anyway.


Or you could drive 3 trailers with one tractor. Ontario has been running 2 x 53' trailers for a few years now. This was done with zero cost to government - purely funded by private industry. Road infrastructure capability is the big constraint now for Ontario for additional expansion.
Other jurisdictions have been running 2 x 53' for years such as Quebec.
IMO, a far better solution than convoying.
Note: I launched 2x53' LCVs for our company in Ontario. Our company was head hauling finished goods to warehouse and backhauling raw materials to plant. Quite efficient. 146,000 lb GVW allowed helps as well.

https://www.trucknews.com/sustainability...wan/1001030661/

I see pure self driving trucks being decades away in Canada.

 

[NibbanaBanana]

I've heard Elon Musk described as a "visionary". From what I read his company space X has as its' purpose to preserve the human species. In the last 25 years the global human population has gone from 6 billion to 8 billion. And the number of other species has decreased by 30%. I'd say more like "delusional".

 

[ecotourist]

Originally Posted By: Danno


Or you could drive 3 trailers with one tractor.

I see pure self driving trucks being decades away in Canada.

Or you could have a self driving truck with 3 trailers. That would make for 9 trailer loads a day (assuming 8 hour shifts).

But I think you're right. Many kinds of loads would not lend themselves to self driving in Canada (oilfield hotshot runs for one). But some more routine runs would. And obviously that's where the new system would start.

This wouldn't do away entirely with labour, but the type of work would change. Specialist loaders/unloaders and mobile mechanics would have a lot of work. And again that fits well into the routine run model.

A truck couldn't really run for 24 hours a day (unless you could quickly change out the battery pack) but 22 hours of driving with 2 hours of charging is likely practical. And a non 24 hour driving shift has a subtle advantage. Arrival and departure times could be staggered based on trucks with rotating 20 or 22 hour "shifts".

Let me stress again that I'm not advocating this. I just think it's going to happen, and early adopters will leave everyone else in the dust.

 

[Ethan1]

Originally Posted By: LoneRanger
Originally Posted By: Ethan1
Elon Musk is not P.T. Barnum, he is more like Edison or Tesla himself. He founded PayPal, he is creating cars that defy conventional wisdom at Tesla, he is working on a human vacuum tube transportation system like you see in The Jetsons or Futurama, and some people believe that he is also the anonymous inventor of bitcoin.

If any BITOGers have grave concerns about the viability of his new trucks, they can contact him directly on twitter. Might get a highly-paid engineering job if you can show him where they're wrong.


Oh what a load of bologna.

Again, you can speak with Musk directly on Twitter if you think you have math which shows that his trucks aren't viable.

 

[Shannow]

Originally Posted By: Ethan1
Again, you can speak with Musk directly on Twitter if you think you have math which shows that his trucks aren't viable.

When asked in articles how his statements are to be achieved, there's "no comment from Musk"...trust us.

Simple math says that the transfer rates that he is promising are in the range of 2MW...that's nutz for the General Public to be messing with.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: Ethan1
Again, you can speak with Musk directly on Twitter if you think you have math which shows that his trucks aren't viable.

Who will answer for him?

 

[javacontour]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
Here's what I posted 10 days before that...
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/4577295/Re:_New_Tesla_Truck_-_500mi_Ra#Post4577295

Musk/Tesla not commenting on what's simply fundamental math (or coming out with what exactly their amazing new technology) is PT Barnum behaviour at it's best.

I get ragged as a luddite naysayer, but facts are facts...

Originally Posted By: Shannow
Here's the tractive effort curves from Cummins...
https://cumminsengines.com/uploads/docs/cummins_secrets_of_better_fuel_economy.pdf



Given the close coupled electric motors, say 200hp for a first approximation...150KW makes the math easier.

500 miles at 60 miles per hour is 8.3 hours...1.25MWh of storage...

Six of these...mira alto substation has nearly 400 of these cubicles at 210KWh each...

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/4577260/%22Gas%22_Station_of_the#Post4577260



Math is hard, let's do marketing.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
Simple math says that the transfer rates that he is promising are in the range of 2MW...that's nutz for the General Public to be messing with.

It's no stranger than his bizarre mail tube human transport, or claims that he's directed his people to invent vibranium metal from the comic books.

Warp drive, the Death Star, and the One Ring are his next projects.

 

[Cujet]

Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
Cujet,

Who is responsible for setting up charging stations at truck stops and having the dedicated parking area ?

Will the government pass some bull [censored] law requiring accommodations for Tesla trucks ?


I was, of course, being a bit silly. Using a huge diesel engine make AC power, to charge DC batteries, then convert to AC power to drive motors, certainly seems like a compounding series of efficiency losses. When a simple diesel engine can do the job directly.

 

[Cujet]

Originally Posted By: Shannow


And 25% efficient solar cells, gives 1KWh of electricity available for every one of those square metres, making it a potential 15MWh per day generating station...enough for 12 trucks on my calcs, or 10 on the linked article.




1KWH per day? Certainly not per hour.

Here in South Florida, we generally say that we have 4.7 hours of sunlight per day, annualized. That accounts for typical cloud cover and seasons. But we also know that solar panels do not reach anywhere near their predicted capacity unless it's high noon.

Solar is wonderful, I have some panels and I've made some in the past. But it's energy density is not great, even in Florida, the sunshine state. It would take one huge array to fully charge his truck during a typical day. Guessing acres of panels for one truck, in real world conditions.

I suggest Tesla charge his trucks during the day and drive at night. hahahaha.