Tesla Drops USA Prices up to 20%

That's a pretty hyperbolic statement. Tesla's repeat customer purchases have been as high as 70% although current numbers are more around 60% according to one poll. The industry average is around 65%. Another poll by a better respected agency disputes that number. I would like to see what the questions were and what the reasons were (if any) that were given by current owners regarding why they wouldn't buy another Tesla. We all know that polls can be manipulated by those with an agenda.
In any case "every single existing customer" being damaged ? Not hardly.

https://www.kbb.com/car-news/is-tesla-brand-loyalty-starting-to-slip/
 
JeffKeryk said:
Yep. Like like GM and Chrysler. Only Ford hasn't been bailed out, of the "big 3". At least Tesla paid their loan off nine years ahead of schedule. And was actually penalized for doing so. Ya can't win!
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Ford definitely got handouts from the Government. More than GM even. They didn't get it from the same "program" but they got the money all the same.

Does that mean that Ford did not get any money from the governement? Hardly. Congress decided that the best alternative for Ford was to get funds from the Term Asset-Backed Securities Loan Facility (TALF), which is a government program for auto, student, and other consumer loans.

That was the tradeoff for Ford. They promised to fast-track development of energy-efficient vehicles and consolidate operations by making “greener” cars that the Obama administration wanted to see.

Ford Credit borrowed $15.9 billion dollars as opposed to GMAC, GM’s financing arm which borrowed $13.9 billion. These numbers make the perception that Ford was the only Detroit-based company that didn’t need a federal handout during the economic crash completely false.
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https://www.chevyhardcore.com/news/editorial-did-ford-take-bailout-money-too-yes-they-did/
 
leadcounsel said:
LOL. Sorry, 3.3% with 1/5th of that being in California. The US is the largest Tesla market in the world.
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leadcounsel said:
Side note, I misspelled Tesla and it's not even in the spell checker. I found that funny. Ford, General Motors, Honda, Hyundai Kia, and Chrysler are. Hyundai. LOL. But not Tesla.
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What other company sells more sedans than Tesla?

On a model basis Tesla is up there, let alone a company that doesn’t sell trucks or have a real SUV (the closest suv thing they sell reminds me of a wierd big station wagon)
 
DwightFrye said:
Elon has indicated on many, many occasions that selling a half dozen different model EV's is not his overall goal with Tesla as a corporation. Tesla will have billions and billions of dollars coming in under several highly profitable product categories provided things go according to his plans anyway.

Automakers who are manufacturing EV's are going to have to compete with a tech company that is not only manufacturing EV's but has so much cash available for R&D, new and efficient manufacturing facilities, discounts to address market conditions if necessary and other factors. They will not be bleeding money for unfunded pension liabilities, advertising, maintaining dealer networks, paying for hundreds of thousands of vehicles to be recalled each year and other things that the legacy automakers are saddled with.

Discussions regarding Tesla's future need to keep the big picture in mind. But from reading them on this forum it is apparent that many people overlook or are unaware of these facts.
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"provided things go according to his plans"

This is why the stock is down from $400 a share. Things are not going according to plans. Will they eventually? Possibly but it is speculation only because he was forced to slash prices to get inventory moving due to overproduction capacity.
What Elon has said to expect did not happen in 2022 and why the stock got trashed. This is just fact and I would say this about any company. I have nothing against the guy at all.
SO moving forward its is still speculation and risky. Speculation and risk can lead to wonderful returns. Right now there are many, many upset investors.
But buying the stock at a 70% discount certainly lowers the risk compared to the people who bought at a price 100% to 150% higher
 
The biggest issue is Musk always making blanket statements then either Tesla has to back track or engineers have to fix the damage. The "bulletproof " glass of the cybertruck that shattered. Let's face it the head engineer of Tesla's autopilot said under oath this week that Elon lied about the capabilities of autopilot and that the vehicle had software not available to the public, it still crashed. He's a loose cannon. I think Tesla needs fresh leadership. He said steering wheels are dumb, yokes from now on. Well the steering wheel option is back.
 
UncleDave said:
I'm more curious to see how demand is affected by the price drop.
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Good point. People want to associate Tesla's operations with the incredible stock price drop.
GM stock price is down almost 50% from its peak and up 4.5% YTD. Ford down 50%. Toyota down 30%.

Tesla's vehicle price drop will attract many customers from both ICE and EV. ICE customers will now be able to reconsider their choices as a Model 3 is about the price as a loaded Camry.
An EV shopper might be looking looking at a VW ID.4 With the Tesla lower prices, he/she could get a Model 3 with far more range and the superlative Supercharger Network.

The people thinking Tesla is losing marketshare are missing the point. Tesla plays in the EV market and EVs play in the vehicle market.
GM showed a modest increase in sales in 2022, like 3% I believe. Tesla grew 44%. Everyone else was down.
 
JeffKeryk said:
Good point. People want to associate Tesla's operations with the incredible stock price drop.
GM stock price is down almost 50% from its peak and up 4.5% YTD. Ford down 50%. Toyota down 30%.

Tesla's vehicle price drop will attract many customers from both ICE and EV. ICE customers will now be able to reconsider their choices as a Model 3 is about the price as a loaded Camry.
An EV shopper might be looking looking at a VW ID.4 With the Tesla lower prices, he/she could get a Model 3 with far more range and the superlative Supercharger Network.

The people thinking Tesla is losing marketshare are missing the point. Tesla plays in the EV market and EVs play in the vehicle market.
GM showed a modest increase in sales in 2022, like 3% I believe. Tesla grew 44%. Everyone else was down.
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Agreed - the "losing market share" view is both factual, and irrelevant concurrently.

You can lose market share and concurrently grow in size and profitability.
 
One thing that works in Tesla's favor are the bad feelings the majors dealers have built up in the post C'vid supply chain disruption era by adding ADM and all the other BS charges. I believe that so many dealers have screwed over so many customers people will embrace the factory direct to customer model - people who previously wouldn't touch it.
 
Rmay635703 said:
What other company sells more sedans than Tesla?
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GM, Toyota, Honda, ... And Chrysler, Hyndai, and Kia were ahead until a year or few ago, with Tesla overtaking each only in very recent years. Ford has shifted to mostly trucks, its strength. Like Tesla focuses on cars. Hmmm...

But it's a baloney question, b/c almost 100% of Tecla's focus in on just a few models NICHE models of sedans. Essentially if you're inclined to want an EV there's almost no competition. Gas cars, there's probably 50 brands and model combinations to pick from. If you include the used gas car market (for which is almost non-existent for EVs), there's probably 20 million, maybe 50 millions used gas cars, maybe more. So new gas cars also compete against used gas cars. EVs don't have a significant cabalistic problem at the moment. Just wait.

What companies does Tesla outsell others in trucks?

Next question. Compare and rate the total number of all sedans on the road for each company, tell us where Tesla ranks? Heck, let's just narrow it to since Tesla's inception. Probably last.

See, bogus questions. Tesla has a very smart, but very temporary, niche competitive advantage of being a front-runner in EVs. Within 5 years, that advantage will be gone when most other make comparable EVs, and there's a used EV market to strip away new EV sales growth.
 
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leadcounsel said:
GM, Toyota, Honda, ... And Chrysler, Hyndai, and Kia were ahead until a year or few ago, with Tesla overtaking each only in very recent years. Ford has shifted to mostly trucks, its strength. Like Tesla focuses on cars. Hmmm...

See, bogus questions.
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You mean 5 years ago, (as shown below)

I don’t buy crossovers, cuvs or SUVs
You are right my options are very limited for a sedan, let alone an efficient one.

I am not a Tesla fan but 99% of the current vehicles on offer in the US are of no interest to me.

I do need another truck as well but unless I find a clean 5 speed manual 2wd 1980’s era diesel pickup or suburban that isn’t on the list either.

2DDA4D27-938B-4D94-A307-6F0BD1FA881A.jpeg
 
Rmay635703 said:
You mean 5 years ago, (as shown below)

I don’t buy crossovers, cuvs or SUVs
You are right my options are very limited for a sedan, let alone an efficient one.

I am not a Tesla fan but 99% of the current vehicles on offer in the US are of no interest to me.

I do need another truck as well but unless I find a clean 5 speed manual 2wd 1980’s era diesel pickup or suburban that isn’t on the list either.

View attachment 136597
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But it's misleading data.

Just with new ICE cars, a gas car shopper has 13 top selling offerings to pick from, making it a very saturated competitive market. EV shoppers have no other options, just Tesla basically. That is a extremely unique temporary competitive advantage. It's more accurate really to say "all ICE" versus Tesla.

Analogy, if you need a bike and there are 13 bicycle retailers but only 1 kayak retailer, who gets your business? How about if you need water transportation? The kayak dealer is the only game in town. That will change and eat into sales in 5 years.

The next reason it's misleading is that a ICE vehicle shopper might want new, but while shopping sees the used certified ICEs, or sees a used Craigslist Accord, etc. That pulls her over to the used market, not counted here. Tesla is too young and new to have much used market EV competition, for now. There's just not enough used ones available to eat into new sales. Wait 5 years.
 
alarmguy said:
Strikes terror in Tesla shareholders who have been beaten to a pulp the last two years. So bad some would like to see Musk removed as CEO last I remember.
Furthermore Tesla did not turn a profit in the USA 2021 just to keeps the fact straight.
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The profit Tesla made came from selling CO2 certificates, but with other car makers having their own EV now, and more coming all the time those Certificates are becoming worthless. Profit has to be made by selling cars and parts now....
 
I'm starting to see a lot of ads for the Acura all electric SUV, coming soon. It looks a lot nicer imo than any of the Tesla offerings. I'd be willing to bet the fit and finish is a lot better too. The competition is heating up. Tesla cut prices for a good reason I think, and I wouldn't be surprised if they start losing market share and the competitive edge in the next few years. Time will tell.
 
demarpaint said:
I'm starting to see a lot of ads for the Acura all electric SUV, coming soon. It looks a lot nicer imo than any of the Tesla offerings. I'd be willing to bet the fit and finish is a lot better too. The competition is heating up. Tesla cut prices for a good reason I think, and I wouldn't be surprised if they start losing market share and the competitive edge in the next few years. Time will tell.
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Supposedly Honda will be running ultium (GM) Battery packs.
 
UncleDave said:
Supposedly Honda will be running ultium (GM) Battery packs.
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We'll see. I wouldn't want to be an unpaid beta tester, but I'm sure Honda will work the bugs out. I'm also pretty sure in the next few years Tesla is going to lose market share as the other EV players evolve. To think that the only company in the EV space that is capable of progressing and evolving is Tesla would be a mistake imo.
 
demarpaint said:
We'll see. I wouldn't want to be an unpaid beta tester, but I'm sure Honda will work the bugs out. I'm also pretty sure in the next few years Tesla is going to lose market share as the other EV players evolve. To think that the only company in the EV space that is capable of progressing and evolving is Tesla would be a mistake imo.
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BMW switched to cylindrical...
Gm bet a whole bunch-o-money on this form factor- we'll see. ..
I hope it works well.
 
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