I think it would be a mistake to dismiss BITOG as an influence on Joe Schmoe. It might not be immediate, but what gets discussed here DOES start trickling down to the public. I lurked here for a long time off and on before I reg'ed for an account and made my first post, and I also lurk on other car boards, and on almost every one there's at least regular poster who obviously reads Bob. They spread memes on those boards, and granted, most of the regular posters on auto boards aren't necessarily Joe Schmoe, but Joe still sometimes reads those boards when he has a specific question. Even if he doesn't, the ideas still start spreading. Don't think for a minute that things on BITOG don't have an impact.
so why are so many ripped at Mobil?
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The more forums I visit over the years, more and more BITOG is the mentioned authority on where to find out all you can handle to learn about oil. Big difference compared to even 3 years ago.
Yes, it is referd to as the place to go for Lubrication know how. Besides the one on one contact we have while shopping or talking to my fleet manager for example.
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
I tried this argument earlier Tom. To no avail. The people with a hate-on for Exxon don't want this to turn around, and they refuse to accept the possibility that XOM may just be being as complete as possible in formulating their case.
That's really a cheap way out. On several occasions, you've accused anyone who's opinion differs as "Hating XOM."
People have legitimate doubts and questions - which are not being addressed. Don't go blaming them with accusations of being pro-Ashland sheep. Don't blame them for for 'hating' XOM (Why? "Just Because?") Blame XOM for stonewalling and evading any reasonably pointed question.
I tried this argument earlier Tom. To no avail. The people with a hate-on for Exxon don't want this to turn around, and they refuse to accept the possibility that XOM may just be being as complete as possible in formulating their case.
That's really a cheap way out. On several occasions, you've accused anyone who's opinion differs as "Hating XOM."
People have legitimate doubts and questions - which are not being addressed. Don't go blaming them with accusations of being pro-Ashland sheep. Don't blame them for for 'hating' XOM (Why? "Just Because?") Blame XOM for stonewalling and evading any reasonably pointed question.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: Geonerd
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
I tried this argument earlier Tom. To no avail. The people with a hate-on for Exxon don't want this to turn around, and they refuse to accept the possibility that XOM may just be being as complete as possible in formulating their case.
That's really a cheap way out. On several occasions, you've accused anyone who's opinion differs as "Hating XOM."
People have legitimate doubts and questions - which are not being addressed. Don't go blaming them with accusations of being pro-Ashland sheep. Don't blame them for for 'hating' XOM (Why? "Just Because?") Blame XOM for stonewalling and evading any reasonably pointed question.
Read a bit. It's sort of a fashion thing on here. Every once and a while, somebody will start a thread lambasting ExxonMobil and then bashing ensues. That is where my comment stems from. This happens a LOT.
I don't care which oil people like, it simply seems to always be in vogue to talk of ExxonMobil in a negative light.
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
I tried this argument earlier Tom. To no avail. The people with a hate-on for Exxon don't want this to turn around, and they refuse to accept the possibility that XOM may just be being as complete as possible in formulating their case.
That's really a cheap way out. On several occasions, you've accused anyone who's opinion differs as "Hating XOM."
People have legitimate doubts and questions - which are not being addressed. Don't go blaming them with accusations of being pro-Ashland sheep. Don't blame them for for 'hating' XOM (Why? "Just Because?") Blame XOM for stonewalling and evading any reasonably pointed question.
Read a bit. It's sort of a fashion thing on here. Every once and a while, somebody will start a thread lambasting ExxonMobil and then bashing ensues. That is where my comment stems from. This happens a LOT.
I don't care which oil people like, it simply seems to always be in vogue to talk of ExxonMobil in a negative light.
Originally Posted By: Geonerd
People have legitimate doubts and questions - which are not being addressed.
I am not sure what "legitimate doubts and questions" might be.
ExxonMobil has taken a pretty consistent position of running on performance, not formula.
People who want boutique oils, be they polyol esters, diesters, lead or titanium as an additive, teflon particles, are whatever have a wide variety of choices.
.
People have legitimate doubts and questions - which are not being addressed.
I am not sure what "legitimate doubts and questions" might be.
ExxonMobil has taken a pretty consistent position of running on performance, not formula.
People who want boutique oils, be they polyol esters, diesters, lead or titanium as an additive, teflon particles, are whatever have a wide variety of choices.
.
Whoa whoa whoa... As one of those guys who started a 'question-Mobil" thread on BITOG, let me say the following:
I Loved Mobil 1 before they lets Ashland's claims silence them.
Listen, If Mobil 1 comes out with a "New improved post-Ashland research" 5-30 or what not, they'll get me back. But they have to account for what they've been getting away with, that very thing that Ashland alleges they've done: which is affect MY engine with THEIR product. Now, its personal, Brother.
-A
I Loved Mobil 1 before they lets Ashland's claims silence them.
Listen, If Mobil 1 comes out with a "New improved post-Ashland research" 5-30 or what not, they'll get me back. But they have to account for what they've been getting away with, that very thing that Ashland alleges they've done: which is affect MY engine with THEIR product. Now, its personal, Brother.
-A
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: ARMY_Guy
Whoa whoa whoa... As one of those guys who started a 'question-Mobil" thread on BITOG, let me say the following:
I Loved Mobil 1 before they lets Ashland's claims silence them.
Listen, If Mobil 1 comes out with a "New improved post-Ashland research" 5-30 or what not, they'll get me back. But they have to account for what they've been getting away with, that very thing that Ashland alleges they've done: which is affect MY engine with THEIR product. Now, its personal, Brother.
-A
With all due respect, until there is some sort of full disclosure, we have no idea if they've been getting away with anything.
It's all speculation based on one-sided claims.
Whoa whoa whoa... As one of those guys who started a 'question-Mobil" thread on BITOG, let me say the following:
I Loved Mobil 1 before they lets Ashland's claims silence them.
Listen, If Mobil 1 comes out with a "New improved post-Ashland research" 5-30 or what not, they'll get me back. But they have to account for what they've been getting away with, that very thing that Ashland alleges they've done: which is affect MY engine with THEIR product. Now, its personal, Brother.
-A
With all due respect, until there is some sort of full disclosure, we have no idea if they've been getting away with anything.
It's all speculation based on one-sided claims.
Quote:
It's all speculation based on one-sided claims.
Their outright dismissal of Ashland's claims with their silence automatically confirm many's suspicion. It sure as heck does mine.
If they've done nothing wrong... Prove it! They can afford it.
-A
It's all speculation based on one-sided claims.
Their outright dismissal of Ashland's claims with their silence automatically confirm many's suspicion. It sure as heck does mine.
If they've done nothing wrong... Prove it! They can afford it.
-A
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: ARMY_Guy
Quote:
It's all speculation based on one-sided claims.
Their outright dismissal of Ashland's claims with their silence automatically confirm many's suspicion. It sure as heck does mine.
If they've done nothing wrong... Prove it! They can afford it.
-A
And they likely will. After they do their own evaluation, testing, and form a bulletproof lawsuit.
These things take time.
In the interim, they are simply saying nothing at all other than that their licenses are all currently valid. This is probably all they are allowed to say.
Quote:
It's all speculation based on one-sided claims.
Their outright dismissal of Ashland's claims with their silence automatically confirm many's suspicion. It sure as heck does mine.
If they've done nothing wrong... Prove it! They can afford it.
-A
And they likely will. After they do their own evaluation, testing, and form a bulletproof lawsuit.
These things take time.
In the interim, they are simply saying nothing at all other than that their licenses are all currently valid. This is probably all they are allowed to say.
Until the dust settled, I'll continue to buy M1 if they are dirt cheap, such as $2/qt or less. If the final price (after rebate, if any) is more than $3/qt, I'll look elsewhere. Actually, I only buy oils (dino or synthetic) if they are dirt cheap, because I still have enough oils for 4-5 years.
Originally Posted By: Rolf
Originally Posted By: Geonerd
People have legitimate doubts and questions - which are not being addressed.
I am not sure what "legitimate doubts and questions" might be.
ExxonMobil has taken a pretty consistent position of running on performance, not formula.
That's a good point. They've been this way ever since 'synthetic' ceased to have meaning.
People have legitimate doubts when asked to blindly fork over big bucks for whatever mystery meat the deli is serving today. Buying M1 is kinda like a night out at the Chinese restaurant. You hope it's chicken, but really don't want to think too hard it. For what they are charging, XOM should work to assure customers that they didn't just eat Rover (generic Grp3).
Perhaps part of the 'problem' is that their position is inherently insecure, relying on years-old data and tests. Without clear, forthright communication, it eventually boils down to 'trust us.' With a little nudge from Valvoline's propaganda department (and remember, they're not really any more forthcoming.), XOM's own marketing program is suddenly starting to look a little shaky. Throw in a healthy dose of corporate arrogance and cautious, economically squeezed customers; suddenly you've got the seeds of a real problem. (At least among the BITOG crowd.
)
-Moo!
Originally Posted By: Geonerd
People have legitimate doubts and questions - which are not being addressed.
I am not sure what "legitimate doubts and questions" might be.
ExxonMobil has taken a pretty consistent position of running on performance, not formula.
That's a good point. They've been this way ever since 'synthetic' ceased to have meaning.
People have legitimate doubts when asked to blindly fork over big bucks for whatever mystery meat the deli is serving today. Buying M1 is kinda like a night out at the Chinese restaurant. You hope it's chicken, but really don't want to think too hard it. For what they are charging, XOM should work to assure customers that they didn't just eat Rover (generic Grp3).
Perhaps part of the 'problem' is that their position is inherently insecure, relying on years-old data and tests. Without clear, forthright communication, it eventually boils down to 'trust us.' With a little nudge from Valvoline's propaganda department (and remember, they're not really any more forthcoming.), XOM's own marketing program is suddenly starting to look a little shaky. Throw in a healthy dose of corporate arrogance and cautious, economically squeezed customers; suddenly you've got the seeds of a real problem. (At least among the BITOG crowd.
-Moo!
I await their ad campaign and research stats. to dispute Ashland's claims. This, boys, is going to be great!
-A
-A
Originally Posted By: ARMY_Guy
I await their ad campaign and research stats. to dispute Ashland's claims. This, boys, is going to be great!
-A
I love a good fight!
What could be better?
I await their ad campaign and research stats. to dispute Ashland's claims. This, boys, is going to be great!
-A
I love a good fight!
It will be entertaining when the rebuttal if it ever begins.
Originally Posted By: ARMY_Guy
Listen, If Mobil 1 comes out with a "New improved post-Ashland research" 5-30 or what not, they'll get me back. But they have to account for what they've been getting away with, that very thing that Ashland alleges they've done: which is affect MY engine with THEIR product. Now, its personal, Brother.
Lubrication has never been a religious issue for me personally.
I'll stick to facts, of which there appear to be none.
.
Listen, If Mobil 1 comes out with a "New improved post-Ashland research" 5-30 or what not, they'll get me back. But they have to account for what they've been getting away with, that very thing that Ashland alleges they've done: which is affect MY engine with THEIR product. Now, its personal, Brother.
Lubrication has never been a religious issue for me personally.
I'll stick to facts, of which there appear to be none.
.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: Geonerd
Originally Posted By: Rolf
Originally Posted By: Geonerd
People have legitimate doubts and questions - which are not being addressed.
I am not sure what "legitimate doubts and questions" might be.
ExxonMobil has taken a pretty consistent position of running on performance, not formula.
That's a good point. They've been this way ever since 'synthetic' ceased to have meaning.
People have legitimate doubts when asked to blindly fork over big bucks for whatever mystery meat the deli is serving today. Buying M1 is kinda like a night out at the Chinese restaurant. You hope it's chicken, but really don't want to think too hard it. For what they are charging, XOM should work to assure customers that they didn't just eat Rover (generic Grp3).
Perhaps part of the 'problem' is that their position is inherently insecure, relying on years-old data and tests. Without clear, forthright communication, it eventually boils down to 'trust us.' With a little nudge from Valvoline's propaganda department (and remember, they're not really any more forthcoming.), XOM's own marketing program is suddenly starting to look a little shaky. Throw in a healthy dose of corporate arrogance and cautious, economically squeezed customers; suddenly you've got the seeds of a real problem. (At least among the BITOG crowd.
)
-Moo!
Yet they are the first to meet manufacturer specs. Look at Honda HTO-06. Only two oils; M1 and PP are approved.
Originally Posted By: Rolf
Originally Posted By: Geonerd
People have legitimate doubts and questions - which are not being addressed.
I am not sure what "legitimate doubts and questions" might be.
ExxonMobil has taken a pretty consistent position of running on performance, not formula.
That's a good point. They've been this way ever since 'synthetic' ceased to have meaning.
People have legitimate doubts when asked to blindly fork over big bucks for whatever mystery meat the deli is serving today. Buying M1 is kinda like a night out at the Chinese restaurant. You hope it's chicken, but really don't want to think too hard it. For what they are charging, XOM should work to assure customers that they didn't just eat Rover (generic Grp3).
Perhaps part of the 'problem' is that their position is inherently insecure, relying on years-old data and tests. Without clear, forthright communication, it eventually boils down to 'trust us.' With a little nudge from Valvoline's propaganda department (and remember, they're not really any more forthcoming.), XOM's own marketing program is suddenly starting to look a little shaky. Throw in a healthy dose of corporate arrogance and cautious, economically squeezed customers; suddenly you've got the seeds of a real problem. (At least among the BITOG crowd.
-Moo!
Yet they are the first to meet manufacturer specs. Look at Honda HTO-06. Only two oils; M1 and PP are approved.
Last edited by a moderator:
Originally Posted By: Geonerd
People have legitimate doubts when asked to blindly fork over big bucks for whatever mystery meat the deli is serving today. Buying M1 is kinda like a night out at the Chinese restaurant.
There are three Mobil 1 5w30 oils - the standard issue, the EP, and a Truck and SUV version.
Some folks get good results with all of them:
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/posts/1292448/
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/posts/1292448/
and with the 0W-30:
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/posts/1292448/
Since I'm interested in lubricating my engine, I await some facts.
The entire Group III brouhaha a couple of years ago was a giant waste of everyone's time and drove some good posters out.
This silly bit of Ashland advertising is turning into the same sort of witch hunt.
I never made my balloon bigger by poking a hole in someone else's.
.
People have legitimate doubts when asked to blindly fork over big bucks for whatever mystery meat the deli is serving today. Buying M1 is kinda like a night out at the Chinese restaurant.
There are three Mobil 1 5w30 oils - the standard issue, the EP, and a Truck and SUV version.
Some folks get good results with all of them:
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/posts/1292448/
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/posts/1292448/
and with the 0W-30:
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/posts/1292448/
Since I'm interested in lubricating my engine, I await some facts.
The entire Group III brouhaha a couple of years ago was a giant waste of everyone's time and drove some good posters out.
This silly bit of Ashland advertising is turning into the same sort of witch hunt.
I never made my balloon bigger by poking a hole in someone else's.
.
Originally Posted By: Rolf
Lubrication has never been a religious issue for me personally. I'll stick to facts, of which there appear to be none.
I love my Jeep more than you love your vehicle, too. I'll await their response, and in the meantime - stock up on good stuff like Motul, PP, etc.
-A
Lubrication has never been a religious issue for me personally. I'll stick to facts, of which there appear to be none.
I love my Jeep more than you love your vehicle, too. I'll await their response, and in the meantime - stock up on good stuff like Motul, PP, etc.
-A
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