Retiring early... Geographic arbitrage

mikeduf said:
Yes I probably wasn't too clear what I was referring to was if you denounce your citizenship to the USA and live abroad permanently you will lose your Social Security. That is what the Social Security Administration told me. You no longer are a citizen and have no further rights. Unless of course you have dual citizenship but that's a different topic.
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That clears it up. If you are not a USA citizen (or denounce it) you do have to return every 6 months.
 
mikeduf said:
Yes I probably wasn't too clear what I was referring to was if you denounce your citizenship to the USA and live abroad permanently you will lose your Social Security. That is what the Social Security Administration told me. You no longer are a citizen and have no further rights. Unless of course you have dual citizenship but that's a different topic.
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That clears up our discussion, thanks.
I believe you can live outside the USA indefinitely (assuming you are a US Citizen as long as you send in that required form every year and file USA tax returns, according to everything I read. There is no time limit.

The only thing that might limit you is the country you decide to live in, you must conform to their rules if you are planning to stay indefinitely. With that said, it is easy to do in known retirement countries. But for sure, one must research the requirements.
 
mikeduf said:
Yes I probably wasn't too clear what I was referring to was if you denounce your citizenship to the USA and live abroad permanently you will lose your Social Security. That is what the Social Security Administration told me. You no longer are a citizen and have no further rights. Unless of course you have dual citizenship but that's a different topic.
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Why would anyone renounce there citizenship unless they were truly wealthy and trying to get around taxes?
 
Vil_Riker said:
Recently have been quite a few posts about retiring early, retiring and moving abroad, etc.

This has started really bugging me, in a nice way. In the last couple of years I have lost a lot of family members, some were in their early 70-s, some were younger. Seemingly healthy people just died suddenly - cancer or cardiac reasons. If I am to follow their life expectancy, I don't have much time left either. I am fully inoculated (just like they were) so I think I'm a high risk for "unexplained excess death" statistic.

The sad thing is that I can't retire in the US. My monthly income from unburdened funds is enough to pay for rent but not enough for food and utilities. And I'm not even talking about health insurance. Even the junkiest plan on the exchange will be unaffordable to use.

I've been looking into doing this abroad. I can live fairly decently in Mexico or South East Asia - Thailand, Malaysia or Vietnam. I just don't imagine making that leap.

Have any of our BITOGers contemplated this, or actually made the leap?
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It's relatively easy to live to 90. You need to live to 89 then be real careful for the next year!
 
alarmguy said:
AMAZING, I am reading this and watch videos on your very comment as you are 100% correct. Me, not exactly a world traveler I am learning so much how much of the world has caught up to our standard of living. I hear, watch and read how amazing the Thai people are as well as others in the Pacific Rim. But what is even more amazing is value for the dollar and standard of living. Some of these places are so amazing that is hard for us (including me) in the USA who think we are at the cutting edge of everything, well we are not.

Well I am about to get a dose of this Asia scene shortly for a few weeks with my wife. Dont misunderstand my post. I love the USA but we aren't the only place on the planet ... and we aren't the end of all of luxury living and quality of life. I see even the clubs there, exciting raving music clubs but the young are having a blast, good times, laughing not street fighting and causing trouble.

I hear and see stories of people who went there and stayed. Kind of funny one video was from someplace over there, returned home to the UK to save up money in order to return there and stay for good.
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There are cases of people committing suicide at the airport because they didn't want to leave Thailand. It must be a really good place.
 
Dave Hess said:
Only problem I see retiring overseas is that many people don’t like Americans and they know you have money so you’re always a target.
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Well, you can’t lump the entire planet earth nations into one category as far as who likes Americans
I can tell you right now a lot of people in south east Asia like Americans and more than welcoming. But I can see some being leery of obnoxious Americans.
 
mikeduf said:
Every document I have read for a US national leaving the country especially Italy. you can only stay for a 90-day tourist Visa or an extended 6-month Visa.

Of which a 6-month Visa extended has to have a form to be filled out and approved before you attempt to stay for 6 months.

Also after the 6 months in Italy or any other European country you have to return to the USA to retain your residency.

This has been the rule for at least the last two years since I have searched for Extended Stays in Italy.

6 months is all we get legally. But of course you can come back for 30 days, fill out the paperwork for another 6 month extended visa and return to Italy.
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I think based the discussion, this is a big world and I am sure anyone moving to another country for retirement will get legal advice from that country. It's readily available. However I know nothing about the subject except below. As I have looked into it.
Another area besides Costa Rica was the Philippines. As far as Europe? No way wasnt even on my map. . As far as coming back to the USA I would not even comment in here as that means legal advice. I do know you can collect Social Security forever outside the USA in almost the entire world with a few exceptions and do not have to return here for Social Security, al you need do is fill out a form once a year and file your taxes

For example Costa Rica, a popular retirement for the US. 3 years of temporary residence you can apply for permanent.
AS far as the USA, at the least you can continue to live the rest of your life outside the USA and collect Social Security.

"There is no time limit on how long a person can live outside the country and receive benefits. They will continue indefinitely while proof of life documents are signed and returned. Known formally as the report to the United States Social Security Administration, Form SSA-7162 is two pages long and asks about changes to a person’s residency and marital status, among other things. Depending on a person’s age and country of residence, the forms may be mailed annually or biannually."

source - https://money.usnews.com/money/reti...utside-the-u-s-without-losing-social-security
 
Vil_Riker said:
Recently have been quite a few posts about retiring early, retiring and moving abroad, etc.

This has started really bugging me, in a nice way. In the last couple of years I have lost a lot of family members, some were in their early 70-s, some were younger. Seemingly healthy people just died suddenly - cancer or cardiac reasons. If I am to follow their life expectancy, I don't have much time left either. I am fully inoculated (just like they were) so I think I'm a high risk for "unexplained excess death" statistic.

The sad thing is that I can't retire in the US. My monthly income from unburdened funds is enough to pay for rent but not enough for food and utilities. And I'm not even talking about health insurance. Even the junkiest plan on the exchange will be unaffordable to use.

I've been looking into doing this abroad. I can live fairly decently in Mexico or South East Asia - Thailand, Malaysia or Vietnam. I just don't imagine making that leap.

Have any of our BITOGers contemplated this, or actually made the leap?
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My mother lived in Mexico back in the late 60s. Interesting stories.

I thought about moving to Pitcairn Island, or just loading up a truck, and retreating into some Pacific NW forest. And wandering, but not getting lost.
 
Pablo said:
Friend of wife wants to move to Germany because of the election result. Other than the hilarious irony of that, they won't have her.
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Imagine that.

I have been to the Pacific Northwest, and it is pretty. One could get lost out there, and never found, all within its majesty.
 
I agree with a earlier post and personally I can’t imagine retiring outside the USA.
Everyone wants to be “home” imho towards the sunset years. Now if someone has ties to another country that is understandable.

I also worry too about health care. “First world problems” come to mind. That is a better problem than a non first world country’s problems, imho.

So I agree with getting things in order, it can be done, rather than to seek cheaper alternatives.

Time > money at some point…
 
John105 said:
I agree with a earlier post and personally I can’t imagine retiring outside the USA.
Everyone wants to be “home” imho towards the sunset years. Now if someone has ties to another country that is understandable.

I also worry too about health care. “First world problems” come to mind. That is a better problem than a non first world country’s problems, imho.

So I agree with getting things in order, it can be done, rather than to seek cheaper alternatives.

Time > money at some point…
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I agree.....so far. I am about to retire in a month. Between my wife and I (she is already retired), we will get by but will have to live very modestly. It's expensive where I live. Not as much as the nearby cities, but still not cheap. We have thought about living in Mexico (wife is from there), but the thought of doing so tends to concern me. I have worries living in a place where the U.S. Constitution, laws, and freedoms wouldn't protect me. I love my country (at least what it used to be) and just can't see myself moving to another one. Others have suggested moving to other areas of the U.S. where the cost of living is substantially lower. To me that could be a possibility I could deal with.
 
If we were going to become expats after my retirement (wife already there) I think Portugal would be a strong contender. A developed world EU nation with a nice climate, plenty of coast and lots of ancient architecture that is also fairly inexpensive.
My greatest concern is health care, a greater consideration as one grows older.
At fifty, I never had any such thought cross my mind.
 
burbguy82 said:
"health care".....what a term.

has nothing to do about health, and typically, unless you get a good nurse, it has nothing to do with care.

the US healthcare system is a joke.
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When I got my 65 yo so called Medicare examination, it was "exam lite" and doc even joked about folk over 65, not wanting to look too deep, because always finding something wrong. (Kinda like a '65 anything, I suppose)

It's not a joke to the docs who get $1500/pop for prescribing statins to healthy people!
 
burbguy82 said:
"health care".....what a term.

has nothing to do about health, and typically, unless you get a good nurse, it has nothing to do with care.

the US healthcare system is a joke.
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I can’t disagree. In 1998 my physician called PCP was a cardiologist. She told me health care is not about treating patients. It’s about cost/benefit analyses. In 1998. Back then? My copay was $5 and I tried to avoid spending it. Think about the HSA and HRA and FSA. These concepts were INVENTED.

All I can say is when employers “claim” costs have gone up, they’re doing the 48 Oz half gallon OJ. If an employer pays 90% I’m good with rising costs, cuz they are providing and bearing the brunt. But this isn’t true
 
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