Redline...

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Originally Posted By: Tom NJ
There are a number of other factors that also influence the effects of esters and PAOs on seals, such as seal chemistry, seal variability, temperature, and load.

In reality, none of this is relevant in well formulated motor oils since seal effects are measured and controlled in the formulating process.

Personally, I would avoid any oil that claims to be based entirely on esters or PAOs unless I knew the complete formulation and how the formulator dealt with seal balance.

Tom NJ


Excellent!! There are SO many posters on BITOG who think Redline is 100% ester and others who think other oils are 100% PAO. I've been repeating this for years, but the "myth" seems to persist. (Not like it hasn't been fueled by the oil blenders as well!!!)
 
Originally Posted By: DAB1123
Originally Posted By: Ben99GT
Originally Posted By: BobFout
Originally Posted By: DAB1123
I've seen their specs & i'm not the least bit impressed.


What specs were you comparing?


See his sig? You want to bet the specs he's seen are from Amsoil literature?
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Not at all. The specs I looked at was on RLs' own web-site.


Dave at Redline has been very helpful in answering our questions, it's worth an e-mail or call to him.
 
Originally Posted By: DAB1123
Originally Posted By: BobFout
Originally Posted By: DAB1123
No, he's not ignorant about anything automotive. Last time I saw him, he had a Jeep CJ-5 with a 4 speed manual, which engine he rebuilt himself, big $$$$. But that Jeep would stand up & STAY up as he shifted through all 4 gears. Even in 4th, he'd have to back off before it would come back down.


This has what to do with oil?

Nothing to do with Oil, just proof of his knowledge. Anyone who can build an engine like that knows his stuff!!


His ability to build engines really just doesn't apply to this conversation. Guys who build computers are not always knowledgeable about what software to put on them.

You'd think he'd be in touch with people who race or have hi-po engines....
 
Originally Posted By: DAB1123
Has anyone ever bothered to compair Red Line specs against others? I know a Mechanic who won't touch it!


Is it just me or is most Amsoil folks always the ones "that have a friend that said..." type of people?

No Pun intended there, but Amsoil actually upsets me. They think their Oil walks on water or something. Geeze. Yes, it is a good oil, but don't jam it down my throat.

Additonally, I have done allot of reading on this board. There are folks here that can back me up on that because I have started so many topics about what oil to use, and what not to obtain information.

It seems that with Redlines Ester base stocks, pretty stout additive package and HTHS and Flashpoint #'s for a 30w (that I would use) is just awesome. You can't deny it. Plus its cost. It is very fairly priced at $9.95 per qt.

I will be ordering the Redline 5/30 for my Evo next month. I will do a VOA and a UOA and see how it goes. I do agree that UOA's are a bit trendy and don't really provide that much "real" data for a guy that will change his oil every 3K. If your into EDI's then UOA's are crucial. In my case, I will do the UOA's just to see a comparo vs my PAO based oils. Thats all.

I have found Redline as a company to be pretty darn good. They are not pushy, they don't throw stupid test results in your face that really mean nothing in the real world, and they are laid back and are happy to talk to you. Even when I brought up a competitors oil in subject, they never mock or say anything bad about anyone. Just try our oil and you tell us what you think type of attitude. I just liked that approach WAY better than the "our oil walks on water" approach.

Thanks for all the input on here guys and gals. Very helpful.
 
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I must admit something though, even though I have pretty much decided on Redline to try out, I just can't help but want to try out the M1 HM 10/30 too. I mean, on paper that stuff is really good. You all have seen the specs on it so I wont go into it, but $24 for 5qts at WallyWorld I mean, dang, you can't beat the Performance vs Value on that oil.
28.gif
 
Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
I must admit something though, even though I have pretty much decided on Redline to try out, I just can't help but want to try out the M1 HM 10/30 too. I mean, on paper that stuff is really good. You all have seen the specs on it so I wont go into it, but $24 for 5qts at WallyWorld I mean, dang, you can't beat the Performance vs Value on that oil.
28.gif



I can't disagree, I think M1 HM is almost a sleeper race oil.
 
Originally Posted By: Pablo
Originally Posted By: Tom NJ
There are a number of other factors that also influence the effects of esters and PAOs on seals, such as seal chemistry, seal variability, temperature, and load.

In reality, none of this is relevant in well formulated motor oils since seal effects are measured and controlled in the formulating process.

Personally, I would avoid any oil that claims to be based entirely on esters or PAOs unless I knew the complete formulation and how the formulator dealt with seal balance.

Tom NJ


Excellent!! There are SO many posters on BITOG who think Redline is 100% ester and others who think other oils are 100% PAO. I've been repeating this for years, but the "myth" seems to persist. (Not like it hasn't been fueled by the oil blenders as well!!!)

I think it's a combination of people thinking that they see something that isn't there, or some web site misrepresenting the facts.

Example:
From Redline.com:
Fully-synthetic ester formula

Motul Canada re 300V:
100% Synthetic – Double Ester Technology

Motorspot.com re Motul 300V
100% Ester synthetic

IMO, Motorspot put two key words in a different order and that changes the meaning.

-Dennis
 
Redline:

Pro's-
Small American company.
Only majority POE oil available in multiple grades.
Many special viscosity grades.
Excellent customer service.
Extremely shear stable and resistant to high temperatures.
Lot of ZDP for racing/engines with flat tappet cams.

Con's-
Value.
No API Certification.
Overkill for most cars on the road.
Limited Extended Drain capability.
Availability.
 
Buster I would also add:

-Small American company but sells product internationally.
-First and foremost they are a race oil manufacturer
-all their race oils and many of their street oils are VII free.
-Your can mix and match all their oils
-very low Coefficient of Friction
-Most of their oils contain a boat load of moly
 
That works.

I would add marketing to the Pro's. Much more professional approach. No gimmicky tests. Downside is no certification.

At one time, Maxima was thinking about making a full line of majority Ester based API SM oils. I think Redline feels ZDP is still the most cost effective anti wear additive.

They are definitely a race oil first, PCMO second....people that use RL in Honda Accords that do short trip driving would see no benefit with this oil. It's built more for more extreme conditions.
 
Maxima is motorcycle-oriented but their president has told me personally that he runs their stuff in both his and his wife's cars. Most moto oils are just fine for cars (I run Motul's 300V moto variety and the UOAs are fine).

Maxima's 530MX/RR oils are very rich in esters. I am considering running their Maxum4 Ultra 5w40 sometime. It's a very light 5w40 with a decent HTHS figure (4.05) and good basestocks. Price is decent too (about on par with Redline).
 
Write RL and M1 HM (and maybe RLI and ester based Motul) on separate pieces of paper. Throw them in a hat and pick one.
banana2.gif


19.gif

-Dennis
 
Originally Posted By: bluesubie
Write RL and M1 HM (and maybe RLI and ester based Motul) on separate pieces of paper. Throw them in a hat and pick one.
banana2.gif


19.gif

-Dennis



Depends which variety of Motul. There are several 8100s and then there's race-oil 300V.
 
Thanks for trying to help me out guys. I don't mean to be so dificult to decide. To me, I agree, Redline in a grocery getter is overkill. But what about a 400bhp Rally Car grocery getter? haha. I figure which a turbo, 26psi of boost, 7950rpm fuel cut redline, and 200bhp per liter, even if I get groceries the Redline should be ok for my application.

Dave at redline recommended the 5/30 instead of 10/30 that Mitsubishi Recommends. Dave feels the turbo will spool quicker with the 5/30. I trust him. So if I order Redline I will get the 5/30.

Im just trying to decide on either the Redline 5/30, Amsoil RD30 or the RP XPR 5/30.

I have been running M1 EP for over 30K miles, but am willing to try something new. I did use RP XPR 10/40 while experimenting with water/methanol injection. I ditched that effort and so went the 10/40 XPR, back to M1 EP now. I will change to one of the 3 I mentioned very very soon.

Decisions, Decisions.
 
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XPR is too much of an unknown. RP doesn't publish or share data on those. To me, not worth it.

Try something like Redline 5w30 or Motul 300V 5w30. Both can handle turbo abuse.
 
Originally Posted By: Ben99GT
Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
I must admit something though, even though I have pretty much decided on Redline to try out, I just can't help but want to try out the M1 HM 10/30 too. I mean, on paper that stuff is really good. You all have seen the specs on it so I wont go into it, but $24 for 5qts at WallyWorld I mean, dang, you can't beat the Performance vs Value on that oil.
28.gif



I can't disagree, I think M1 HM is almost a sleeper race oil.


Yes the M1 HM 10/30 was an oil I was going to try out as well. I forgot to mention that one. Anyone else agree that its a "sleeper race oil"

M1 just confuses me though. Their EP is group 3, HM is Group 4? and the HM cost less? The HM has more ZDDP, than EP and about the same Moly and Baron, and the HM has a 3.6 HTHS vs EP's 3.2 HTHS.

On Paper, you can almost see the "sleeper race oil"

Comments on that?
 
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