Recommending Oil Change without oil filter

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Originally Posted By: LargeCarManX2
Originally Posted By: callbay
If you don't change the filter you are mixing the old flter full of old oil with the new oil. What a dumb thing to do!


You can't get around used (I would not call it dirty) oil that stays in the engine as well...a quart or so stay's clinging to the insides of the engine.


Lesseee... If what you say is true then we should only have to add five quarts when the system is listed as holding six... I've filled fresh engines that have just been assembled and the were full(or at least nearly so), when the prescribed amount of oil was added...

If you use the quickie oil change place then there well could be a substantial amount of oil remaining in the engine, but I usually let mine drain for 30 minutes or more while I do other maintenance...
 
there are usually two figures, a dry fill and a normal fill

most manuals don't include the dry fill amount

oil filters on hondas typically hold 1/4 of a quart of oil

some say to leave the filters in because they get more efficient as they get older

i don't think we're talking about big differences either way. this is starting to sound like an argument over religion.
 
Why not split the difference then? Used filters are more efficient, then drain the oil and the filter. No point leaving in some instances close to a qt of dirty oil in the filter to mix in with the fresh oil, it makes no sense to me. If I were going to use a filter for two OCI I'd drain the filter too. Otherwise toss the filter and change it with each OC. JMO
 
Father, if your Acura dealer were changing your oil, they would recommend you change you filter every second oil change. We could debate the rationale for this, but that's what Honda and Acura dealers are doing now unless a customer insists they change the filter every time (and pays for it, of course). Do-it-yourselfers, on the other hand, by and large change the filter every time, as reflected here.

On a related subject, I noticed from your other posts that your upcoming oil/filter change will be the first time you've done this in a while (years). I also noticed that you are a military chaplain. Since you haven't done this in a while, were I you, I'd do the work at your post/base auto hobby shop and ask the guys who are working there if they'd mind looking over your shoulder. I know from decades of using post facilities they won't mind at all. They'll also dispose of your used oil and filter for you.
 
Dont confuse this guy.If you just take off the old filter and drain it,then put it back on,you are taking a big chance on the gasket not sealing again.Makes no sense,just put a new one on with each oil change.There are too many people on here that are obsessed with maxing out usage of both oil and filters. They are both cheap and for your peace of mind just change both each time. Good luck
 
Originally Posted By: Hounds
Father, if your Acura dealer were changing your oil, they would recommend you change you filter every second oil change. We could debate the rationale for this, but that's what Honda and Acura dealers are doing now unless a customer insists they change the filter every time (and pays for it, of course). Do-it-yourselfers, on the other hand, by and large change the filter every time, as reflected here.

On a related subject, I noticed from your other posts that your upcoming oil/filter change will be the first time you've done this in a while (years). I also noticed that you are a military chaplain. Since you haven't done this in a while, were I you, I'd do the work at your post/base auto hobby shop and ask the guys who are working there if they'd mind looking over your shoulder. I know from decades of using post facilities they won't mind at all. They'll also dispose of your used oil and filter for you.



That's what I was planning. Visited with them yesterday and plan to go tomorrow (Saturday) and do the change. Both nervous about it and excited.
 
Originally Posted By: FZ1
New oil:New filter.


Of course. It's amazing what people will do to say a nickel. $25-35K car and try to save $5 on an oil filter once a year.
 
Originally Posted By: callbay
If you don't change the filter you are mixing the old flter full of old oil with the new oil. What a dumb thing to do!


And what do you do when you have a car where you can't get all the oil out of the oil cooler lines during an oil change?

My RX-8 is one of those vehicles, with nearly 2 quarts of oil in the two oil coolers in the front of the car that you can't easily drain out during an oil change.

BC.
 
Originally Posted By: tig1
Originally Posted By: FZ1
New oil:New filter.


Of course. It's amazing what people will do to say a nickel. $25-35K car and try to save $5 on an oil filter once a year.

35k new car and try to save on the $3 filter, want it for $2. Save $2 per year. Then they happily drive to play a $100 round of golf and go pay for a $100 dinner, or more.

Bypass should be mentioned, older filters bypass more as they fill. Whether they filter better is open to opinions. I haven't seen where anyone really considers bypass, as a filter quality. My 98 Chrysler van says to change filter every other oil change, normal service not severe. I follow the severe.

They have nothing to lose do they. Also makes it look better on the maintenance cost ads.
 
Originally Posted By: tig1
Originally Posted By: FZ1
New oil:New filter.


Of course. It's amazing what people will do to say a nickel. $25-35K car and try to save $5 on an oil filter once a year.


Saving a nickel wasn't what I had in mind when I asked the question. I already bought the filter but was surprised at Acura not recommending changing it every time.

FWIW, I believe every time I've taken it to the dealer they've changed the filter - they certainly have charged the same.

As another note, some folks over at a Lexus forum I go to use the same logic - the cost of the cars - to call anybody who changes their own oil as cheap or crazy. Go figure.
 
With the Honda V6 in the MDX I would use a full syn and not go further then 5K miles between changes. Honda is starting to have issues with higher mileage V6's and I know because my MDX had an engine knock. Yes, I did change the oil at least twice a year and under 5K miles. I did use conventional oil for the first 30K miles. Finally sold the MDX with 135K miles. The knock got bad after 95K mile...
 
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With the amount we drive with our current situation the 5k mark and 1 year mark are happening at about the same time. If this year proves less hectic than last year then I'll really consider doing a six month oci. This year I looked up and realized it had already been closer to nine or ten months - d'oh.
 
Originally Posted By: callbay
If you don't change the filter you are mixing the old flter full of old oil with the new oil. What a dumb thing to do!

Well then I guess Ford and GM as well as others have done some dumb things! Some of my older Fords used to recommend 7,500 miles 6 months OCI and change the filter every other time.

Originally Posted By: LargeCarManX2
You can't get around used (I would not call it dirty) oil that stays in the engine as well...a quart or so stay's clinging to the insides of the engine. The contaminates stay in the oil filter and the oil is still good just spent a little. So I don't think its a (dumb thing to do). Oem oil changes are fine, but if you push the oil, change the filter as well.


Agreed. You will never get ALL the oil out of the engine no matter how long you let it drain. Most oil filters aren't anywhere close to a quart these days. I usually prefill a new filter when I install them and NONE of my vehicles came anywhere close to taking a quart to fill them.

That being said - in this regard I'm like most people and change the filter every time.
 
Originally Posted By: cadfaeltex
Originally Posted By: tig1
Originally Posted By: FZ1
New oil:New filter.


Of course. It's amazing what people will do to say a nickel. $25-35K car and try to save $5 on an oil filter once a year.


Saving a nickel wasn't what I had in mind when I asked the question. I already bought the filter but was surprised at Acura not recommending changing it every time.

FWIW, I believe every time I've taken it to the dealer they've changed the filter - they certainly have charged the same.

As another note, some folks over at a Lexus forum I go to use the same logic - the cost of the cars - to call anybody who changes their own oil as cheap or crazy. Go figure.


I have been changing my oil since 1964, and the reason I do it myself is because I don't trust others to do it in the manner I expect.(lose oil filters, spill oil on the engine, over tighten the drain plug,etc. I am not aware of any other car company that recomends only changing the oil filter with every other OC. Maybe Honda engineeres aren't as wise as many make them out to be.
 
It is amazing to me that people believe they know better than people who actually designed, tested these engines and have access to service and repair data from dealerships.
 
The real question is:

Is Honda/Acura saying not to replace the filter at every oil change because a) re-using the filter is BETTER for the engine in some way, or b) it just simply isn't necessary with today's engines and oils?

Personally, I believe it's the latter which is why I'd change the flter every OCI simply for that warm and fuzzy feeling.
 
But, changing the filter every other OC will not alter the life of the engine, it really makes no difference in a properly operating engine. Don't believe me, do three oil changes one the normal interval and don't change the filter and then do it again and change the filter and get a UOA and then after the next change get anotherrUOA and I will be the results will be basically the same. It was when I did it.

You give way too much credit to what an oil filter does!!!!!!!!!
 
Originally Posted By: VRAY
Dont confuse this guy.If you just take off the old filter and drain it,then put it back on,you are taking a big chance on the gasket not sealing again.Makes no sense,just put a new one on with each oil change.There are too many people on here that are obsessed with maxing out usage of both oil and filters. They are both cheap and for your peace of mind just change both each time. Good luck


I've removed and drained filters with no issue. Having said that I change my filters at every OC. To me it makes ZERO sense to leave an old filter on when changing oil. Also part of an oil change is to check for leaks.
 
Quote:

Of course. It's amazing what people will do to say a nickel. $25-35K car and try to save $5 on an oil filter once a year.

not not doing to save money, not doing it because it is unnecessary. The same reason you don't drain your m1 @ 5K miles.
 
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