R22 systems? Keep them running or what?

[The motor guy]

Condensor fan motor went out at the rent house. They wanted $11k to put a new 3.5 ton goodman unit in. $1300 to install a new fan motor that probably cost $100 so I went the cheap route. These newer r410a units seem to be pooched after about 10 years and I've heard the r22 units lasting 20 years easy. Do you think I made the right call? If it goes another year I'll be happy. Current system is 17 years old. I have a new system in my house and they had to come back out like 4 times for various little issues that imo were poor installation issues. I also hate to put a brand new system in that the tenant probably won't bother changing the filter on. Etc
Opinions?

 

[atikovi]

34 year old Amana system at home. Replaced the condenser fan motor 3 years ago myself for under $100. Add 2-3 pounds R22 every 2-3 years and it runs just fine. New systems have Chinese made compressors and other components that won't last 10 years.

 

[The motor guy]

34 year old Amana system at home. Replaced the condenser fan motor 3 years ago myself for under $100. Add 2-3 pounds R22 every 2-3 years and it runs just fine. New systems have Chinese made compressors and other components that won't last 10 years.

I was worried the fan motor was going to cause it to burp out freon from over pressurizing, but the tech said the compressor has a safety overheat switch on it so it would be fine.

 

[The motor guy]

34 year old Amana system at home. Replaced the condenser fan motor 3 years ago myself for under $100. Add 2-3 pounds R22 every 2-3 years and it runs just fine. New systems have Chinese made compressors and other components that won't last 10 years.

This is the first tech that recommended replacing it. All the others just said keep doing what you're doing. Fix it as you go. Maybe they just want the work though lol

 

[CDX825]

I have mixed feeling on the situation and I'm an hvac tech. Next year everyone is switching refrigerants again. Most are going to R454B but Daikin, Goodman(Amana), Mitsubishi are going to R32. Being that R454B and R32 are A2L mildly flammable systems will now have leak sensors that kick the blower on if they detect a leak to prevent a possible explosion from refrigerant gas accumulation. Its going to be a $hit show. More complicated junk to break and cause problems.

R410A has proven to be a good refrigerant but its going away. Do you keep dumping money into an old system or do you jump on getting a new one now? Or do you wait until next year to get one with the new refrigerants?

I think if I had an R22 system that was running decent I would try to keep it going. If it was needing replacement though I would jump on getting one of the last R410A systems before the switch.

 

[nascarnation]

I know Goodman was bought by the Japanese 10 yrs or so ago, and maybe they have shaped it up since, but the Goodman system I had from 15 yrs ago was a constant source of repairs (both furnace and AC). The person who owned the house at the time went with a bottom spec system. I've since switched to Am Standard and have saved a lot of money on operating costs and repairs. It's not going to "pay for itself" economically, but a lot less headaches.

 

[Cujet]

My initial advice is to keep it functional. There will be parts available for older systems for quite some time.

In fact, capable people can replace compressors, evaporators, motors and so on, for as long as parts are available. Often for a fraction of the cost of a new system, over the period of time in question. There are even sometimes the option to improve an older system with slightly better parts.


EDIT: Just a quick note for those who lose the outdoor (condenser) fan. A quick and dirty way to stay cool is to place a powerful shop fan on top, blowing up, and seal with wet towels.

 

[AP9]

Funny that you mention it, I went to turn on my Lennox HS9-461 (installed in 1980) earlier this week. First time it had any trouble that I can remember. Central air handler runs but no compressor or condenser fan activity, which I'm assuming (hoping) implies it's just an electrical-related issue (capacitor, wiring, 24V command signal, etc.)

 

[The motor guy]

I have mixed feeling on the situation and I'm an hvac tech. Next year everyone is switching refrigerants again. Most are going to R454B but Daikin, Goodman(Amana), Mitsubishi are going to R32. Being that R454B and R32 are A2L mildly flammable systems will now have leak sensors that kick the blower on if they detect a leak to prevent a possible explosion from refrigerant gas accumulation. Its going to be a $hit show. More complicated junk to break and cause problems.

R410A has proven to be a good refrigerant but its going away. Do you keep dumping money into an old system or do you jump on getting a new one now? Or do you wait until next year to get one with the new refrigerants?

I think if I had an R22 system that was running decent I would try to keep it going. If it was needing replacement though I would jump on getting one of the last R410A systems before the switch.

I find it hard to believe nobody will install an r410a system after January 1st. You can still get r22 refrigerant and they said they stuff was going to disappear long ago also.

 

[The motor guy]

So wait, We can put a natural gas furnace in the attic and they freak out about slightly flammable freon?

 

[CDX825]

I find it hard to believe nobody will install an r410a system after January 1st. You can still get r22 refrigerant and they said they stuff was going to disappear long ago also.

Sure there will be companies that still have the stuff in stock but once it runs out that's it.

 

[CDX825]

So wait, We can put a natural gas furnace in the attic and they freak out about slightly flammable freon?

Yeah its really dumb.

 

[Nukeman7]

I find it hard to believe nobody will install an r410a system after January 1st. You can still get r22 refrigerant and they said they stuff was going to disappear long ago also.

It is likely going to be similar to the R22 transition to R410a in that companies can no longer manufacture new R410 units after January 1, 2025. Previously made units in the supply chain will be sold and installed until depleted.

 

[KJSmith]

I find it hard to believe nobody will install an r410a system after January 1st. You can still get r22 refrigerant and they said they stuff was going to disappear long ago also.

R22 is cost prohibitive for most people.
There are alternatives that people don't mention.
NU22 and MO99 are both drop-in replacements and cheaper.
I have used both with great success.

There is no reason to buy a 410 system.
Buy a system with the new refrigerant.

 

[KJSmith]

Add 2-3 pounds R22 every 2-3 years and it runs just fine.

Do yourself a favor.
If you are leaking refrigerant, you are also leaking oil.
Try to put a stop to it.
If nothing else, it leaves a dye so you can find the leak.
I have used this product on a lot of systems.

Amazon.com

 

[KJSmith]

New systems have Chinese made compressors and other components that won't last 10 years.

Stick with the American brands.
They have all used Copeland or Tecumseh for years...
Older Tranes used Trane compressors...... The majority of units I see have Copeland compressors.

 

[Gus_Mahn]

My brother has found a couple of pretty decent side job HVAC techs on Facebook marketplace. They've been more than willing to fix my 1991 Armstrong HVAC system which has only needed a run start cap and thermostat wiring since new. The guy I like better said to rock the R-22 system as long as possible. It seems that the bigger shops have the philosophy that they'll fix it when their busy and want to put in a whole system when they're slow.

 

[pbm]

Stick with the American brands.
They have all used Copeland or Tecumseh for years...
Older Tranes used Trane compressors...... The majority of units I see have Copeland compressors.

I had a new 2 1/2 ton Trane installed last year and it was 'Made in China'...

 

[LDM]

Just replaced the fan and motor for the A/C condenser on my rental property, a lot cheaper than putting in a whole new system. Both were getting a bit rusty so rather than wait for it to fail in the middle of a hot summer I ordered replacements this last winter and then put them in a few weeks ago when I had the time. Whole system was put in around 2002-2003 so its right at 20 years old but the longer it lasts the less it is out of my pocket. Just put a new capacitor in my houses A/C condenser as well as I was checking it during the spring and found it was well over 50% under spec. The system in my house was put in 1995 and aside from having to replace the blower fan and capacitor about 10 years ago, its been working great. Again, really helps if you can do your own work rather than having to call someone to fix it after it breaks in the middle of a hot summer.

 

[Mechanician]

Our 35 year old Trane is still humming along.