Oil for new 18 Stinger GT

[kschachn]

Originally Posted by Ruturaj
I think the bigger tha gap between viscosity at 0 and operating temp, less stable is oil and more additives.

Some oils, maybe. It completely depends on the operating conditions as to whether shear is a problem. And SonofJoe on here has repeatedly pointed out that VII polymers are far more stable than is often said on here to be the case. Plus it also depends on the base stock, all the existing 0W-40 oils that are available are of very high quality base stocks and will perform well under the most severe conditions.

 

[Spdfrk1990]

Originally Posted by Brigadier
If it were my T-GDI engine, I would be running a dexos 2 rated 5W30 or 5W40.


Which dexos 2 5w40?

 

[Ruturaj]

Originally Posted by Brigadier
If it were my T-GDI engine, I would be running a dexos 2 rated 5W30 or 5W40.


How much different is dexos 2 rated 5W30 Mobil1 ESP vs not dexos rated 10W30 Mobil1 ESP?

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted by Spdfrk1990
It will never be as thin at a cold start as it is when the engine is up to temp. If they say its ok to run on a 5w40 then why not a 0w40 which should flow better at startup?

Again, you've got that backwards. Earlier it was pointed out what the "W" rating means, it isn't a viscosity that is comparable to the number after the W rating. Both 0W-40 and 5W-40 are 40-grade oils and one thickens less at extremely cold temperatures. However, both are also extremely thick at those cold temps.

All oils thin as they get warmer and thicken as they get colder. All oils are thinner at operating temperature than they are when cold. A lot thinner.

 

[Brigadier]

Originally Posted by Ruturaj
Originally Posted by Brigadier
If it were my T-GDI engine, I would be running a dexos 2 rated 5W30 or 5W40.


How much different is dexos 2 rated 5W30 Mobil1 ESP vs not dexos rated 10W30 Mobil1 ESP?


dexos 1 Gen 2 and dexos 2 limit calcium, which is supposed to be a culprit in LSPI. I would have to look at a VOA on 10W30 ESP to see if they limit calcium.

 

[Gokhan]

Originally Posted by Spdfrk1990
It will never be as thin at a cold start as it is when the engine is up to temp. If they say its ok to run on a 5w40 then why not a 0w40 which should flow better at startup?

The main difference between a 0W-40 and a 5W-40 is that a 0W-40 is made from a thinner base oil and uses more VII. As a result, it will be thinner than a 5W-40 at all temperatures except around 100 C an above, at which it should be similar in viscosity. Also, because of the 0W rating, it will allow cranking at lower temperatures (-40 C as opposed to -35 C or so).

So, it should be OK to use a 0W-40 if you understand that the base oil is thinner (same as or thinner than a 0W-20) and may increase the valvetrain and chain wear a bit, but that shouldn't really be a problem with good AW/EP/FM additives. Note that I recommended against full-SAPS A3/B4 oils such as M1 0W-40 or Castrol 0W-40 in GDI engines though. Unfortunately, some European GDI engines recommend full-SAPS oils.

 

[Spdfrk1990]

Originally Posted by Gokhan
Originally Posted by Spdfrk1990
It will never be as thin at a cold start as it is when the engine is up to temp. If they say its ok to run on a 5w40 then why not a 0w40 which should flow better at startup?

The main difference between a 0W-40 and a 5W-40 is that a 0W-40 is made from a thinner base oil and uses more VII. As a result, it will be thinner than a 5W-40 at all temperatures except around 100 C an above, at which it should be similar in viscosity. Also, because of the 0W rating, it will allow cranking at lower temperatures (-40 C as opposed to -35 C or so).

So, it should be OK to use a 0W-40 if you understand that the base oil is thinner (same as or thinner than a 0W-20) and may increase the valvetrain and chain wear a bit, but that shouldn't really be a problem with good AW/EP/FM additives. Note that I recommended against full-SAPS A3/B4 oils such as M1 0W-40 or Castrol 0W-40 in GDI engines though. Unfortunately, some European GDI engines recommend full-SAPS oils.


Thanks!

 

[Brigadier]

Originally Posted by Spdfrk1990
Originally Posted by Brigadier
If it were my T-GDI engine, I would be running a dexos 2 rated 5W30 or 5W40.


Which dexos 2 5w40?


Probably Magnatec C3 or Motul 8100 X-Clean

Either way, I would add the Hy-Per Lube ZRA. I know it quieted my Santa Fe's 3.3L a bit during cold starts and warm up. Also seems to have quieted the noisy HPFP a bit. And given the miles and miles of chains these engines use, a little bit more AW esther is a good thing, IMO.

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted by Brigadier
Originally Posted by Spdfrk1990
Originally Posted by Brigadier
If it were my T-GDI engine, I would be running a dexos 2 rated 5W30 or 5W40.


Which dexos 2 5w40?


Probably Magnatec C3 or Motul 8100 X-Clean

Either way, I would add the Hy-Per Lube ZRA. I know it quieted my Santa Fe's 3.3L a bit during cold starts and warm up. Also seems to have quieted the noisy HPFP a bit. And given the miles and miles of chains these engines use, a little bit more AW esther is a good thing, IMO.

Castrol Magnatec and Motul X-Clean are two different worlds.
Castrol Edge 5W30 C3 is closer to Motul X-Clean.

 

[MobilinHyundia]

Total INEO mc3 5W30 is my choice for Kia V6 engines. Even on the bottle, it indicates Kia/Hyundai approved.


My new 2018 Kia Sedona SX+ love the oil...

 

[Gokhan]

Originally Posted by MobilinHyundia
Total INEO mc3 5W30 is my choice for Kia V6 engines. Even on the bottle, it indicates Kia/Hyundai approved.


My new 2018 Kia Sedona SX+ love the oil...

Yeah, an oil with both C3 (or dexos2) and SN PLUS should be a good choice for a GDI engine.

 

[WhizkidTN]

Originally Posted by Gokhan
Originally Posted by Spdfrk1990
It will never be as thin at a cold start as it is when the engine is up to temp. If they say its ok to run on a 5w40 then why not a 0w40 which should flow better at startup?

The main difference between a 0W-40 and a 5W-40 is that a 0W-40 is made from a thinner base oil and uses more VII. As a result, it will be thinner than a 5W-40 at all temperatures except around 100 C an above, at which it should be similar in viscosity. Also, because of the 0W rating, it will allow cranking at lower temperatures (-40 C as opposed to -35 C or so).

So, it should be OK to use a 0W-40 if you understand that the base oil is thinner (same as or thinner than a 0W-20) and may increase the valvetrain and chain wear a bit, but that shouldn't really be a problem with good AW/EP/FM additives. Note that I recommended against full-SAPS A3/B4 oils such as M1 0W-40 or Castrol 0W-40 in GDI engines though. Unfortunately, some European GDI engines recommend full-SAPS oils.


Why not the full-SAPS A3/B4 in this GDI engine (and a turbo engine in this case)? I may have missed the discussion on this.

 

[Spdfrk1990]

Originally Posted by MobilinHyundia
Total INEO mc3 5W30 is my choice for Kia V6 engines. Even on the bottle, it indicates Kia/Hyundai approved.


My new 2018 Kia Sedona SX+ love the oil...


Where do you buy it from?

 

[Gokhan]

Originally Posted by WhizkidTN
Why not the full-SAPS A3/B4 in this GDI engine (and a turbo engine in this case)? I may have missed the discussion on this.

Two things: (1) They usually don't have SN PLUS, which is the LSPI protection for GDI engines, and (2) their high sulfated ash (usually around 1.3%) increases the intake-valve deposits (IVD) in GDI engines.

 

[Ruturaj]

Originally Posted by Gokhan
Yeah, an oil with both C3 (or dexos2) and SN PLUS should be a good choice for a GDI engine.


How much different dexos 2 rated 5W30 Mobil1 ESP will affect Turbo GDI engine compared to non dexos rated 10W30 Mobil1 ESP?

I am trying to compare (benefit of using 10w-30 over 5w-30, if there is any) vs (benefit of using dexos 2 rated oil vs non dexos 2 rated oil) on turbo GDI engine.

They both have SN plus.

 

[Ruturaj]

Found some good info here and Gokhan's opinion

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/3893381/1

 

[Gokhan]

I made that comment three years ago. My knowledge, opinions, etc. evolve.

Why do you want to use 10W-30?

Base-oil quality is key for GDI in terms of IVD. You can look at the MSDS to see whether 5W-30 or 10W-30 has more PAO or GTL. Thinner base oils have lower aniline points and clean better. Thicker base oils can protect the valvetrain better. Low NOACK could be bad for GDI IVD as I said before.

 

[Ruturaj]

Originally Posted by Gokhan
I made that comment three years ago. My knowledge, opinions, etc. evolve.

Why do you want to use 10W-30?

Base-oil quality is key for GDI in terms of IVD. You can look at the MSDS to see whether 5W-30 or 10W-30 has more PAO or GTL. Thinner base oils have lower aniline points and clean better. Thicker base oils can protect the valvetrain better. Low NOACK could be bad for GDI IVD as I said before.



I went through my manual and saw I had a few options for the oil viscosity. So I just searched 5w30 vs 10w30 and 10w30 was considered as better choice overall in most threads.

Then I personally didn't know what to look for except weather, VII, NOACK and stability when comparing these two oils for my situation.

IVD stands for intake valve deposits? I will look at MSDS and will search for PAO and GTL. Didn't know that lower NOACK is bad for GDI. I think I missed that post of yours.

Really appreciate you taking your time to respond, thank you.

 

[Gokhan]

Originally Posted by Ruturaj
Originally Posted by Gokhan
I made that comment three years ago. My knowledge, opinions, etc. evolve.

Why do you want to use 10W-30?

Base-oil quality is key for GDI in terms of IVD. You can look at the MSDS to see whether 5W-30 or 10W-30 has more PAO or GTL. Thinner base oils have lower aniline points and clean better. Thicker base oils can protect the valvetrain better. Low NOACK could be bad for GDI IVD as I said before.

I went through my manual and saw I had a few options for the oil viscosity. So I just searched 5w30 vs 10w30 and 10w30 was considered as better choice overall in most threads.

Then I personally didn't know what to look for except weather, VII, NOACK and stability when comparing these two oils for my situation.

IVD stands for intake valve deposits? I will look at MSDS and will search for PAO and GTL. Didn't know that lower NOACK is bad for GDI. I think I missed that post of yours.

Really appreciate you taking your time to respond, thank you.

Ignore those threads about 10W-30 being better than 5W-30. That's old wives' tale and there is no such thing.

Lower NOACK alone certainly doesn't help with GDI intake-valve deposits (IVD). Does it hurt? It probably does, as liquid oil spends more time on the valves before it can evaporate. Think about the spark-plug oil fouling. If the spark plugs run cold and the oil can't evaporate, they will be fouled by coked oil. There seemed to be a reverse correlation between NOACK and TEOST 33C in the Amsoil data. AAA study also found similar results for conventional vs. synthetic in TEOST 33C and MHT tests. However, it's difficult to separate the base-oil-quality effect from the NOACK effect in the latter study.

You need:

(1) The best full-synthetic base oil. Look at the MSDS's if possible. 5W-30's are usually made from better base oil than 10W-30 but this isn't always the case. If xW-20 was recommended, I would go with the PAO-based M1 EP 0W-20 but yours recommend 5W-30.

(2) Lower ash. Avoid sulfated ash over 1%, such as A3/B4 oils. Perhaps about half the IVD is ash, the rest being carbon from the coked liquid base oil (not the evaporated base oil, which quickly and cleanly burns in the combustion chamber) and EGR and exhaust particulates.

(3) SN PLUS. So that you get LSPI protection.

No matter what oil you use, you'll get some IVD in GDI engines unless there is a built-in cleaning mechanism such as dual injection.

 

[oghl]

It's not that complicated. Just pick any oil with Mercedes 229.5 or BMW LL01 or Porsche A40 rating and be done with it.