After an oil change on my 2008 Acadia at Mr. Tire, a Monroe subsidiary, a piece of glue came off the filter and lodged between the head gasket and block resulting in $2400 in damages. This is their reply ".... they do not feel the damages are related. The piece in question is between the metal casing and the element. They feel the piece in question would never have made it through the element into the engine as it is the job of the element to stop particles from entering the engine." There is a GM bulletin warning of aftermarket oil filters could cause engine damage and in 2011 GM changed their own filter design used on GM 3.6 engines. I contend oil filters have a bypass that under pressure will allow unfiltered oil into the engine. I have documentation that says the piece made it into the engine and have the piece and cut apart filter showing where the piece dislodged, how do I prove the Valvoline filter caused the damage, thanks for your time.
oil filter causes catastrophic engine damage
- Thread starter GT350H
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You mean a PUROLATOR! Good luck with that though. Will be an interesting case to pursue.
not sure if this is the case with this engine, but don't a lot of GM engines have the bypass in the block itself? so that when it goes into bypass, the filter isn't involved at all.
You need to get a lawyer and have them draft a letter. You will hope that they will settle outside of court for your damages. Otherwise you will pay a lawyer to try and prove beyond a reasonable doubt, that the filter caused the failure.
Good luck, buy aspirin/Tylenol.
Good luck, buy aspirin/Tylenol.
The fact that the piece of filter that was taken out of the engine would be the proof. It had to get there some how. It would be a different issue if the filter was perfectly fine but it isn't.
This is why AMSOIL pulled the EaO47 when they had issues with it doing the exact same thing.
I just wish GM would make all these 3.6 engines cartridge filters like on the Camaro and Cadillac. There is something about the 3.6 oiling system that puts some serious stress on these can filters it seems.
This is why AMSOIL pulled the EaO47 when they had issues with it doing the exact same thing.
I just wish GM would make all these 3.6 engines cartridge filters like on the Camaro and Cadillac. There is something about the 3.6 oiling system that puts some serious stress on these can filters it seems.
Originally Posted By: GT350H
a piece of glue came off the (oil) filter and lodged between the head gasket and block resulting in $2400 in damages.
What!?? How did the glue get there, and just how hard is this glue?
Originally Posted By: earlyre
not sure if this is the case with this engine, but don't a lot of GM engines have the bypass in the block itself? so that when it goes into bypass, the filter isn't involved at all.
Sure do
a piece of glue came off the (oil) filter and lodged between the head gasket and block resulting in $2400 in damages.
What!?? How did the glue get there, and just how hard is this glue?
Originally Posted By: earlyre
not sure if this is the case with this engine, but don't a lot of GM engines have the bypass in the block itself? so that when it goes into bypass, the filter isn't involved at all.
Sure do
Adhesive is used to bond the media to the end disc. It is a very very hard adhesive and I can see it doing some damage if loose in the engine.
Ignore their initial statement. It's to be expected. Imagine how many people give up at this point and eat the bill. Just make sure you document every conversation, e-mail, phone call, everything. Get a lawyer sooner than later. Get one that knows the territory. Good luck.
Originally Posted By: earlyre
not sure if this is the case with this engine, but don't a lot of GM engines have the bypass in the block itself? so that when it goes into bypass, the filter isn't involved at all.
Very good point. If that GM engine does have the filter bypass located in the block, then the only way for a piece of glue that dislodged and made it into the engine is if that broken off piece dislodged on the clean side of the media ... ie, around the inside of the center tube where there is glue between the center tube and end caps. If you look down inside the center hole in the base and down into the center tube, can you see the location where the glue dislodged?
Originally Posted By: GT350H
... a piece of glue came off the filter and lodged between the head gasket and block resulting in $2400 in damages.
Can you please explain the failure? How does a piece of debris get caught between the head gasket and block, and what kind of damage does that result in? Strange failure description.
And to clarify, was this a spin-on or cartridge style oil filter? Depending on which type, that could change the comments about this issue.
not sure if this is the case with this engine, but don't a lot of GM engines have the bypass in the block itself? so that when it goes into bypass, the filter isn't involved at all.
Very good point. If that GM engine does have the filter bypass located in the block, then the only way for a piece of glue that dislodged and made it into the engine is if that broken off piece dislodged on the clean side of the media ... ie, around the inside of the center tube where there is glue between the center tube and end caps. If you look down inside the center hole in the base and down into the center tube, can you see the location where the glue dislodged?
Originally Posted By: GT350H
... a piece of glue came off the filter and lodged between the head gasket and block resulting in $2400 in damages.
Can you please explain the failure? How does a piece of debris get caught between the head gasket and block, and what kind of damage does that result in? Strange failure description.
And to clarify, was this a spin-on or cartridge style oil filter? Depending on which type, that could change the comments about this issue.
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
[
Can you please explain the failure? How does a piece of debris get caught between the head gasket and block, and what kind of damage does that result in? Strange failure description.
That's what I'd like to know.
[
Can you please explain the failure? How does a piece of debris get caught between the head gasket and block, and what kind of damage does that result in? Strange failure description.
That's what I'd like to know.
Originally Posted By: GT350H
..I have documentation..
Source?
Welcome to BITOG!
..I have documentation..
Source?
Welcome to BITOG!
aparantly there is a small oil galley that lubes the cam.it goes through the block,into the head. the hole in the head gasket must be slightly smaller than the galley and the piece got stuck there and starved the top end.
same thing happened to my loms omni 20 yrs ago.it was a ocod
same thing happened to my loms omni 20 yrs ago.it was a ocod
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Who said that? the filter manufacturer or the company who did the work??
What was the actual damage to the vehicle? Just trying to picture in my head what actually happened here. The process of what failed to what was damaged.
What was the actual damage to the vehicle? Just trying to picture in my head what actually happened here. The process of what failed to what was damaged.
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
^^^ Chris142 - makes sense now, thanks!
Yes it does. It will be interesting to see how this pans out, and how the blame gets passed around. I'd consider an attorney if this turns into a circle jerk.
^^^ Chris142 - makes sense now, thanks!
Yes it does. It will be interesting to see how this pans out, and how the blame gets passed around. I'd consider an attorney if this turns into a circle jerk.
Originally Posted By: GT350H
After an oil change on my 2008 Acadia at Mr. Tire, a Monroe subsidiary, a piece of glue came off the filter and lodged between the head gasket and block resulting in $2400 in damages. This is their reply ".... they do not feel the damages are related. The piece in question is between the metal casing and the element. They feel the piece in question would never have made it through the element into the engine as it is the job of the element to stop particles from entering the engine." There is a GM bulletin warning of aftermarket oil filters could cause engine damage and in 2011 GM changed their own filter design used on GM 3.6 engines. I contend oil filters have a bypass that under pressure will allow unfiltered oil into the engine. I have documentation that says the piece made it into the engine and have the piece and cut apart filter showing where the piece dislodged, how do I prove the Valvoline filter caused the damage, thanks for your time.
I think if you went to GM Dealer and had a ASE Certified Master Mechanic sign a affidavit and perhaps get a few other ASE Certified Mechanics and perhaps a GM Engineer or specialist sign a affidavit...
Also was the Mr. Tire place just one of them places that just fixes tires and does oil changes?
My Grandpa has had a Garage for 40 years and he does everything.. Transmissions to Timing belts you name it his garage does it... And each year he has to hang or tape the permits on the wall just over the place the customers pay.
Also I know he has 3 ASE Certified mechanics and 2 mechanics who are still in training and the ASE Certified mechanic has to look over his work and sign the work order to make sure all is legal and legit.
However them oil change and tire places are different.. Did you see on youtube that lady who went to Walmart to get a OIL Change and when she drove off her OIL light was on and her car had like no power.. However she only drove a few blocks and drove back to wall-mart.. She said Walmart kept the car there 20 minutes then put in oil and she had to have her Lawyer get the surveillance tapes and it clearly showed them put over 4 QTs of oil in here Honda Civic... Then she had a Mechanic remove the head and you could clearly see the damage to the pistons and heads and the whole engine was just burnt...
Now she is FIGHTING walmart in court and walmart doesn't have to have any permits or anything b/c they are just a instant oil change and tire repair and battery replacement.
However I think you have a good chance b/c Mr. Tire is not as big as WALMART... and I feel you can prove that they clearly made a mistake... However they might try to blame it on GM or the Oil Filter Company.. However they should of been aware of the Notice about the oil filter that you talked about...
This is why I do my own oil changes......
I know people who go to Jiffylube and then do there own oil change and find that there oil screw plug is GONE and one of them rubber temp jobs are there.... They stripped the darn threads and never told the guy... Also on You tube they show a guy get his oil changed and Jiffy Lube and they forgot to put oil in and he drove the car back and had it on video...
There is things you can do.. DO NOT GIVE UP...... FIGHT.. You paid your $ and they should of done a good job and should of known about the oil filter.. Oil changes are there specalty... so they could be at fault.. I do know 1 thing.. Its not your fault....
Good LUCK and keep us updated.
After an oil change on my 2008 Acadia at Mr. Tire, a Monroe subsidiary, a piece of glue came off the filter and lodged between the head gasket and block resulting in $2400 in damages. This is their reply ".... they do not feel the damages are related. The piece in question is between the metal casing and the element. They feel the piece in question would never have made it through the element into the engine as it is the job of the element to stop particles from entering the engine." There is a GM bulletin warning of aftermarket oil filters could cause engine damage and in 2011 GM changed their own filter design used on GM 3.6 engines. I contend oil filters have a bypass that under pressure will allow unfiltered oil into the engine. I have documentation that says the piece made it into the engine and have the piece and cut apart filter showing where the piece dislodged, how do I prove the Valvoline filter caused the damage, thanks for your time.
I think if you went to GM Dealer and had a ASE Certified Master Mechanic sign a affidavit and perhaps get a few other ASE Certified Mechanics and perhaps a GM Engineer or specialist sign a affidavit...
Also was the Mr. Tire place just one of them places that just fixes tires and does oil changes?
My Grandpa has had a Garage for 40 years and he does everything.. Transmissions to Timing belts you name it his garage does it... And each year he has to hang or tape the permits on the wall just over the place the customers pay.
Also I know he has 3 ASE Certified mechanics and 2 mechanics who are still in training and the ASE Certified mechanic has to look over his work and sign the work order to make sure all is legal and legit.
However them oil change and tire places are different.. Did you see on youtube that lady who went to Walmart to get a OIL Change and when she drove off her OIL light was on and her car had like no power.. However she only drove a few blocks and drove back to wall-mart.. She said Walmart kept the car there 20 minutes then put in oil and she had to have her Lawyer get the surveillance tapes and it clearly showed them put over 4 QTs of oil in here Honda Civic... Then she had a Mechanic remove the head and you could clearly see the damage to the pistons and heads and the whole engine was just burnt...
Now she is FIGHTING walmart in court and walmart doesn't have to have any permits or anything b/c they are just a instant oil change and tire repair and battery replacement.
However I think you have a good chance b/c Mr. Tire is not as big as WALMART... and I feel you can prove that they clearly made a mistake... However they might try to blame it on GM or the Oil Filter Company.. However they should of been aware of the Notice about the oil filter that you talked about...
This is why I do my own oil changes......
I know people who go to Jiffylube and then do there own oil change and find that there oil screw plug is GONE and one of them rubber temp jobs are there.... They stripped the darn threads and never told the guy... Also on You tube they show a guy get his oil changed and Jiffy Lube and they forgot to put oil in and he drove the car back and had it on video...
There is things you can do.. DO NOT GIVE UP...... FIGHT.. You paid your $ and they should of done a good job and should of known about the oil filter.. Oil changes are there specalty... so they could be at fault.. I do know 1 thing.. Its not your fault....
Good LUCK and keep us updated.
Sounds similar to the FRAM PH3976 issues in the Cummins diesel a few years ago.
http://www.fram.com/media/20656/PH3976-Bulletin-3Cummins_59L_Engine.pdf
You never know the end of these stories because there is always a non-disclosure statement with any settlement from the responsible parties.
It's surprising that more of these issues don't come up with "jobber grade" value filters with manufacturers trying to keep cost low.
http://www.fram.com/media/20656/PH3976-Bulletin-3Cummins_59L_Engine.pdf
You never know the end of these stories because there is always a non-disclosure statement with any settlement from the responsible parties.
It's surprising that more of these issues don't come up with "jobber grade" value filters with manufacturers trying to keep cost low.
Originally Posted By: Dallas69
This would not happen with fiber endcaps
Glue applied to a steel plate
vs
Glue applied to a piece of fiberboard
U sure the glue on the fiberboard is more secure?
This would not happen with fiber endcaps
Glue applied to a steel plate
vs
Glue applied to a piece of fiberboard
U sure the glue on the fiberboard is more secure?
Originally Posted By: jrustles
Originally Posted By: Dallas69
This would not happen with fiber endcaps
Glue applied to a steel plate
vs
Glue applied to a piece of fiberboard
U sure the glue on the fiberboard is more secure?
The glue probably is more secure when bonding fiber to fiber. Many times we have seen metal end caps that have popped off because the glue didn't adhere well to the metal. Try tearing a fiber end cap off sometime. The fiber will be destroyed before the glue ever lets go. Just sayin'.
The OP has seemed to disappear ... would be nice if he chimed back in with more details and answers to the questions brought up here.
Originally Posted By: Dallas69
This would not happen with fiber endcaps
Glue applied to a steel plate
vs
Glue applied to a piece of fiberboard
U sure the glue on the fiberboard is more secure?
The glue probably is more secure when bonding fiber to fiber. Many times we have seen metal end caps that have popped off because the glue didn't adhere well to the metal. Try tearing a fiber end cap off sometime. The fiber will be destroyed before the glue ever lets go. Just sayin'.
The OP has seemed to disappear ... would be nice if he chimed back in with more details and answers to the questions brought up here.
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