We should all of the money that the feds put into GM could have been used for hunger and poverty....
Not Happy with GM right now... (light rant)
- Thread starter daves87rs
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I'm trying mods, I really am.
I'm trying mods, I really am.
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Originally Posted By: Ben99GT
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
Might as well blame GM for world hunger and poverty too. I've had good experiences but it seems that this site is on the hate GM bandwagon.
Groupthink is rampant on this site.
More prevalent probably is the fact that GM once had over 50% market share in the US auto industry. Since has dropped to somewhere in the 20% range I believe. Which means that at one time or another one of every two Americans who owned a car had owned a GM car at one time in their life. Now that number is about one in five. So the chances of hitting one of the 30% who quit buying GM product anywhere is statistically pretty good. Can appear to be group think either way but really probably isn't. Lots of lovers & haters everywhere. But now the haters and those who are indifferent outnumber the lovers.
Then add in the bailout animosity....and it's not a pretty picture.
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
Might as well blame GM for world hunger and poverty too. I've had good experiences but it seems that this site is on the hate GM bandwagon.
Groupthink is rampant on this site.
More prevalent probably is the fact that GM once had over 50% market share in the US auto industry. Since has dropped to somewhere in the 20% range I believe. Which means that at one time or another one of every two Americans who owned a car had owned a GM car at one time in their life. Now that number is about one in five. So the chances of hitting one of the 30% who quit buying GM product anywhere is statistically pretty good. Can appear to be group think either way but really probably isn't. Lots of lovers & haters everywhere. But now the haters and those who are indifferent outnumber the lovers.
Then add in the bailout animosity....and it's not a pretty picture.
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Originally Posted By: GMBoy
Originally Posted By: PT1
Originally Posted By: daves87rs
*sigh*
I can't believe it that it happened already.....
Today, I took my my 2006 Cobalt to the car wash. As I dried underneath the doors, I noticed something that surprised me: I decent amount of rust bubbling underneath the driver's side door. (2dr car) What the heck?
I'm just so disappointed right now.
I know how you feel...rust through on a 4 year old car...no excuse. GM knows about road salt. But don't worry the GM moonies on here will tell you it's "your fault" or you live "in the wrong area" or any number of silly excuses. Just hope the dealer doesn't say the same thing. Does tha car have a rust through warranty? Look in your owners manual.
There is a rust thru warranty. But I must add that this was purchased as a used car so we do not know the history (if any) of damage to that area. Also - steel is steel and if you break the paint - you will get rust. This is true on a car as well as a fence post.
It was in the family, so I do know the parts that were replaced, and what the damage looked like (not bad at all) The doors were never touched. So I'm not sure if that is bad or good....
Originally Posted By: PT1
Originally Posted By: daves87rs
*sigh*
I can't believe it that it happened already.....
Today, I took my my 2006 Cobalt to the car wash. As I dried underneath the doors, I noticed something that surprised me: I decent amount of rust bubbling underneath the driver's side door. (2dr car) What the heck?
I'm just so disappointed right now.
I know how you feel...rust through on a 4 year old car...no excuse. GM knows about road salt. But don't worry the GM moonies on here will tell you it's "your fault" or you live "in the wrong area" or any number of silly excuses. Just hope the dealer doesn't say the same thing. Does tha car have a rust through warranty? Look in your owners manual.
There is a rust thru warranty. But I must add that this was purchased as a used car so we do not know the history (if any) of damage to that area. Also - steel is steel and if you break the paint - you will get rust. This is true on a car as well as a fence post.
It was in the family, so I do know the parts that were replaced, and what the damage looked like (not bad at all) The doors were never touched. So I'm not sure if that is bad or good....
No but many of us are disapointed with GM. It is hate only Make that I have to change a transmission out at 104,000 miles or their about. My grand mother owned it had use M1 in the engine and had the dealership do all service on it.
The kicker is that the problem ws well known by GM and they shouldhave recalled but instead they just issued a TSB and told the dealerships to fix them while under warranty if anyone complained. Never mind that they fail to bore a round hole in the valve body or the transmision. I guess boring a round hole is a challeng for them.
In the first $104,000 miles Ihave had the replace the folllowing:
Part of the engine harness.
The coil pack,
Wireing for coil pack and crank sensor.
Every sensor under the hood.
Upper and lower intake manifold.
Water pump.
water pump plastic inlet and outlets.
Starter
PCV valve
Transmission
wheel bearing
brake rotors
Brake pads 3 times since I have had.
EGR valve
all of the plastic interior is either random falling off or it is cracking and falling off.
Cigerete lighter will not work unless I decide to refire it like most GM's.
Park/Nuatral switch
3 or 4 master cylinders
It needs a new oil pan because GM failed to stamp it properly again something as simple as a smouth flange area free of wrinkles in a staped steel pan is too hard for them to master.
It has the wrong dipstick and tube in it.
(2003Camry)Now Campare that to my Camry which has 80K+ miles onit. I have had to turn the rotors once and replace the front pads once.
I had to have the tensioner changed under good faith warranty and they put a new belt on it.
Dad's 1995.5 taco. He had to replace one tension in the timing chain area so we replaced the chains and the other tensionrs when we where in their. Had to replace a craked leaf spring. Had to replace one transmission seal under warranty and an O2 sensor under waranty.
Mom's Tundura has never been Touched for repairrs at all yet and it is 2001.
My 1986 4Runner was 12 years old before Ihad to replace anything.
P/S pump.
alternator and starter
It was 17 years old before I had to change the rotors.
1991 Plymoth Laser was Traded in on the Tundra and it had never been touched except to replace thetiming belt.It was in such good shape that people always thought it was new the inside and outside looked like new and under the hood looked likenew and it was untouched with 172,000 on it when they traded it in.
So I think people have a right to be upset with GM. On top of that they are costing every tax payer a lot of money for years to come! Like it is our fault they where idiots at the head of the company making bad deals with the Unions and building car's that no one wanted unless they got deep discounts!
They should have been kicking the entire automotive worlds bottom but instead they where brining up the rear! It is a disgrace! They failed because no one would speak the truth and do what needed to be done!
Having owned and worked on Ford's,Toyota,Chryslers,BMW and MErcedes and Porsche's I can say that GM was not all it could be and was lagging behind all of these other companies both in Technology in their products and materials. They loaded up their vechiles with cheap content and said the heck with refined durable power trains. They made the wrong choices over and over again in almost every aspect of the company. They exacuted their own designs in a slip shod manner!
A transmission and engine should last at least 200,000 miles on average with out wearing out. Most of my imports have been good to go for at least 200,000 miles before you had to do more then change plugs,wires,caps,rotor etc..... My Dodge did not have an origanal production part bolted to the engine by the time it was out of waranty. Once ever other month month I had to go in for either a TSB or for warranty work. My Ford had all kinds of electrical grmlins and you never knew when it was going to decide to stop running and cath the wireing on fire. I had to rebuild the engine at 50,000 miles and the transmission was shot by 100,000 miles.
The interior of a vechile should not start to crack,rot or get brittle at 100,000 miles and should never just start to fall off the dash as it ages. Every part under the hood bolted to the engine shouldnot need to be replaced by 100,000 miles.I see all kinds of New GM car's that blow smoke ie oil burning whentheir drivers step on it. In fact many Malibu's in my area burn oil when the owner steps on the gas to pass and I am talking car's 1-2 years old.Look at all the intake issues they have had for years.
The only thing they have going for them is that youc an get a really powerful engine in a rear wheel drive platform cheap either new or after 1-2 years.
If they are not going to play the game to win then the heck with them!
The kicker is that the problem ws well known by GM and they shouldhave recalled but instead they just issued a TSB and told the dealerships to fix them while under warranty if anyone complained. Never mind that they fail to bore a round hole in the valve body or the transmision. I guess boring a round hole is a challeng for them.
In the first $104,000 miles Ihave had the replace the folllowing:
Part of the engine harness.
The coil pack,
Wireing for coil pack and crank sensor.
Every sensor under the hood.
Upper and lower intake manifold.
Water pump.
water pump plastic inlet and outlets.
Starter
PCV valve
Transmission
wheel bearing
brake rotors
Brake pads 3 times since I have had.
EGR valve
all of the plastic interior is either random falling off or it is cracking and falling off.
Cigerete lighter will not work unless I decide to refire it like most GM's.
Park/Nuatral switch
3 or 4 master cylinders
It needs a new oil pan because GM failed to stamp it properly again something as simple as a smouth flange area free of wrinkles in a staped steel pan is too hard for them to master.
It has the wrong dipstick and tube in it.
(2003Camry)Now Campare that to my Camry which has 80K+ miles onit. I have had to turn the rotors once and replace the front pads once.
I had to have the tensioner changed under good faith warranty and they put a new belt on it.
Dad's 1995.5 taco. He had to replace one tension in the timing chain area so we replaced the chains and the other tensionrs when we where in their. Had to replace a craked leaf spring. Had to replace one transmission seal under warranty and an O2 sensor under waranty.
Mom's Tundura has never been Touched for repairrs at all yet and it is 2001.
My 1986 4Runner was 12 years old before Ihad to replace anything.
P/S pump.
alternator and starter
It was 17 years old before I had to change the rotors.
1991 Plymoth Laser was Traded in on the Tundra and it had never been touched except to replace thetiming belt.It was in such good shape that people always thought it was new the inside and outside looked like new and under the hood looked likenew and it was untouched with 172,000 on it when they traded it in.
So I think people have a right to be upset with GM. On top of that they are costing every tax payer a lot of money for years to come! Like it is our fault they where idiots at the head of the company making bad deals with the Unions and building car's that no one wanted unless they got deep discounts!
They should have been kicking the entire automotive worlds bottom but instead they where brining up the rear! It is a disgrace! They failed because no one would speak the truth and do what needed to be done!
Having owned and worked on Ford's,Toyota,Chryslers,BMW and MErcedes and Porsche's I can say that GM was not all it could be and was lagging behind all of these other companies both in Technology in their products and materials. They loaded up their vechiles with cheap content and said the heck with refined durable power trains. They made the wrong choices over and over again in almost every aspect of the company. They exacuted their own designs in a slip shod manner!
A transmission and engine should last at least 200,000 miles on average with out wearing out. Most of my imports have been good to go for at least 200,000 miles before you had to do more then change plugs,wires,caps,rotor etc..... My Dodge did not have an origanal production part bolted to the engine by the time it was out of waranty. Once ever other month month I had to go in for either a TSB or for warranty work. My Ford had all kinds of electrical grmlins and you never knew when it was going to decide to stop running and cath the wireing on fire. I had to rebuild the engine at 50,000 miles and the transmission was shot by 100,000 miles.
The interior of a vechile should not start to crack,rot or get brittle at 100,000 miles and should never just start to fall off the dash as it ages. Every part under the hood bolted to the engine shouldnot need to be replaced by 100,000 miles.I see all kinds of New GM car's that blow smoke ie oil burning whentheir drivers step on it. In fact many Malibu's in my area burn oil when the owner steps on the gas to pass and I am talking car's 1-2 years old.Look at all the intake issues they have had for years.
The only thing they have going for them is that youc an get a really powerful engine in a rear wheel drive platform cheap either new or after 1-2 years.
If they are not going to play the game to win then the heck with them!
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You said it all......Good Post....Just the facts...just the facts....
Originally Posted By: LS2JSTS
Ah Ha! With all those stone chips and two windshields it's confirmed....you ARE a tailgater. I knew it......
Ah Ha! With all those stone chips and two windshields it's confirmed....you ARE a tailgater. I knew it......
Originally Posted By: Ragin_Diesel
Ford Baby!!
I don't know what it is but I have had 3 GM cars and they were all Junk. I'm a ford truck Guy, but I won't touch another GM vehicle. IMO Ford is just as american as GM is. They (GM)is the reason the automotive market is in shambles.....Ok I'm done with my rant to.
Thats any inexpensive econo Car. I believe you get what you pay for
Oh goody. Someone who joined less than 48 hours ago, who appears to have the solution to every issue... GM all bad, Ford all good.
How did this site survive without him? (*sigh*)
Ford Baby!!
I don't know what it is but I have had 3 GM cars and they were all Junk. I'm a ford truck Guy, but I won't touch another GM vehicle. IMO Ford is just as american as GM is. They (GM)is the reason the automotive market is in shambles.....Ok I'm done with my rant to.
Thats any inexpensive econo Car. I believe you get what you pay for
Oh goody. Someone who joined less than 48 hours ago, who appears to have the solution to every issue... GM all bad, Ford all good.
How did this site survive without him? (*sigh*)
daves87rs: I would be interested in hearing your outcome from the dealer as I am in a similar situation.
For all the "Ford is perfect" guys out there: My '04 F-150 has paint peeling - and I pretty sure I know what the dealer is going to tell me. It is only a small spot now, but I know it is probably going to continue to peel and look terrible in a few years. This truck has been washed regularly and kept very clean - the rest of the paint looks brand new. It is obvious that there was an adhesion problem at the factory. No company in perfect: Domestic or Foreign.
From my experience in MN, vehicles less than 10 years old should not have paint issues if the paint has been properly maintaned. This period is a lot longer in areas without salt on the roads.
For all the "Ford is perfect" guys out there: My '04 F-150 has paint peeling - and I pretty sure I know what the dealer is going to tell me. It is only a small spot now, but I know it is probably going to continue to peel and look terrible in a few years. This truck has been washed regularly and kept very clean - the rest of the paint looks brand new. It is obvious that there was an adhesion problem at the factory. No company in perfect: Domestic or Foreign.
From my experience in MN, vehicles less than 10 years old should not have paint issues if the paint has been properly maintaned. This period is a lot longer in areas without salt on the roads.
My one and only ford a 1998 ford contor besides all of the other problems... The clear coat was peeling away in less that one yera on the hood and roof.... There excuse then was acid rain....
Originally Posted By: Ben99GT
Even Ford guys make fun of the Contour.
He's upset he didn't get a Miata instead.
Even Ford guys make fun of the Contour.
He's upset he didn't get a Miata instead.
Originally Posted By: rszappa1
My one and only ford a 1998 ford contor besides all of the other problems... The clear coat was peeling away in less that one yera on the hood and roof.... There excuse then was acid rain....
I have an "ordered & bought new MY 1996 Contour" purchased in December 1995. It's been a great car. I've done the recommended maintenance and it's been garaged in the winter months in NW NJ. That probably saved it from rusting. It looks like nearly new and runs great. I have a 2002 F-150 that had bubbling rusted door & tailgate seams within 12 months of purchase of the truck new. The dealer "reluctantly repaired" the rusted doors and tailgate seams. I've had them redone recently as the rust and paint bubbling reappeared. This time I had a local body shop do the work. There is no cure all once the cancer sets in. I can only hope for another 8 years before the rust reappears again.
Whimsey
My one and only ford a 1998 ford contor besides all of the other problems... The clear coat was peeling away in less that one yera on the hood and roof.... There excuse then was acid rain....
I have an "ordered & bought new MY 1996 Contour" purchased in December 1995. It's been a great car. I've done the recommended maintenance and it's been garaged in the winter months in NW NJ. That probably saved it from rusting. It looks like nearly new and runs great. I have a 2002 F-150 that had bubbling rusted door & tailgate seams within 12 months of purchase of the truck new. The dealer "reluctantly repaired" the rusted doors and tailgate seams. I've had them redone recently as the rust and paint bubbling reappeared. This time I had a local body shop do the work. There is no cure all once the cancer sets in. I can only hope for another 8 years before the rust reappears again.
Whimsey
Yeah, I bought a new 1999 Contour and it served me well for about 8 years. I sold it because a better deal came along. But it had the V6 with a manual transmission. A very fun car to drive.
Those who make fun of the Contour probably never saw, let alone DROVE an SVT Contour.
That is still one of the sweetest sounding engines I've ever had the chance to own and take to the rev limiter.
That is still one of the sweetest sounding engines I've ever had the chance to own and take to the rev limiter.
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