Well, I can tell you this for sure. On my 2010 Tacoma 2.7L, if I use 0w20, and it's cold outside, it will rattle really loud for probably a minute or slightly less. I changed it to 5w30, and it never makes a sound, purrs like a kitten. Does the rattle mean 0w20 is bad, no, not really, but it makes me feel better knowing it's not making the noise.
Noisy valve train with 0w20 oil–2006 Civic 1.8(R18)
- Thread starter Ambo87
- Start date
It does not surprise me that it made more noise after the adjustment since valves tighten as they wear and that sewing machine noise is just what you want, even though it is dis-concerning. Running 5-30 has probably raised your oil pressure just a bit and quieted things down. I would stay with 30W if it was mine. Every car is an individual and because some do ok with 20W does not mean they all will.
Any ilsac gf or A5 oil did make my civic with the R18 engine louder than a a3.
Oh the legendary Gokhan, its safe to assume that I "messed up" the valve clearances and maybe I "don't know" how to do it. Won't blame you there buddy!
However, I know what's metric and standard and I also know how to read and understand the correct specs and clearances(not my first rodeo). I verified the firing order before proceeding. Also, I know where is the intake and exhaust because I read the instructions and visually and physically inspected the orientations of the valves. I have two sets of valve feeler gauges, one is angled and the other is straight, and they're both working, shiny and smooth by the way. I used both cause I want to make sure on the first and second attempt(no changes at all) that I'm within spec. I also torqued the locking nut to specs.
Whether it has something to do with the oil or me being 100% cockeyed and dumb enough not to know what I'm doing, I'm just glad the 5w30 quieted things down and made it purr like a kitten. I'm happy, and the motor didn't blow up yet(you'll be the first to know if it does).
I would like to really thank you for your very informative and intellectual input!
Originally Posted by Gokhan
Originally Posted by Ambo87
I started the vehicle and dang the thing sounds like my grandma's 1948 15-91 Singer sewing machine!!!
This is a 100% indication that you messed up the valve clearances. It has absolutely nothing to do with the oil. You either confused between the intake and exhaust valves or don't know how to measure the clearances properly. It could also be something wrong with your gauge, such as metric vs. standard. If the noise decreased later, it's not because of the oil but because of all the severe beating the valves were receiving thanks to the incorrect valve adjustment. They should never sound like a sewing machine, and if they do, you know that the adjustment is wrong.
However, I know what's metric and standard and I also know how to read and understand the correct specs and clearances(not my first rodeo). I verified the firing order before proceeding. Also, I know where is the intake and exhaust because I read the instructions and visually and physically inspected the orientations of the valves. I have two sets of valve feeler gauges, one is angled and the other is straight, and they're both working, shiny and smooth by the way. I used both cause I want to make sure on the first and second attempt(no changes at all) that I'm within spec. I also torqued the locking nut to specs.
Whether it has something to do with the oil or me being 100% cockeyed and dumb enough not to know what I'm doing, I'm just glad the 5w30 quieted things down and made it purr like a kitten. I'm happy, and the motor didn't blow up yet(you'll be the first to know if it does).
I would like to really thank you for your very informative and intellectual input!
Originally Posted by Gokhan
Originally Posted by Ambo87
I started the vehicle and dang the thing sounds like my grandma's 1948 15-91 Singer sewing machine!!!
This is a 100% indication that you messed up the valve clearances. It has absolutely nothing to do with the oil. You either confused between the intake and exhaust valves or don't know how to measure the clearances properly. It could also be something wrong with your gauge, such as metric vs. standard. If the noise decreased later, it's not because of the oil but because of all the severe beating the valves were receiving thanks to the incorrect valve adjustment. They should never sound like a sewing machine, and if they do, you know that the adjustment is wrong.
Last edited:
My sons 2010 Civic runs like silk on 5W20 Valvoline full syn with Maxlife tech... Valve train was much louder when I used Mobil 1 and Quaker State Ultimate durability.
True. It reminded me of Honda's B20b engines found on the Integras and CRV's. They run loose(little noisy) from the factory and as miles goes up it starts to quiet down(tightening)...until it starts to tick again, then you're 50/50 chance of burning the exhaust valves or just plain loose due to general wear.
Originally Posted by samven
It does not surprise me that it made more noise after the adjustment since valves tighten as they wear and that sewing machine noise is just what you want, even though it is dis-concerning. Running 5-30 has probably raised your oil pressure just a bit and quieted things down. I would stay with 30W if it was mine. Every car is an individual and because some do ok with 20W does not mean they all will.
Originally Posted by samven
It does not surprise me that it made more noise after the adjustment since valves tighten as they wear and that sewing machine noise is just what you want, even though it is dis-concerning. Running 5-30 has probably raised your oil pressure just a bit and quieted things down. I would stay with 30W if it was mine. Every car is an individual and because some do ok with 20W does not mean they all will.
Originally Posted by Ambo87
Whether it has something to do with the oil or me being 100% cockeyed and dumb enough not to know what I'm doing, I'm just glad the 5w30 quieted things down and made it purr like a kitten. I'm happy, and the motor didn't blow up yet(you'll be the first to know if it does).
No one said you're dumb. However, there is no question that something went wrong in the adjustment and it has nothing to do with the oil.
How can it be the oil? All oils are super thick when they are cold and don't reach their specified viscosity until they are fully warm, which is several times lower than their cold viscosity. The viscosity difference between SAE 20 and SAE 30 is only 10%. You're saying this 10% difference makes a day and night difference so that your valvetrain goes from a sewing machine to a fairly normal valvetrain? Between a cold and a hot engine, the viscosity difference is like 1,000%, regardless of the oil used. You didn't refer to anything warm-up specific; so, it's definitely not the oil.
I am guessing this could be the first time you adjusted the valves. I will tell you a story. The very first time I adjusted my valves on my old Corolla back when I was in Georgia, what you described is exactly what happened -- the valvetrain turned into a sewing machine. I was using a conventional 10W-40 at the time. I showed it to a mechanic, and he told me I got something wrong -- perhaps standard vs. metric -- and the valves could be damaged because they are being hit too hard because of the loose clearance. I decided to do it for a second time myself, and I proudly got it right then. The problem in my case was probably that I wasn't feeling enough pressure pulling the feeler gauge. The right way of doing it is that you should be barely able to pull out the feeler gauge. If there is only a minimal drag on the gauge, chances are that it's too loose because of intrinsic lash in the system.
Again, no one is calling you dumb, but you're not getting it right. Adjusting the valves is difficult and requires experience. It's quite possible that you're not feeling enough pressure on the gauge. As I said, you should be barely able to pull it; otherwise, you could end up with loose valves. You also need to recheck the clearance after you tighten the set screw because the clearance can change when you tighten it. My advice would be to redo the adjustment with what I said in mind.
Whether it has something to do with the oil or me being 100% cockeyed and dumb enough not to know what I'm doing, I'm just glad the 5w30 quieted things down and made it purr like a kitten. I'm happy, and the motor didn't blow up yet(you'll be the first to know if it does).
No one said you're dumb. However, there is no question that something went wrong in the adjustment and it has nothing to do with the oil.
How can it be the oil? All oils are super thick when they are cold and don't reach their specified viscosity until they are fully warm, which is several times lower than their cold viscosity. The viscosity difference between SAE 20 and SAE 30 is only 10%. You're saying this 10% difference makes a day and night difference so that your valvetrain goes from a sewing machine to a fairly normal valvetrain? Between a cold and a hot engine, the viscosity difference is like 1,000%, regardless of the oil used. You didn't refer to anything warm-up specific; so, it's definitely not the oil.
I am guessing this could be the first time you adjusted the valves. I will tell you a story. The very first time I adjusted my valves on my old Corolla back when I was in Georgia, what you described is exactly what happened -- the valvetrain turned into a sewing machine. I was using a conventional 10W-40 at the time. I showed it to a mechanic, and he told me I got something wrong -- perhaps standard vs. metric -- and the valves could be damaged because they are being hit too hard because of the loose clearance. I decided to do it for a second time myself, and I proudly got it right then. The problem in my case was probably that I wasn't feeling enough pressure pulling the feeler gauge. The right way of doing it is that you should be barely able to pull out the feeler gauge. If there is only a minimal drag on the gauge, chances are that it's too loose because of intrinsic lash in the system.
Again, no one is calling you dumb, but you're not getting it right. Adjusting the valves is difficult and requires experience. It's quite possible that you're not feeling enough pressure on the gauge. As I said, you should be barely able to pull it; otherwise, you could end up with loose valves. You also need to recheck the clearance after you tighten the set screw because the clearance can change when you tighten it. My advice would be to redo the adjustment with what I said in mind.
Originally Posted by bchannell
Well, I can tell you this for sure. On my 2010 Tacoma 2.7L, if I use 0w20, and it's cold outside, it will rattle really loud for probably a minute or slightly less. I changed it to 5w30, and it never makes a sound, purrs like a kitten. Does the rattle mean 0w20 is bad, no, not really, but it makes me feel better knowing it's not making the noise.
That's a known issue with the VVTi actuators on some Toyotas, and it's a hit-and-miss. In your case poorer lubrication as opposed to superior lubrication (5W-30 flows with difficulty when it's very cold but 0W-20 flows better) is actually helping. The only permanent solution is to replace the original actuators with the superseding part numbers.
Well, I can tell you this for sure. On my 2010 Tacoma 2.7L, if I use 0w20, and it's cold outside, it will rattle really loud for probably a minute or slightly less. I changed it to 5w30, and it never makes a sound, purrs like a kitten. Does the rattle mean 0w20 is bad, no, not really, but it makes me feel better knowing it's not making the noise.
That's a known issue with the VVTi actuators on some Toyotas, and it's a hit-and-miss. In your case poorer lubrication as opposed to superior lubrication (5W-30 flows with difficulty when it's very cold but 0W-20 flows better) is actually helping. The only permanent solution is to replace the original actuators with the superseding part numbers.
Originally Posted by Olas
Originally Posted by ARCOgraphite
Just added M1 0w40 to my VW. Its using oil and making racket.
Sound and runs MUCH better with a 1/2 litre of the 0W40 in there.
No gas mileage it.
An Yes , I don not like the Motul 508.
Factory oil was the best and superb, whatever it was.
As I understand it, 508 and 509 are aimed at Brazil where they all run gasohol, e90 or e95 i think. Jetta woud be happiest on 502/505 if non GPF, 504/507 if GPF equipped.
Dealer put that in - that was wrong, ran poorly, lost tonnes of fuel mileage turbo didn,t spool up in normal driving, veru sluggish.
That was Castrol 5W40 ( supposedly) by reading the bulk tank label.
I think a 5 w 30 ILSAC would do good in this motor.
Originally Posted by ARCOgraphite
Just added M1 0w40 to my VW. Its using oil and making racket.
Sound and runs MUCH better with a 1/2 litre of the 0W40 in there.
No gas mileage it.
An Yes , I don not like the Motul 508.
Factory oil was the best and superb, whatever it was.
As I understand it, 508 and 509 are aimed at Brazil where they all run gasohol, e90 or e95 i think. Jetta woud be happiest on 502/505 if non GPF, 504/507 if GPF equipped.
Dealer put that in - that was wrong, ran poorly, lost tonnes of fuel mileage turbo didn,t spool up in normal driving, veru sluggish.
That was Castrol 5W40 ( supposedly) by reading the bulk tank label.
I think a 5 w 30 ILSAC would do good in this motor.
Last edited:
Originally Posted by ARCOgraphite
Originally Posted by Olas
Originally Posted by ARCOgraphite
Just added M1 0w40 to my VW. Its using oil and making racket.
Sound and runs MUCH better with a 1/2 litre of the 0W40 in there.
No gas mileage it.
An Yes , I don not like the Motul 508.
Factory oil was the best and superb, whatever it was.
As I understand it, 508 and 509 are aimed at Brazil where they all run gasohol, e90 or e95 i think. Jetta woud be happiest on 502/505 if non GPF, 504/507 if GPF equipped.
Dealer put that in - that was wrong, ran poorly, lost tonnes of fuel mileage turbo didn,t spool up in normal driving, veru sluggish.
That was Castrol 5W40 ( supposedly) by reading the bulk tank label.
I think a 5 w 30 ILSAC would do good in this motor.
Most new VW/Audi/BMW engines are designed for and run 0W-20. A GM dexos1 Gen 3 0W-20 or 5W-20 is just fine for this engine once the warranty expires.
Originally Posted by Olas
Originally Posted by ARCOgraphite
Just added M1 0w40 to my VW. Its using oil and making racket.
Sound and runs MUCH better with a 1/2 litre of the 0W40 in there.
No gas mileage it.
An Yes , I don not like the Motul 508.
Factory oil was the best and superb, whatever it was.
As I understand it, 508 and 509 are aimed at Brazil where they all run gasohol, e90 or e95 i think. Jetta woud be happiest on 502/505 if non GPF, 504/507 if GPF equipped.
Dealer put that in - that was wrong, ran poorly, lost tonnes of fuel mileage turbo didn,t spool up in normal driving, veru sluggish.
That was Castrol 5W40 ( supposedly) by reading the bulk tank label.
I think a 5 w 30 ILSAC would do good in this motor.
Most new VW/Audi/BMW engines are designed for and run 0W-20. A GM dexos1 Gen 3 0W-20 or 5W-20 is just fine for this engine once the warranty expires.
I'm hard of hearing. Yet when I parked my 2018 Toyota Camry inside my garage after I bought it, the engine seemed very noisy to me. My wife commented on it as well.
The car came from the factory with 0W-16 in it, along with big yellow and black 0W-16 stickers plastered all over the engine bay. At 400 miles I changed the oil and filter to 0W-20, and it was unbelievable how much the engine quieted down at operating temperature.
The next oil change I went to 0W-30, and it ran even quieter. Since then it has seen nothing else.
The car came from the factory with 0W-16 in it, along with big yellow and black 0W-16 stickers plastered all over the engine bay. At 400 miles I changed the oil and filter to 0W-20, and it was unbelievable how much the engine quieted down at operating temperature.
The next oil change I went to 0W-30, and it ran even quieter. Since then it has seen nothing else.
I have observed this same thing, my car is specked for 5W-20 and when I started using 5W-30 my engine ran quieter. I am seeing the same thing now that I am running 0W-30.
- Joined
- Aug 6, 2021
- Messages
- 355
In the R18a2 you can use 0W40 mobil 1 fs. My Experience With that oil is very good Over 400000 Kilometers. The Valvs had you to Inspect every 100000 Kilometers.
My Element was the same had valves adjusted exhaust tight and intake within spec. Now it is noisier again but it is what you want in these old Honda's. The 5w30 does make them quieter in my E and I may try 0w40 or 5w40 at next oci to see if it is any better
It's seems a pattern is developing here. All of these noisy engines started when these oils got thinner and thinner. Adding thicker oil quieted them all down substantially.
Placebo police is on the way to tell all of you that it's just your imagination.
'18 subie impreza 2.0 gdi spec'd for Ow-20 is incredibly loud on cold starts...about as loud as air-cooled metric cruiser motorcycles I used to own; much louder than the mopar 2.4 'sewing machine' engines I had in a previously owned patriot & journey...both of those were spec'd for 5w-20
At what temperature?
Treat lightly my friend with comments like that. This thread can easily go 10 pages discussing things like a human's ability to detect changes in decibel levels, how increased engine noise isn't a problem, it's harmless, etc...........
lolMy thought is that oils meaning todays oils have gotten so good at flowing at the cold temps that more than likely a 0W-30 or even a 5W-30 is ok unless you are up in Northern Canada. Years ago, Flame Suite on, I found a bottle of 10W-30 dino oil from the early 80's and I did the Freezer Test versus a 10W-30 synthetic and the pour results were very different. I know the Pour Test is not a real test, but those are my thoughts.
Similar threads
