Malaysia Airlines 777 loses contact...not found

[Mystic]

It could be a pilot suicide also. And maybe the pilot wanted for it to be an enduring mystery that would go on and on. There is some evidence coming out about the pilot. But what I cannot understand is why somebody is willing to take a lot of innocent people with them.

If the pilot took the plane into the southern Indian Ocean it is very possible this aircraft will never be found.

If the aircraft was taken up north somewhere I guess the best possibility is that the aircraft will be used later in a terrorist attack.

 

[Vikas]

From what I read about ELT, it has two different beacons; one sends information to SAR satellite which can locate it within 2x2 km square and the other beacon which can be picked up by local receiver. They did say that older ELT had abysmmal reliability (58%) and the 2nd generation was not much better (82%). The current one is supposed to be lot more reliable but could not get claims of how many 9's reliability it has.

How many aircraft accident have occurred in the past where ELT did not get activated?

This is from the Wiki

All the systems work something like this: A beacon is activated by a crash, a sinking, or manually by survivors. The beacon's transmission is picked up by one or more satellites. The satellite transmits the beacon's signal to its ground control station. The satellite's ground station processes the signals and forwards the data, including approximate location, to a national authority. The national authority forwards the data to a rescuing authority. The rescuing authority uses its own receiving equipment to locate the beacon and makes the rescue or recovery. Once the satellite data is in, it takes less than a minute to forward the data to any signatory nation.

Emergency beacons operating on 406 MHz transmit a unique 15, 22, or 30 character serial number called a Hex Code. When the beacon is purchased the Hex Code should be registered with the relevant national (or international) authority. Registration provides Search and Rescue agencies with crucial information such as:
phone numbers to call, a description of the vessel, aircraft, vehicle, or person (in the case of a PLB) the home port of a vessel or aircraft any additional information that may be useful to SAR agencies

Registration information allows SAR agencies to start a rescue more quickly. For example, if a shipboard telephone number listed in the registration is unreachable, it could be assumed that a real distress event is occurring. Conversely, the information provides a quick and easy way for the SAR agencies to check and eliminate false alarms (potentially sparing the owner of the beacon significant false alert fines.)

An unregistered 406 beacon still carries some information, such as the manufacturer and serial number of the beacon, and in some cases, an MMSI or aircraft tail number/ICAO 24-bit address. Despite the clear benefits of registration, an unregistered 406 beacon is very substantially better than a 121.5/243.0 beacon; this is because the Hex Code received from a 406 beacon confirms the authenticity of the signal as a real SAR alert.

 

[Trav]

Wow this thread has it all maybe even space aliens.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: Trav
Wow this thread has it all maybe even space aliens.

LOL!!!

 

[friendly_jacek]

Vikas, did your wiki studies tell you how far the radio ways travel in salt water?

 

[antiqueshell]

Originally Posted By: Astro14
Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
@Turk:

What about the planes computer system being hacked, it can be done.

Lots of experts are saying that this was a highly professional job most likely.

Who would have that knowledge?



The airplane computer system doesn't run windows or another OS that would allow code rewrites. Honeywell owns the code, it's not public. Not a hacker area of expertise.

Further, the only interface with the computers is the data loader in the cockpit. It uses floppies. No wifi, no internet that allows external access.

The people saying that stuff don't know much about airplanes. Easier than breaking into the cockpit to then use floppies would be breaking into the cockpit and just flying the airplane. No hacking. No crazy theories. Program the computers the way that the pilots do: manual inputs to the FMC via the touchpad on the CDU.

Hacked? No...


Don't think a floppy could've of been altered?

Not solely focusing on Astro14 but I love all the obnoxious, sanctimonious [censored] that some are posting here, as if they are the only "authorities" and that others don't know anything, this is indeed the typical M.O. of the Israeli Hasbarats as well. Coincidence? Probably not.

I'd say at this point everything is on the table, or just about everything, the possibilities are limitless.

 

[ryansride2017]

Originally Posted By: Turk


They have it as it did not go into the water, but flew for 7 hours. It is now in Pakistan being fitted for its final mission.[/color]



Let's say this is what happened. I don't think they will sit on it too long before using it. They don't want to run the risk of losing this valuable weapon by someone stumbling upon it. I think they will act fast if this is what happened. If I were Israel, I would be on VERY HIGH alert until the location of this plane is found.

 

[ryansride2017]

Then again, just about anywhere would be in the cross-hairs (including the U.S.) if this thing was topped off with fuel....has a long fuel range.

 

[dave1251]

Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
but I love all the obnoxious, sanctimonious [censored] that some are posting here, as if they are the only "authorities" and that others don't know anything, this is indeed the typical M.O. of the Israeli Hasbarats as well. Coincidence? Probably not.

I'd say at this point everything is on the table, or just about everything, the possibilities are limitless.



First until the aircraft is located I agree the possibilities are limitless.

But as for "obnoxious, sanctimonious [censored] that some are posting here". Kettle the pot is black.

"this is indeed the typical M.O. of the Israeli Hasbarats as well. Coincidence? Probably not."

Sir please stay in your realm and not bother us in this universe it is the best for all involved.

 

[Trajan]

Originally Posted By: Trajan
Originally Posted By: antiqueshell


What do you call a military (the US military) that has murdered tens of millions of innocent civilians in the Middle East, Latin America, and Asia? Are they any less sinister, radical, underhanded, or destructive?


Again, where is the proof? You claim it, but instead of backing it up, you move on to long debunked 9/11 crackpot conspiracy theories.


Like I said, can't prove the claim.

Hardly obnoxious or sanctimonious to point out the obvious.

 

[Vikas]

I thought ELT are also fitted to boats. I am assuming it is designed to float and also designed to go off when it detects impacts. I understand that once it reaches at the bottom of the ocean, it will not be able to send out the signal to satellite but before that it could.

Obviously you believe that ELT does not work once it touches salt water. Can your provide a link for that?

==========
About the Cospas-Sarsat Search and Rescue System
Orbiting high overhead every minute of the day is a worldwide network of polar-orbiting and geostationary satellites. Together with Russia's Cospas spacecraft, they make up the high-tech international Search and Rescue Satellite-Aided Tracking System known as Cospas-Sarsat.

Cospas-Sarsat has been credited with nearly 30,000 rescues worldwide. The system relies on signals received on the 406 MHz frequency to pinpoint position and speed rescuers to the scene of an emergency on land or at sea.

In fact, the more reliable, digital 406 MHz frequency has become the de facto internationally recognized distress frequency. Using the 406 MHz frequency, modern signaling devices can quickly beam GPS LAT/LON coordinates to orbiting satellites. This frequency also allows a position fix through Doppler shift to acquire a location even when GPS can't.

As of February 1, 2009, satellite processing of distress signals from the older 121.5 and 243 MHz emergency beacons was terminated worldwide due to unreliability and false alarms. When a 406 MHz beacon signal is received, search and rescue personnel can retrieve information from a registration database.

This includes the beacon owner's contact information, emergency contact information and details regarding the specific trip plan and any medical conditions of the owner or members in the party. Having this information allows the Coast Guard, or other rescue personnel, to respond appropriately. NOAA, along with the U.S. Coast Guard, is strongly advising all mariners, aviators and individuals using 121.5/243 MHz emergency beacons to make the switch to 406 MHz in order to take full advantage of the Sarsat system.

Cospas-Sarsat is maintained and operated by governments all over the world, thus there is no subscription fee required for owning a 406 MHz EPIRB, ELT or Personal Locator Beacon.

- See more at: http://www.acrartex.com/landing/rescue/#sthash.BFD0p63K.dpuf

 

[ls1mike]

Originally Posted By: ryansride2017
Then again, just about anywhere would be in the cross-hairs (including the U.S.) if this thing was topped off with fuel....has a long fuel range.

Yeah I was surprised. It is/was a 777-200 ER...8892 miles!

 

[friendly_jacek]

Originally Posted By: Vikas
I thought ELT are also fitted to boats. I am assuming it is designed to float and also designed to go off when it detects impacts. I understand that once it reaches at the bottom of the ocean, it will not be able to send out the signal to satellite but before that it could.


The one fitted in ships are activated by sinking, the ones fitted on planes are activated by shock. We don't know what was installed by Malaysian Airlines. Furthermore, ETL can be switched off from cockpit in some planes (don't know about B777). It's a mute point now, ETL never sounded in this case, so it will never do.

 

[Merkava_4]

I think the plane landed somewhere.

Lots of places it could have landed:

http://mashable.com/2014/03/16/malaysia-airlines-runways/

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
All the experts say that it is no easy feat to disable and defeat the transponders on that 777.

Baloney. I can't speak for satellite links and the like, but just Google images on airliner's transponders and radios. Considering the rotary switches have a clearly labelled "OFF" position, I don't see how it isn't easy to shut them off. As Astro mentioned, one has to be able to shut off devices individually in case of failures.

Originally Posted By: Astro14
And CATERHAM hasn't been posting in BITOG since this pane went missing...

I think he must have sold the airlines some oil that was too thin, and it got such great fuel economy it's now flying around the world several times without landing.

 

[Astro14]

Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
Originally Posted By: Astro14
Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
@Turk:

What about the planes computer system being hacked, it can be done.

Lots of experts are saying that this was a highly professional job most likely.

Who would have that knowledge?



The airplane computer system doesn't run windows or another OS that would allow code rewrites. Honeywell owns the code, it's not public. Not a hacker area of expertise.

Further, the only interface with the computers is the data loader in the cockpit. It uses floppies. No wifi, no internet that allows external access.

The people saying that stuff don't know much about airplanes. Easier than breaking into the cockpit to then use floppies would be breaking into the cockpit and just flying the airplane. No hacking. No crazy theories. Program the computers the way that the pilots do: manual inputs to the FMC via the touchpad on the CDU.

Hacked? No...


Don't think a floppy could've of been altered?

Not solely focusing on Astro14 but I love all the obnoxious, sanctimonious [censored] that some are posting here, as if they are the only "authorities" and that others don't know anything, this is indeed the typical M.O. of the Israeli Hasbarats as well. Coincidence? Probably not.

I'd say at this point everything is on the table, or just about everything, the possibilities are limitless.



You miss the point entirely: to "hack" the computer would take proprietary software on a set of floppy disks, that would then have to be loaded in the one access point: IN THE COCKPIT.

The "hacked" computer would then do nothing different. It would still fly where the pilots wanted, or it would be disconnected by the pilots.

So, since you're already in the cockpit, why not just fly the plane?

It's a pointless, ignorant theory. You can't "hack" what you can't reach. To reach it, you've already gained access to the flight controls that you were trying it over ride with the "hacked" computer...

 

[Turk]

The new flight path was programmed in while everything was fine.

This rules out LOTS of stuff.

 

[Astro14]

Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
I think the plane landed somewhere.

Lots of places it could have landed:

http://mashable.com/2014/03/16/malaysia-airlines-runways/


Actually, there are more places than this that it could have landed...because they use only the criterion of 5,000 feet. Since that fails to take into account the ability of the runway and taxiways to support a 777 without crumbling, it's clear that by "landing" we mean "airplane on ground" not "airplane on ground, undamaged, and able to take off again". So, a sufficiently long farmers field would work...since you only care about getting on the ground, and not exactly in fly able condition.

Another skin deep analysis of a complex problem, reaching a specious conclusion.

Sigh...

On most of those airports, the concrete would break, rendering the airplane unmovable. It would then be visible by satellite overflight. If it was actually being hijacked, and they wanted to hide the plane, it would be at one of very few airports that has 1) sufficiently strong runways and taxiways and 2) hangar space for a 777....

But as has been pointed out; "anything is still on the table" - which includes the secret floating base of shadowy masterminds, the giant submarine operated by KAOS, alien abduction and relativistic distortion of space time...

Only the "sanctimonious" like me would apply logic and a personal understanding of the operational nature of an airliner to rule out some of these more "enlightened" suggestions...

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: Trav
Wow this thread has it all maybe even space aliens.

LOL!!!

How did I miss this? LOL

 

[Blaze]

Originally Posted By: ryansride2017
After 10 days, I don't think the debris field would be tucked so close to the plane.
Hard to say. If that plane is broke in pieces there are thousands of objects inside that plane already broke loose so I would imagine "wave action" and tides will continue to throw items out of the plane over a long period of time. There will be a debris field close to the plane for some time I would think.