Amen!
LSJR Boutique vs OTS shootout
- Thread starter rstsco
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Yes but we all know more is not better
All of them.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
I don't know, but there's a clear trend for 6 of the 8 oils in terms of correlation between test sequence and oil temperature and a looser correlation for 5/6 of 8 for torque:
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
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after all the info. that LSJ had on this video, there still is a lot of brand loyalty and mistrust of his testing, hopefully if anyone thinks he/she can contribute more solid information (not biased opinions) just read and learn what he found in relation of the test results.
Testing a new avatar?
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The main purpose of all these dyno pulls was piston ring testing. His data headers were related to piston rings, not oils. These extended test sessions gives him the ability to make YT videos, but are not the sole purpose of his being there. The oil testing is just a bonus.
Someone mentioned Lake having said the cam/engine was built specifically to wear faster, therefore wear metals shouldn't be looked at. I disagree. If the engine is wearing at the same rate across all oils tested, the numbers should count. But even Lake said the difference in wear metals was minimal in his testing and basically a wash.
So far, the video has been watched 119k times and has 10k likes. If 25% of people watch the entire video, which is not unreasonable considering those clicking on it are oil aficionados like the majority of BITOG members, this video should give him a pretty good return on his investment of a dozen or so cases of oils.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
I think this is his best video (at least so far), but there's still stuff to discuss regarding the results. I think probably the most obvious "issue", at least in this thread is his takeaway (that there's no statistical difference in what the used oil analysis show for wear) vs what some seem to be pumping earlier in this thread, which is that there is. I agree with Lake, and my graphing of the iron PPM shows slightly higher figures for the first two oils and then a "settling" for the remaining six. This underscores what many of us have been saying on here for years, which is that you can't bench race used oil analysis, but there is a strong bias toward reading far too much into the information they provide because it's the only tool we have at our disposal.
There does seem to be a reasonably strong correlation between test sequence and oil temperature, which to me indicates there's something else going on there that's not being accounted for, which could be tribofilm creation/destruction and the flushing isn't addressing this. ZDDP breakdown and surface interaction is an incredibly complex subject that's not 100% understood in its entirety, so we may be observing a manifestation of that phenomena, which would also potentially influence torque I suspect. The deviations from these trends appear to be the oil that sheared the most, reducing viscosity (may also have the lowest HTHS, their PDS doesn't really provide us with a concrete number, just equal to or greater than 2.9cP) and of course the Driven racing oil, which is likely additized differently than the other basic API SP additive package oils (and it's based on an API SN chemistry he notes as well).
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MLOB thank you v. much (meme lord of BITOG)
There are questions I've had for probably 23 years that I still don't know the answer too. For example, is Red Line good? LOL j/k
In all seriousness, many of these questions can't be answered based on the limited data we look at. It's just not possible. So instead, we speculate.
In all seriousness, many of these questions can't be answered based on the limited data we look at. It's just not possible. So instead, we speculate.
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Yeah, I agree, but isn't there two ways to look at it? I look at it in your way, "the caking effect". I could be wrong, I am assuming he is looking at if flow rate. Which would mean lose of efficiency. BUT....... Then look at it could be thinking of it as if the filter is a thicker 3D media. The new filter/and time used, would use up or catch say 5 micron particulates and the media would fill up the 5 micron space and no longer have 5 micron catching space. That would allow the 5 micron particulates to flow through the 10 micron filter media space, so then the filter would be less efficient? But then wouldn't the layering/caking effect still grab the finest small micron of particulate, as it crashes into the cake and imbeds and the oil that just lost it's 5 micron particulate to imbed, flows through usable flow space clean of that? Just saying, I have seen this a couple of times brought up, like two different ways interpret Lake 's comment. Could this be a case of semantic ambiguity, specifically lexical ambiguity?
Esters. Man.
Red Line has ALL of them. So must be good amirite
(I also still don't know if Red Line is good or not.)
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I agree and this has been my feeling about boutique oils for years. I’m a bit shocked when I see people dumping HPL at 5,000 miles in the “Latest Oil Change Thread” because the off the shelf oils can achieve that just fine. I understand the emphasis for people on ring cleanliness, but Castrol EDGE Extended Performance, Mobil 1 ESP/EP, and Pennzoil Ultra Platinum are pretty stout products.
I mentioned awhile back that I took a look at the rotating assembly of my S85. Years of doom and gloom from Internet 'experts' had me curious. It has been on a steady diet of Redline 10w60, since early in it's life. It sees redline every time it's driven, after it reaches full operating temp.
Anyway, back to the rotating assembly. The bearings and journals were all perfect, so it went back together with the original bearings.
We also have a couple other forced induction engines that are running Redline oil.
So in light of this test, I'm concerned my good results aren't possible. Not to mention what I've seen in extreme racing applications using Redline...
I have used some Liqui Moly in the past and liked it, product 4600 5W-30 to be exact. Does this extremely poor sheer test result mean all of Liqui Moly oils are garbage? I have been looking at their 4210 0W-30 oil, (have never purchased it or used it yet) which has some group 4 and the BMW LL-04 rating, which I don't think the Molygen Lake Speed tested does not have. Would anything in the 4210 specs tell you it may do better in the sheer testing? I noticed that the Molygen rated number 1 or two in the other tests, which seems to be practically ignored. I almost appear to be a Liqui Moly fanboy I guess, I try not to be a fanboy of any brand. I do try to do USA owned products, which means I would have to stick to Mobil or Conoco Phillips (Red Line, Kendall etc.) for shelf oils, or Amsoil, HPL and Driven boutiques, which I don't use right now. Anyhow, Liqui Moly is expensive for a mostly group 3 base oil product. I do know, at least in my past experience, they do make some decent stuff, worth the price? maybe not. As long as I am putting stuff out there, I am currently using Motul 8100 X Clean + EFE 5W-30, which I also like. Next, I plan to use either this same oil in their 0W-30 version or somebody else's 0W-30. I already used the Mobil 1 ESP 0W-30, that is off the list for now.
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