Kia / Hyundai engine issues disproportionately in US?

This video shows a Theta II with one trashed rod bearing and all other bearings in great shape.
One would not expect that in an engine with poor lube hygiene:


Thanks for posting. Very interesting.

The rod bearings are all pretty worn - copper showing. Watch starting at 27:30. Its also very varnished up so it hasn't been treated all that well.

Seems like a complex bottom end. Not sure what to think - maybe a combination of under design and under maintenance with a dose of poor QC thrown in for good measure?
 
I can't say I've ever heard of a Hyundai with the 2.4 GDI Engine in the UK so that might be one reason why we are not seeing so many engine failures. Hardly scientific but I just did a quick check of the larger used Hyundai models and they appear to use a 1.6 turbo petrol or a 1.6 Diesel. I'm not saying the 2.4 doesn't exist in Europe but if it does, it's not popular. The smaller models used a 1.0 turbo petrol or 1.4 turbo petrol.
 
I can't say I've ever heard of a Hyundai with the 2.4 GDI Engine in the UK so that might be one reason why we are not seeing so many engine failures. Hardly scientific but I just did a quick check of the larger used Hyundai models and they appear to use a 1.6 turbo petrol or a 1.6 Diesel. I'm not saying the 2.4 doesn't exist in Europe but if it does, it's not popular. The smaller models used a 1.0 turbo petrol or 1.4 turbo petrol.
Thats the Gamma engine. While far from perfect, its seems to have many fewer problems than the infamous Theta 2 that has been the subject of many recalls and complaints.
 
People blame owners and oil viscosity, but let’s be real. Most other brands also have neglectful owners and spec 0W-20 etc in the US and no one is remotely close to the piles of dead engines at every Kia dealer.
 
can't comment on those "newer" engines...
I had a MY2k Sonata, with the Old 2.4 Sirius (G4JS).
owned it for 8.5 years/roughly 100k mi.
never had an engine issue, but it ALWAYS burned about 1 qt/1000mi.
I forget if the cap called for 5w20, or 5w30, but I always ran Valvoline 10w30. ( 3k mi/6mo intervals) slowed consumption, but def. didn't stop it.
( bought August 2001, 1 yr old, w/16k mi , $10k - later found out the Original owner was Hertz)

like I said, no engine issues, but there were others, almost all covered by the 10y/100kmi warranty.
Dead Tach, both front window regs, Rear wheel bearings, and not long before i sold it, had to have the CV boots replaced
took it in to have the boots inspected at 99,900 mi. ( rotating tires, noticed the inside of the front rims were covered in grease) They were cut/torn by the Rusted out Subframe, which they had just announced a recall on. Warranty Covered the Boots, Recall got me a new Subframe.

Sold for $2k Feb. 2010, with about 120k mi. Replaced it with a 55k mi '05 Neon i bought from my Brother.
 
I n Europe people take better care of their cars. They don't consider using up a car and then throwing it away. They also rarely drive with the pedal to the metal. They get a lot of that driving out of their system before they can afford a car

Agree 100% that they take better care of their cars, but nearly every European I have ridden with drives MUCH harder than the average American...at least Americans here in central IA.
 
The issue was exacerbated by customers opting for cheap gasoline and neglecting the use of PEA fuel system cleaners. This, combined with extended oil change intervals (OCIs), led to the low-tension piston rings sticking, which resulted in oil consumption. Many of these engines were severely damaged due to owner neglect, as they were run low on oil.

A rod knock might be invisible, but it's certainly not inaudible. Many owners, whose engines didn't seize from neglect, continued driving their vehicles with knocking sounds until at least one rod exited the block. Subsequently, they blamed Hyundai for the failures.

You might wonder why people treated their cars this way. It's important to consider that Hyundai/KIA's target demographic ten to fifteen years ago consisted of low to medium-income customers, many with sub-prime credit. For me, Hyundais were always affordable vehicles that didn't cost much to own and maintain. I never encountered major issues with them and could always justify my warranty claims, which were few and never drivetrain-related.

Many of these customers were not educated on vehicle maintenance and lacked the financial means to pay for it. Consequently, their Hyundais and KIAs received minimal maintenance, if any.

Additionally, there is a category of buyer I refer to as the "smart wannabe buyer." These individuals purchase used vehicles, thinking they can save on depreciation. The problem is that buying a used Hyundai/KIA often means inheriting the previous owner's neglect. If the vehicle was repossessed, it is almost certain that no one took proper care of it.

I hope this clarifies why Hyundais and KIAs have a perceived reliability issue in the US. If Toyota or Honda had lowered their prices in the past decade and offered financing to anyone with a pulse, they would likely face similar challenges today.
I hope to clarify for you that a good majority of these theta 2 engines seize up without any prior rod knock. The service manager/licensed tech at the Goodyear shop I used to work at had his 2013 Santa Fe seize up without any prior warning and so did my wife's. If you've done much reading from individuals posting about their engine failures you will see that a good majority of them seize up without any warning signs. Ours didn't even use a drop of oil between 3k oil changes.
I won't argue with you that a lot of the owners of these will neglect them. However plenty fail without neglect also so when you combine those that you couldn't do anything to prevent, the ones that burned oil and ran low, and the ones who neglected them it leads to a failure rate that is probably 10x what any of brands are.
Perception of unreliability can stem from perceiving what is in front of you, such as seeing Hyundai and Kia being loaded onto tow trucks pretty well every day. Talking to people who work on cars every day. Reading forums. When lots of them fail,it does give the perception of unreliability. Lol.
Oh yeah, my wife's Sonata at 90k miles is on the second engine and the 5th starter lever in the starter. When the starter lever breaks it usually means the car is leaving on a tow truck.
My caa only has 1 call left on it until January because of 3 tow calls for the 2013 Sonata. My 2005 Silverado is used for work Monday to Friday and so far this year zero tow calls. In fact only 3 in 19 years.
 
I think as a whole there is less maintenance and care for HK vehicles in north america.
As an owner of numerous HK vehicles they treat us better than our last Honda.

So much so, I will never buy a Honda product again.
yeah- that will show Honda! LOL
 
I somewhat agree with this statement. My buddy was the head mechanic at our local Hyundai dealership. He would send me pictures of some of the cars with blown engines. They were very poorly maintained. They would come in full of trash. There would often be dirty diapers, chicken bones, rat droppings, and fire ants inside of the cars. They were pretty much a waste hazard.
Chicken bones and diapers in the top end of the engine?
 
I'm from Spain, but i follow many American so called Youtuber Mechanics on Youtube Facebook IG etc.
Almost every day i see either a Instagram or Fb reel about Kia and Hyundqai gasoline GDi engines being crap and blowing up all the time.

But i just don't see that here, i know several mechanics and people who have Hyundais and Kias with Gdi engines and they are not having problems like that.

In fact here Kia and Hyundai are very proud that and advertise alk the time that they provide a 7 year / 150.000km ( 90k mile ) warranty on all their models.

5 years unlimited warranty on the hyundais

We had an engine replacement in about once a month, in a garage with 3 mechs
 
Where are you engines manufactured?

I believe the majority of Hyundai/Kia engines sold in the US are made domestically. It is a huge global company that does alot of business in SE Asia too who do not usually opt for the fat and cursed 2.4 L engines, so this is an interesting question as to where yours was sourced from.

Czech republic for Hyundai, Slovakia for Kia, and some from Korea aswell
 
The issue was exacerbated by customers opting for cheap gasoline and neglecting the use of PEA fuel system cleaners. This, combined with extended oil change intervals (OCIs), led to the low-tension piston rings sticking, which resulted in oil consumption. Many of these engines were severely damaged due to owner neglect, as they were run low on oil.

A rod knock might be invisible, but it's certainly not inaudible. Many owners, whose engines didn't seize from neglect, continued driving their vehicles with knocking sounds until at least one rod exited the block. Subsequently, they blamed Hyundai for the failures.

You might wonder why people treated their cars this way. It's important to consider that Hyundai/KIA's target demographic ten to fifteen years ago consisted of low to medium-income customers, many with sub-prime credit. For me, Hyundais were always affordable vehicles that didn't cost much to own and maintain. I never encountered major issues with them and could always justify my warranty claims, which were few and never drivetrain-related.

Many of these customers were not educated on vehicle maintenance and lacked the financial means to pay for it. Consequently, their Hyundais and KIAs received minimal maintenance, if any.

Additionally, there is a category of buyer I refer to as the "smart wannabe buyer." These individuals purchase used vehicles, thinking they can save on depreciation. The problem is that buying a used Hyundai/KIA often means inheriting the previous owner's neglect. If the vehicle was repossessed, it is almost certain that no one took proper care of it.

I hope this clarifies why Hyundais and KIAs have a perceived reliability issue in the US. If Toyota or Honda had lowered their prices in the past decade and offered financing to anyone with a pulse, they would likely face similar challenges today.
H/K has the same issue as Nissan-their (former?) target demographic consists/consisted of financially challenged customers that would honestly be better off using public transit than driving (& destroying/damaging) a new car they couldn't afford, which then gets repo'ed, pieced back together, and sent to the local hoopty used car lot for the process to repeat itself. Now that new car prices have skyrocketed, it's less of an issue; but, there's still lots of that Big Altima Energy around here.
 
People blame owners and oil viscosity, but let’s be real. Most other brands also have neglectful owners and spec 0W-20 etc in the US and no one is remotely close to the piles of dead engines at every Kia dealer.
If one doesn't treat an H/K engine with kid gloves-frequent oil changes with decent oil, TT fuel (or at least PEA occasionally), and not beating them hard, they don't have the margin for error/durability of Honda, Toyota, or even Nissan. H/K can & will blow up on you, even if maintained somewhat well.
 
The 2020 Elantra just got a new longblock last month.
42000 miles and 4.5 years old.
it has the anemic port injected atkinson cycle 2L.

Fortunately another 5.5 years of warranty on it. Will probably trade it in.. but 5 months or 5 years who knows at this point.
 
If one doesn't treat an H/K engine with kid gloves-frequent oil changes with decent oil, TT fuel (or at least PEA occasionally), and not beating them hard, they don't have the margin for error/durability of Honda, Toyota, or even Nissan. H/K can & will blow up on you, even if maintained somewhat well.
You forgot to include keeping the Eco Mode turned off. The 2.4 The II engines had a 13:1 compression ratio.
 
The 2020 Elantra just got a new longblock last month.
42000 miles and 4.5 years old.
it has the anemic port injected atkinson cycle 2L.

Fortunately another 5.5 years of warranty on it. Will probably trade it in.. but 5 months or 5 years who knows at this point.
Ouch. What happened?
 
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