Jeep 4.0 - 6400MI - 22k on XG8A(Fram Ultra) - Particle Count

[kschachn]

Originally Posted by ZeeOSix
The "Insolubles" in the UOA has no correlation to the PC. I've plotted them out and I see no correlation.

That's interesting but I don't understand that. If there is stuff in the motor oil that isn't dissolved in the oil then it has to be floating around and should appear in the particle count, right?

This is what Blackstone says:

Insolubles

 

[ZeeOSix]

I plotted out thescreensavers PC data, and also 3 other Ultra PCs from member Patrick0525, and a Toyota TRD also from Patrick0525. Ultras #1 thru #3 basically all lay right on top of each other.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted by kschachn
Originally Posted by ZeeOSix
The "Insolubles" in the UOA has no correlation to the PC. I've plotted them out and I see no correlation.

That's interesting but I don't understand that. If there is stuff in the motor oil that isn't dissolved in the oil then it has to be floating around and should appear in the particle count, right?

This is what Blackstone says:

Insolubles


https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/foru...lubles-vs-iso-particle-count#Post4859910

 

[kschachn]

Well thanks, but I still don't get it I guess. I can understand that "insolubles" could include liquids and those of course wouldn't be filtered out by the filter. But that Blackstone article made it sound like they are solids.

Never mind, guess I don't have to understand everything.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted by kschachn
Well thanks, but I still don't get it I guess. I can understand that "insolubles" could include liquids and those of course wouldn't be filtered out by the filter. But that Blackstone article made it sound like they are solids.

Never mind, guess I don't have to understand everything.


I'd think if the UOA insolubles % indicated cleanliness of the oil, then there would be a pretty good correlation between a PC and the insolubles % numbers. Comparing them in many UOAs does not show that correlation. Why there is no good correlation is another quest. Maybe that is a good question for Blackstone or other UOA labs to answer.

 

[dave1251]

I'm not liking this UOA. It looks to me it's time for a head gasket replacement or warped block. Maybe it's my experience with the 4.0 is the cause of my bias.

 

[thescreensavers]

Originally Posted by dave1251
I'm not liking this UOA. It looks to me it's time for a head gasket replacement or warped block. Maybe it's my experience with the 4.0 is the cause of my bias.


Let's see in 10k miles how the Silicon and Sodium look. May have to pull the head like you said, the coolant system has been through [censored]. Though if there is a leak it's not very large.

 

[DrDave]

Greetings:

It's nice to see some reference to the UOA's done a couple of years ago on my 99 Tacoma. That truck now has a new home. It left here with 365,000 miles on the clock. The UOA's remained consistent throughout my entire ownership of the vehicle. I settled in on 40k mile filter changes.

In consideration of the current discussion I think it's difficult to make any definitive statements about the filtering efficiency of the filters in question without some baseline info. I would encourage a VOA with PC of the oil being used. That will tell you what the PC of the oil is before it goes into the motor. Obviously the engine wear is contributing to the overall PC. I'm just one UOA into two new-to-me vehicles, an ML550 and CL600. The ML has the 5.5L V-8 (M273) and the CL the 5.5L V-12 (M275). The UOA + PC for each motor after the first 9500 mile runs were quite impressive. Actually, the wear numbers and PC numbers were much lower than expected. As an example the V-12 PC for >4micron was 923 particles. All wear metals are single digit. Unfortunately I still don't have the technical ability to post the actual reports. I would gladly do that once I learn how. I can say I plan on several change intervals before changing the oil filter. The sump capacity is a generous 9.5 quarts each. I look forward to gathering data and sharing the results. I can say that these appear to be very "happy" motors. My oil of choice for both machines is the 0W-40 Amsoil European going forward. The current report is with whatever oil the previous owner had used.

Thank you.

 

[harry j]

I just type in all the numbers from Blackstone Labs

 

[DrDave]

Thanks Harry j:

I like the visual of the actual report, especially comparing successive samples. I use Analysts Inc. in California. I would guess the report formats types are the same.

Dave

 

[harry j]

I agree, I would like to post the original report, please let me know when you figure it out. Until then, it's typing for me.

 

[DuckRyder]

Interesting, so here we have another Ultra with no so impressive PC counts.

DrDave, harryj... the hardest part of posting the blackstone (or other) report is changing it to a JPEG.JPG, on a mac you can open it with preview then "save as" on a phone you can grab a screen shot. Probably can do it on a windows box with Paint or a screenshot. Once you do that, it is like any other picture, you can even just attach it here now. BTW, if you log into your blackstone account online, you can produce the report without personal information.

 

[DrDave]

Thank you for the info.

Dave