HPL EC treatment started. 2007 Camry 2AZ-FE 153k consumption.

[skaughtz]

Let the EPR idle in the engine for 20-30 Mins.
If this long don't raise the idle.
Fingers crossed for you.
Those must be some really stuck up rings.


Also it took 2 treatments with BG, a few hundred miles apart, for me to see a big drop in consumption.

The can says to raise to 1200rpm after it idles to operating temp. I was going to run it at that for 20 minutes. Otherwise the car idles at 750rpm.

And yeah, I'm not looking for an instant fix, just something that indicates that the treatments have done something. A slight decrease after the HPL EC or BG EPR means that I can get it down further with time. No change at all would mean it is a physical issue with the rings that could only be fixed by replacing them. Either way they aren't getting replaced, so I would at least do the HPL EC/BG EPR cycle a second time before admitting defeat.

 

[nicholas]

The can says to raise to 1200rpm after it idles to operating temp. I was going to run it at that for 20 minutes. Otherwise the car idles at 750rpm.

And yeah, I'm not looking for an instant fix, just something that indicates that the treatments have done something. A slight decrease after the HPL EC or BG EPR means that I can get it down further with time. No change at all would mean it is a physical issue with the rings that could only be fixed by replacing them. Either way they aren't getting replaced, so I would at least do the HPL EC/BG EPR cycle a second time before admitting defeat.

Go for it.
Either way you use it, it's a good product.

I'm just sharing what I did, that worked for me.

 

[53' Stude]

Oil can't fix bad engineering.

Exactly right. It’s the rings, not the chemicals he’s dumping in.

 

[Mewbs]

I would at least inspect the cylinder walls to see how much worn out the cross hatching is. An oval up cylinder wall is something you can't fix with engine flushes, specially with how thin those cast-in iron liners are which limits how much you can rebore/hone on a rebuild. I remember OP saying he inherit this vehicle from another owner that has slight oil consumption issues until it got worse to the point it is now. It might be better to let go the vehicle or do an engine swap with a low mileage salvaged unit.

 

[skaughtz]

I would at least inspect the cylinder walls to see how much worn out the cross hatching is. An oval up cylinder wall is something you can't fix with engine flushes, specially with how thin those cast-in iron liners are which limits how much you can rebore/hone on a rebuild. I remember OP saying he inherit this vehicle from another owner that has slight oil consumption issues until it got worse to the point it is now. It might be better to let go the vehicle or do an engine swap with a low mileage salvaged unit.

I recently bought a borescope to check that exact issue. I plan on pulling a plug before I run the EPR and change the oil, so when I do that I will post the images here.

And I see the comments from other posters about how it is likely a physical issue with the rings and the chemicals are pointless. Once I inspect it with the borescope and/or run the EPR without seeing any decrease in consumption afterwards, we can check that box and this experiment is over and she gets Super Tech until she dies. Until then my fingers are crossed and interest is piqued.

 

[demarpaint]

I recently bought a borescope to check that exact issue. I plan on pulling a plug before I run the EPR and change the oil, so when I do that I will post the images here.

And I see the comments from other posters about how it is likely a physical issue with the rings and the chemicals are pointless. Once I inspect it with the borescope and/or run the EPR without seeing any decrease in consumption afterwards, we can check that box and this experiment is over and she gets Super Tech until she dies. Until then my fingers are crossed and interest is piqued.

The problem is the bore scope is not going to show the carbon build up [if any] in the ring packs. You'll see the piston tops and the bore, but that's not going to tell much about a cleaning up the ring packs. The only way to know for sure is if consumption is reduced or stopped. I would certainly give the EPR a shot, and report back about the consumption, it might help. In any event good luck.

 

[Mewbs]

I recently bought a borescope to check that exact issue. I plan on pulling a plug before I run the EPR and change the oil, so when I do that I will post the images here.

And I see the comments from other posters about how it is likely a physical issue with the rings and the chemicals are pointless. Once I inspect it with the borescope and/or run the EPR without seeing any decrease in consumption afterwards, we can check that box and this experiment is over and she gets Super Tech until she dies. Until then my fingers are crossed and interest is piqued.

I would do 2 treatments of BG EPR a thousand miles apart as a last resort before giving up, its a very strong solvent that will funk up your garage for a few days using it for the first time but it was worth it for both me and my brother when it came to oil eating car problems. The longer you run that thing in the crank case the more it flushes out, just swap in a new oil filter before doing it to weed out any potential filter clogging before starting. I would recommend 20 minutes at most and 30 minutes max at idle rpm before draining the flush to get the solvent to work itself through the ring lands.

The first flush I did on my bros 270k oil burning prius really help bring consumption down greatly even though we suspect the PCV was clogged which we wasn't able to service due to busy life factors. Its one of the strongest flush I've seen that has given immediate results. Best of luck for you and your vehicle.

Anyways, HPL EC, while is a great product, I feel its aimed more for healthy engines looking to clear out deposits before moving on to their stronger cleaning oils. I have used it on my Yaris recently in the current oil service life and has seemed to disolved a bunch of stuff and held it in suspension on the oil. Did an oil filter autopsy a while ago showing the engine is running healthy and clean.

 

[Brons2]

I, personally, if I had one of these I-4 low tension oil burners, would be tempted to do something of an "in-frame" re-ring job. Take the cylinder head and the oil pan off, push the pistons out of the top of the bore, dingle ball hone cylinders with 400 grit, and put in some file fit rings with no more than 15 thousandths of clearance on the top and second ring as measured with a feeler gauge.

Replace rod bearings with stock since they're already open, and timing components, button up and run it.

I don't frequent Toyota/Honda forums where these problems are well known, but has this ever been tried? No separating the engine from the transmission, no engine hoist or stand, etc. Maybe could help?

 

[LeakySeals]

I’m late to the party but thought I would share many years and 250k experiences in Camry forums with a 2002 Camry with a 2AZ–FE 2.4. I think you mentioned driving patterns changed into city stop and go, and the oil consumption increased. I think this is what happened. There was a problem with the piston design for multiple years, including yours. It’s not the rings initially. It’s the size and the quantity of the piston oil return holes. They are too small and too few. The thin aluminum block has a tendency to get really hot in the piston area which can causes motor oil to flash in the piston oil return holes and turn into a mass of hardened carbon. Once that happens, oil backs up and jams the rings. So the oil consumption gets even worse. There is no flow through the holes once they clog so unfortunately you can’t clean your way out of the problem. That explains why the cleaners are not working. Your options are pull out the pistons that you have and modify them. Drill out the piston oil return holes. Purchase a Japanese JDM engine that has the updated pistons. Perform the attached TSB.

https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2015/MC-10111356-9999.pdf

 

[LeakySeals]

Forgot to mention the 2AZ-FE also has a problem with valve seals as the mileage piles up. Another heat related problem. Maxlife definitely helped puff the seals up a bit so the consumption wasn’t as bad. That was probably the best results out of anything I tried. I probably had both problems at 250 K.

 

[Triple_Se7en]

BG EPR has a lot of followers and good reviews. It's easy to use. Just follow directions precisely for best results. Then do a maintenance using the other EPR product. One is MOA - other is EPR.

The HPL Oil is a better investment than the Oil Treatment. The oil has a stronger concentration of cleaners. Buy enough for two OCIs and you will eventually say that the investment was wise and it paid-off in the long run.

It's disgusting to see PC Valves and oil caps that look like that. Lack of maintenance with vehicles is only deemed acceptable if the owner lives on the poverty level.

My father-in-law into his mid-80s pushed pencils and pens all his life. He was never a handyman, but had the sense to have a mechanic on call. Once a year Dad would have his vehicles looked-over and things got replaced before they looked like that nasty PC Valve unit and oil cap.

Daddy-in-law was good at oiling the typewriters and cleaning the printers. He owned a Polish newspaper business for 35 years or-so. A Journalism whiz..... but don;t ask him to scrape his bedroom ceiling that took-in a little roof water......lol

 

[proveitwithdata]

Forgot to mention the 2AZ-FE also has a problem with valve seals as the mileage piles up. Another heat related problem. Maxlife definitely helped puff the seals up a bit so the consumption wasn’t as bad. That was probably the best results out of anything I tried. I probably had both problems at 250 K.

Thank you for providing some actual insight on the issue rather, then yell "buy some expensive cleaner and boutique oil" to fix a mechanical issue that Toyota themselves have declared require a mechanical repair.

 

[supton]

I don't frequent Toyota/Honda forums where these problems are well known, but has this ever been tried? No separating the engine from the transmission, no engine hoist or stand, etc. Maybe could help?

I’ve heard of it for Saturn and Corolla, often with people drilling the oil return holes to a larger size. Not sure on Camry.

 

[LeakySeals]

I’ve heard of it for Saturn and Corolla, often with people drilling the oil return holes to a larger size. Not sure on Camry.

That’s correct the 98–02 Corolla had the same clogged piston oil return problem that was resolved with different Pistons in 03. And some of the early Saturns had no piston oil return holes at all

 

[panthermike]

That’s correct the 98–02 Corolla had the same clogged piston oil return problem that was resolved with different Pistons in 03. And some of the early Saturns had no piston oil return holes at all

Yes, I owned a 2000 Corolla and it was the only Toy/Lexus product that ever gave me issues. When I traded it in at 167K, it was using a quart every 4-500 miles. My '03 on the other hand was a gem, my friend still uses it for work and its at 235k. Only issue in 20 years was starter replaced last year.

 

[proveitwithdata]

That’s correct the 98–02 Corolla had the same clogged piston oil return problem that was resolved with different Pistons in 03. And some of the early Saturns had no piston oil return holes at all

The later 1zzs still had the issue, and the fix was to add more oil into the sump and new dipstick.

 

[350Rocket]

Forgot to mention the 2AZ-FE also has a problem with valve seals as the mileage piles up. Another heat related problem. Maxlife definitely helped puff the seals up a bit so the consumption wasn’t as bad. That was probably the best results out of anything I tried. I probably had both problems at 250 K.

My sister has a 2005....I personally saw it smoke blue on startup once or twice...it has not had oil consumption (2005 is not really as prone to it apparently), but we did replace the valve cover gasket as that was leaking when she bought it a couple years ago. I don't think it's smoking on startup anymore, so not sure if that was valve seals or not. It's had 3k synthetic oil changes since purchase. Previous owner I think never changed trans fluid which is why it's on its last legs at 180k. Oil I think was changed every 3k but I'm thinking the lady retired and then 3k ended up being all short trips taking maybe over a year to achieve...so the oil gets dirty quickly now.
Can the valve cover gasket leaking actually let enough oil past the spark plugs to cause smoke on startup?

 

[supton]

Can the valve cover gasket leaking actually let enough oil past the spark plugs to cause smoke on startup?

Can’t see how, the plug would have to be loose. Would think it would in short order shoot the plug out.

 

[350Rocket]

Can’t see how, the plug would have to be loose. Would think it would in short order shoot the plug out.

That was my thought, but wondered if I was missing anything.

 

[Plawan]

My sister has a 2005....I personally saw it smoke blue on startup once or twice...it has not had oil consumption (2005 is not really as prone to it apparently), but we did replace the valve cover gasket as that was leaking when she bought it a couple years ago. I don't think it's smoking on startup anymore, so not sure if that was valve seals or not. It's had 3k synthetic oil changes since purchase. Previous owner I think never changed trans fluid which is why it's on its last legs at 180k. Oil I think was changed every 3k but I'm thinking the lady retired and then 3k ended up being all short trips taking maybe over a year to achieve...so the oil gets dirty quickly now.
Can the valve cover gasket leaking actually let enough oil past the spark plugs to cause smoke on startup?

No. If oil could leak through it from the outside in spark and combustion byproduct could go through the other way.