Group III vs Factory Fill Dodge 5w-20

[mpersell]

I just changed the oil in the RAM from factory fill (whatever Dodge uses for a 5w-20) to Amsoil XL 5w-20.

Does anyone know what Dodge uses for factory fill oil and how it compares to Amsoil XL?

I would have used the new 0w-20 but the warehouse here in Dallas is out.

 

[KieferS]

stop worrying. Amsoil is as good, if not better than your factory fill. Happy trucking!

 

[mpersell]

I'd like to use the 0w30 like I do in the Jeep but the dealer went off like a crazed farm animal when I brought it up, insisting on 5w-20. The specs list the Chrysler spec 6395 but also recommends 5w-20

 

[dave1251]

You have to use 5W-20 in the 5.7 HEMI with the MDS system. If you do use 20WT oil your system will not deactivate 4 cylinders because the MDS system is activated by an certain oil PSI in correlation of RPM's. Don't worry about using 5W-20 your engine will be fine. I use Chevron and Pennzoil in my truck and it runs fine about 18 MPG. As for factory fill I suspect DC uses bulk oil from XOM that was formally known as Mobil Drive Clean.

 

[Roy Gutfinski]

The basic reasons for the 20 weight oils in new vehicles is to reduce "viscous drag" in the engine and thus keep fuel economy as high as possible. Internal tolerances are not significantly different from what they were several years ago. I continue to believe that 30 and even 40 weight (operating temperature viscosities) will give much better engine life and reduced wear over 20 weight oils.

 

[mpersell]

I forgot to add that this is a 4.7 Flexfuel engine.

 

[sdude2k2000]

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The basic reasons for the 20 weight oils in new vehicles is to reduce "viscous drag" in the engine and thus keep fuel economy as high as possible. Internal tolerances are not significantly different from what they were several years ago. I continue to believe that 30 and even 40 weight (operating temperature viscosities) will give much better engine life and reduced wear over 20 weight oils.

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[buster]

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The basic reasons for the 20 weight oils in new vehicles is to reduce "viscous drag" in the engine and thus keep fuel economy as high as possible. Internal tolerances are not significantly different from what they were several years ago. I continue to believe that 30 and even 40 weight (operating temperature viscosities) will give much better engine life and reduced wear over 20 weight oils.

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Roy, do you have any proof to back this up? We've seen numerous engines with well over 200k run on nothing but 20wt oils. Oil analysis reports, if they are an accurate representation of engine/component wear, have also been excellent. Today's oils contain better base oils and the most advanced additives available.

 

[unDummy]

He's in Texas. His engine shouldn't notice a difference between a 20wt or 30wt.
MDS is controlled by the ECU.

 

[zrxkawboy]

He has the 4.7, which has no MDS.

Jeff

 

[dave1251]

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He's in Texas. His engine shouldn't notice a difference between a 20wt or 30wt.
MDS is controlled by the ECU.

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MDS MAKES FOUR FROM EIGHT
The whole point of this exercise was primarily to explain and demonstrate the 2005 Hemi's new Multiple Displacement System (MDS) in an enlightening manner more fun than your average Powerpoint presentation. We got to see the four solenoid valves--mounted directly to the engine block down in the valley of the V8--that disable cylinders 4 and 6 (the two inners on one bank) and cylinders 1 and 7 (the two outers on the other bank) under light engine loads. This switch-over is totally transparent to the driver, because the V4 operation utilizes even 180° firing intervals. The only thing the driver feels is joy when he calculates how much less fuel he's using on a long drive. Chrysler says the Hemi in the 300C sedan is rated for 25 mpg on the highway.

Here's how MDS works: There are four special 2-piece roller lifters for the cylinders that get disabled. The two pieces are concentric--there's an inner portion surrounded by an outer sleeve. The two parts are locked together by two spring-loaded pins when the engine is in 8-cylinder mode and all the pushrods are operating their valves normally. Under light loads, however, the engine management computer signals each solenoid valve to open and apply high oil pressure to its respective exhaust- and intake-valve lifters. This action forces the two pins in each disabling lifter to unlock the two concentric parts. (To help minimize oil contamination, there’s a magnet at the bottom of each solenoid unit to collect ferris debris.)

Now, the outer sleeve continues to follow the camshaft lobe, but the inner portion of the lifter just floats. This results in no pushrod movement, so the valve springs keep the valves closed. Spark and fuel for the respective MDS cylinders are shut off, and now the engine is in 4-cylinder mode.

Credit www.popularmechanics.com.

 

[dave1251]

How the Multi-Displacement System Works
The idea was to design a system where the onboard engine computer could deactivate four cylinders simultaneously. This is especially helpful when the vehicle is in cruise mode running down the freeway at 65 mph where the road load horsepower requirement is probably less than 20 hp. In this situation, it doesn't make much sense to have all eight cylinders pumping away when four could easily to the job. Eliminate the pumping requirements of four cylinders, and you're guaranteed to improve fuel economy. That's why DaimlerChrysler designed the Multi-Displacement System (MDS).

The system was designed around what is called a "lost motion device." DaimlerChrysler engineers designed the Hemi with a separate oil circuit controlled by four solenoids that apply oil pressure to eight specially configured hydraulic roller lifters. When the computer decides to deactivate the cylinders, the solenoids are electronically engaged and oil pressure is sent to the lifters via a separate oil passage in the block that pushes on a small pin that allows the internal piston in the hydraulic lifter to disengage from the lifter. The lifter body still rises and falls with the cam lobe, but the piston that is linked to the pushrod remains stationary. DaimlerChrysler engineers state that the system can deactivate four cylinders within 40 milliseconds (0.040 second). Both the intake and exhaust lifters for each cylinder are deactivated. Every other cylinder is deactivated so the transition from eight to four and four to eight cylinders is seamless. We've driven both the new Dodge Magnum and the Chrysler 300-C, and it is impossible to tell when the engine is running on four cylinders and when it doubles back to eight.

Credit www.carcraft.com


Also refer to TSB 09-015-04 and 09-013-04 - says: “Vehicles with the Multiple Displacement System must use SAE 5W-20 oil. Failure to do so may result in improper operation of the MDS.”

 

[Panzerman]

One 200,000 mile engine on 5w20, Ive seen on here. Unless they changed the oil themselves and accually dumped in the 5w20, I dont believe it. Most people think they are getting high milelage on their Hondas and Fords and the truth is most of them are getting 10w30 and 5w30 at the dealerships and at the oil change shops. Ive talked to friends recently that work at Ford, Chevrolet and a Texaco oil change and they all use 10w30 or 5w30, Texaco will use 5w20 if you, and only, if you request it and charge more. One local Ford dealer, where I bought my car, told me they use 5w30 because they have oil consumption issues in some cars with the 5w20. I have tried 5w20 oil and have used a quart between changes which is acceptable, but with the same vehicle and using 5w30, no oil consumption. I bought a new 06 Hemi and Ive been using 10w30 in it since new with 0 oil consumption and no noises at startup. As far as I concerned the 5w20 is not proven yet, and more cars get 10w30, since 75% of people dont change their oil which further fudges the count. My Dodge manual states that 5w20 aids in cold weather starting and promotes better fuel milelage(At least till you are out of warranty).

 

[Hermann]

If I lived in Daytona I would not need 5w-20 either. But I live in a area where it was between 0 to 10 degrees every morning for a month straight this past winter.

When I changed my oil in January, the temp was about 35, I drained the oil within 5 Minutes of stopping the engine. I had just driven 28 miles,and the oil from the engine was not even what you would equate to hot tap water. This tells me that when a "Modern" engine driven in moderate temps, would not even get a 5 or 10w30 into its optimal operating viscosity. IMHO 5w-20 is ideal for the I-Vtec 2.4L Accord 4-cyl.

 

[Seth]

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I'd like to use the 0w30 like I do in the Jeep but the dealer went off like a crazed farm animal when I brought it up, insisting on 5w-20. The specs list the Chrysler spec 6395 but also recommends 5w-20

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Slightly OT but I am lazy to start a new thread...Can you use 0w30 GC instead of 5w20? I own a mitsu thats specd for 5w20.

 

[Patman]

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I'd like to use the 0w30 like I do in the Jeep but the dealer went off like a crazed farm animal when I brought it up, insisting on 5w-20. The specs list the Chrysler spec 6395 but also recommends 5w-20

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Slightly OT but I am lazy to start a new thread...Can you use 0w30 GC instead of 5w20? I own a mitsu thats specd for 5w20.

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I would not use GC in an engine specified for 5w20, it's too thick. GC is very close to a 40 weight oil. In fact it usually thickens to a low 40 weight oil in my cars by about the 4 or 5000 mile mark.

 

[Steelers]

Tried CG in a 2.0 RSX and its too thick. Made the little engine feel sluggish. Car doesn't use any oil and I'm currently using Pennzoil Platinum 5w-20 which is $19 for 5 quarts at Walmart. AA had Pennzoil Platinum on sale BOGOF this month also. I would use a 5w-20 (preferably synthetic) with confidence in that Hemi.