Fram ExtraGuard PH8316, 7100 miles, 4 months

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Originally Posted By: sayjac
For the OP, is there some reason why this application uses the extra adbv? Does it have something to do with the orientation of the filter? Does it have something to do with the engine design? Have you used other filters without the extra adbv and noticed a difference at start up as far as nvh, start up rattle?


The Motorcraft FL-2005 has this - which it calls the "anti-siphon" valve - for the Zetec motor. Not sure why they spec-ed it. I don't believe the 2005 is available anymore.

I've used both the 8316 (with this anti-siphon valve) and the 3600 (without the anti-siphon valve) on two different cars, but neither was mine. I cannot comment on noise at start-up, but never heard any complaints from the drivers, so I assume they were OK.

Honestly, I got these filters at an oil change special (have a bunch of the MG8316, same design). The only reason I went with the 8316 instead of the 3600 is (i) I feel a little better with the filter holding a little more oil, and (ii) since the 8316 was more money, I felt I was getting a "better" deal
smile.gif
 
Thanks for answering all my questions, I know there was a bunch of them. Son had a 4.6L Explorer that had a minor start up rattle one oci, when using other than the FL-820S, reason I asked about it.

And getting the MG8316's on oil change specials, you got/bought them right.
56.gif
 
Originally Posted By: sayjac
Have you used other filters without the extra adbv and noticed a difference at start up as far as nvh, start up rattle?

Which Fram were you using that gave you that noise? was the filter mounted vertically?
 
Originally Posted By: sayjac
Quote:
First off, the OCOD name is just misleading. It may cost more than other filters, however if people are willing to pay for it then why shouldn't Fram charge a higher price......

Sure, proving ignorance is bliss. And an uninformed consumer, willing to believe the advertising and pay more for less, Fram's got it covered. Most folks reading this board though, aren't uninformed. I did notice the OP's filter has the more customer/installer friendly tapping plate, rather than the Fram new(old) cheaper tapping plate and mounting opening.

Also, most folks here don't have a issue with the orange can strictly because it's a Fram with "engineered media" fiber end caps. It's the cost for construction. Sell the orange can for ~$2.00 and then cost for construction argument becomes less of a factor. Like the free MG 'black can' being basically free with O'R promo. I did say most folks though, but not all.

For the OP, is there some reason why this application uses the extra adbv? Does it have something to do with the orientation of the filter? Does it have something to do with the engine design? Have you used other filters without the extra adbv and noticed a difference at start up as far as nvh, start up rattle?

My dad ran an 81 Tercel to 250,000 miles with nothing but Fram filters and Castrol 20w-50. All combinations most people would frown on. Fram filters are fine. I have pretty much decided they save money where it doesn't matter. Kind of like a GLOCK pistol. GLOCK proved we were wasting money and weight on metal frames for centuries and recieved very similar negative press and impressions at first. Fram is kind of working the opposite way. Decades of cars maintained to high miles, then suddenly uproar about cardboard endcaps. I agree with the over-priced thing, although I really like the grip stuff on the bottom. I buy them when on sale, and they are fine. This is the whole dead horse thing.
 
Quote:
....Fram filters are fine. I have pretty much decided they save money where it doesn't matter..... Decades of cars maintained to high miles, then suddenly uproar about cardboard endcaps. I agree with the over-priced thing, although I really like the grip stuff on the bottom. I buy them when on sale, and they are fine. This is the whole dead horse thing.

Fram saving 'money where it doesn't matter', when the top of the line canister filters start using fiber end caps, then perhaps I could agree. Hasn't happened. And if Fram wants to save money using fiber endcaps cool, pass the savings on the customer with ~$2.00 orange cans. Also hasn't happened. Even the OP in this thread says he gets his at a very reduced price with oil change specials, not everyday price. And why would I pay ~$4.65 for a PH7317 when one can now get an equivalent Puro Classic L14610 at Wally for $3.27? I wouldn't.

But I would agree, the orange can is adequete for 5k/6month ocis, but nonetheless, overpriced. Better choices out there for less. And the "sudden" revelation about fiber end caps, I suspect it came with growth of and access to the internet, the original online minimopar oil filter study and sites like Bitog. Now interested/curious consumers can see what they are getting, or not getting, for their money and can make an informed choice. They are able to see and compare what's inside the once mysterious canisters. How it happened for me.

Originally Posted By: LeakySeals
Originally Posted By: sayjac
Have you used other filters without the extra adbv and noticed a difference at start up as far as nvh, start up rattle?

Which Fram were you using that gave you that noise? was the filter mounted vertically?

No, I was asking the OP the question because of the unique double adbv used in the topic'd 8316, and curious if other filters without the 2 adbv's caused any noise/start up rattle when used in the same vehicle.
 
Originally Posted By: 95busa
Originally Posted By: sayjac
Quote:
First off, the OCOD name is just misleading. It may cost more than other filters, however if people are willing to pay for it then why shouldn't Fram charge a higher price......

Sure, proving ignorance is bliss. And an uninformed consumer, willing to believe the advertising and pay more for less, Fram's got it covered. Most folks reading this board though, aren't uninformed. I did notice the OP's filter has the more customer/installer friendly tapping plate, rather than the Fram new(old) cheaper tapping plate and mounting opening.

Also, most folks here don't have a issue with the orange can strictly because it's a Fram with "engineered media" fiber end caps. It's the cost for construction. Sell the orange can for ~$2.00 and then cost for construction argument becomes less of a factor. Like the free MG 'black can' being basically free with O'R promo. I did say most folks though, but not all.

For the OP, is there some reason why this application uses the extra adbv? Does it have something to do with the orientation of the filter? Does it have something to do with the engine design? Have you used other filters without the extra adbv and noticed a difference at start up as far as nvh, start up rattle?

My dad ran an 81 Tercel to 250,000 miles with nothing but Fram filters and Castrol 20w-50. All combinations most people would frown on. Fram filters are fine. I have pretty much decided they save money where it doesn't matter. Kind of like a GLOCK pistol. GLOCK proved we were wasting money and weight on metal frames for centuries and recieved very similar negative press and impressions at first. Fram is kind of working the opposite way. Decades of cars maintained to high miles, then suddenly uproar about cardboard endcaps. I agree with the over-priced thing, although I really like the grip stuff on the bottom. I buy them when on sale, and they are fine. This is the whole dead horse thing.



Good comparison using Fram and Glock as examples. They are also 2 brands I won't buy.
 
Originally Posted By: GMBoy
Originally Posted By: 95busa
Originally Posted By: sayjac
Quote:
First off, the OCOD name is just misleading. It may cost more than other filters, however if people are willing to pay for it then why shouldn't Fram charge a higher price......

Sure, proving ignorance is bliss. And an uninformed consumer, willing to believe the advertising and pay more for less, Fram's got it covered. Most folks reading this board though, aren't uninformed. I did notice the OP's filter has the more customer/installer friendly tapping plate, rather than the Fram new(old) cheaper tapping plate and mounting opening.

Also, most folks here don't have a issue with the orange can strictly because it's a Fram with "engineered media" fiber end caps. It's the cost for construction. Sell the orange can for ~$2.00 and then cost for construction argument becomes less of a factor. Like the free MG 'black can' being basically free with O'R promo. I did say most folks though, but not all.

For the OP, is there some reason why this application uses the extra adbv? Does it have something to do with the orientation of the filter? Does it have something to do with the engine design? Have you used other filters without the extra adbv and noticed a difference at start up as far as nvh, start up rattle?

My dad ran an 81 Tercel to 250,000 miles with nothing but Fram filters and Castrol 20w-50. All combinations most people would frown on. Fram filters are fine. I have pretty much decided they save money where it doesn't matter. Kind of like a GLOCK pistol. GLOCK proved we were wasting money and weight on metal frames for centuries and recieved very similar negative press and impressions at first. Fram is kind of working the opposite way. Decades of cars maintained to high miles, then suddenly uproar about cardboard endcaps. I agree with the over-priced thing, although I really like the grip stuff on the bottom. I buy them when on sale, and they are fine. This is the whole dead horse thing.



Good comparison using Fram and Glock as examples. They are also 2 brands I won't buy.


Why? Do explain
 
Originally Posted By: sayjac
And if Fram wants to save money using fiber endcaps cool, pass the savings on the customer with ~$2.00 orange cans. Also hasn't happened.


Why should they pass the saving to it's customer? If they can get away with charging $4-$5 on their Extra Guard then they are going to keep doing it. I don't like it just like the rest of you but, If I sold a product and kept cost down and charge a premium price and can get away with it, i'm going to keep doing it. If you had a business and sold something for X amount, that was selling well. Why would you lower the price? Just to be nice? I'm sure the bean counter at Fram knows well that they are making more money by doing it this way than lowering the cost just so more people will buy it.
 
Yep ... the only time FRAM will lower the price of their filters is when they start loosing sales to other brands.
 
Originally Posted By: Silver02ex
Originally Posted By: sayjac
And if Fram wants to save money using fiber endcaps cool, pass the savings on the customer with ~$2.00 orange cans. Also hasn't happened.


Why should they pass the saving to it's customer? If they can get away with charging $4-$5 on their Extra Guard then they are going to keep doing it. I don't like it just like the rest of you but, If I sold a product and kept cost down and charge a premium price and can get away with it, i'm going to keep doing it. If you had a business and sold something for X amount, that was selling well. Why would you lower the price? Just to be nice? I'm sure the bean counter at Fram knows well that they are making more money by doing it this way than lowering the cost just so more people will buy it.

Obviously the shysters at Fram concur with your opinion. Most here though, won't/don't get snookered by the advertising, so they're not fooled, eg. see thoughts no more Super Tech at Walmart thread. And while you may or may not like it personally, or so you say, you clearly approve of the uniformed paying more for less. Takes all kinds.
 
Originally Posted By: sayjac
Most here though, won't/don't get snookered by the advertising, so they're not fooled, eg. see thoughts no more Super Tech at Walmart thread.


Yep, and the sad thing is only a small percentage of people really know what's inside an oil filter and know what the differences mean. When people realize what's inside a FRAM (or a SuperTech or other like filters), and the price they are paying for it, then the consumer starts to realize the value (what you get for the cost) is lower with the FRAM then with some other brands.

Of course the caveat to all this is that everyone has a different sense or definition of "value" to them.
 
All I said was I understand what they are doing. If I was in their shoes and create more profit I would do the same thing. Just because I understand it, doesn't mean I'm going to buy a Fram filter for full price. I'm not trying to convince anyone to go buy their filter. I try to look at it from a consumer's and Fram's stand point.
 
Originally Posted By: sayjac

Obviously the shysters at Fram concur with your opinion.


Why are you so angry with Fram? Tell us your personal experience with this filter.
 
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: sayjac
Most here though, won't/don't get snookered by the advertising, so they're not fooled, eg. see thoughts no more Super Tech at Walmart thread.


Yep, and the sad thing is only a small percentage of people really know what's inside an oil filter and know what the differences mean. When people realize what's inside a FRAM (or a SuperTech or other like filters), and the price they are paying for it, then the consumer starts to realize the value (what you get for the cost) is lower with the FRAM then with some other brands.

Of course the caveat to all this is that everyone has a different sense or definition of "value" to them.


Which filter are you using?
 
Originally Posted By: LeakySeals
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: sayjac
Most here though, won't/don't get snookered by the advertising, so they're not fooled, eg. see thoughts no more Super Tech at Walmart thread.


Yep, and the sad thing is only a small percentage of people really know what's inside an oil filter and know what the differences mean. When people realize what's inside a FRAM (or a SuperTech or other like filters), and the price they are paying for it, then the consumer starts to realize the value (what you get for the cost) is lower with the FRAM then with some other brands.

Of course the caveat to all this is that everyone has a different sense or definition of "value" to them.


Which filter are you using?


Purolator or WIX/NAPA Gold.
 
Originally Posted By: sayjac
Originally Posted By: Silver02ex
Originally Posted By: sayjac
And if Fram wants to save money using fiber endcaps cool, pass the savings on the customer with ~$2.00 orange cans. Also hasn't happened.


Why should they pass the saving to it's customer? If they can get away with charging $4-$5 on their Extra Guard then they are going to keep doing it. I don't like it just like the rest of you but, If I sold a product and kept cost down and charge a premium price and can get away with it, i'm going to keep doing it. If you had a business and sold something for X amount, that was selling well. Why would you lower the price? Just to be nice? I'm sure the bean counter at Fram knows well that they are making more money by doing it this way than lowering the cost just so more people will buy it.

you clearly approve of the uniformed paying more for less. Takes all kinds.


Really? did I say I'm one of the people who pay full price for a Fram? If you want to be mad at Fram, why don't you get mad at K Mart of charging more for a Purolator than Wal Mart, or Auto Zone who charge more for oil than Wal Mart. Look at O'reilly who switch from Purolator to Fram for their house brand. Go get mad at them for cutting cost and not charging less for a filter. Many companies cut cost and doesn't give their savings to their customers.
 
Originally Posted By: sayjac
Obviously the shysters at Fram concur with your opinion. Most here though, won't/don't get snookered by the advertising, so they're not fooled, eg. see thoughts no more Super Tech at Walmart thread. And while you may or may not like it personally, or so you say, you clearly approve of the uniformed paying more for less. Takes all kinds.


This response has no place here. I looked on the Fram website and didn't see "The Church of Fram" anywhere on there.
 
Last edited:
Purolator and NAPA/WiX offer metal end caps which are nice!! and metal center tubing vs ECORE plastic. hot engine oil requires a strong filter- why install something that is a minimum design?
 
Originally Posted By: Silver02ex
Originally Posted By: sayjac
you clearly approve of the uniformed paying more for less.......


Really? did I say I'm one of the people who pay full price for a Fram? If you want to be mad at Fram, why don't you get mad at K Mart of charging more for a Purolator than Wal Mart, or Auto Zone who charge more for oil than Wal Mart......

And obviously you are not uninformed (operative word) regarding the cheaper construction of Fram. So, you approve of others paying full price for the orange can but not you. Not sure what you're getting so defensive about, you said it. And, if you look at my thoughts on the orange can here and elsewhare, it's been very fair to the OP's orange can and the orange can as a whole.

I don't have to get "mad" at anyone, because I'm not uninformed either so I too can avoid being snookered. And you store analogies are poor. Stores competing on price for the same product, enable the shopper to make a choice on where to shop for that same product. The orange can interior construction as compared to other better built filters is not generally seen by the uninformed consumer. And now, the previous superior tapping plate still shown on the orange can box, doesn't show the new cheapened tapping plate design now in the box, used on the filter.

Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: sayjac
Most here though, won't/don't get snookered by the advertising, so they're not fooled, eg. see thoughts no more Super Tech at Walmart thread.


Yep, and the sad thing is only a small percentage of people really know what's inside an oil filter and know what the differences mean. When people realize what's inside a FRAM (or a SuperTech or other like filters), and the price they are paying for it, then the consumer starts to realize the value (what you get for the cost) is lower with the FRAM then with some other brands.

Of course the caveat to all this is that everyone has a different sense or definition of "value" to them.
True that.
 
Has anyone proven the Fram engineered media endcaps are inferior to metal ones? Or is it just in this case, metal is stronger so it must be better?
 
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