Ford EVs can now charge at Tesla Superchargers

[JeffKeryk]

The F-150 Lightning and Mustang Mach-e can now charge at Tesla Superchargers using a free adapter.
Who's your Daddy?
This is good for Ford EV owners, maybe no so much for Tesla owners waiting to charge...

It is likely a billion dollar business for Tesla by 2030. They continue to add capacity based on demand and are starting to add pull through stations for the CT and Lightning.

 

[GON]

Will this help reduce the 300+ day supply of new Mustang Mach- Es sitting on Ford dealership parking lots?

Amazed how poor selling the Mach- E is. Actually, nobody should be surprised for numerous key reasons.

 

[atikovi]

Will my Focus Electric be able to use it? Only has a 70-80 mile range so should charge in 2 minutes, no?

 

[dnewton3]

Excellent idea!

Why not add more demand to a system already strained with capacity and reliability issues?

 

[Snagglefoot]

Given that a lot of chargers are outright paid for by tax payers money, the large cost of installing Tesla chargers, and the ability of home owners to charge at home, I see public chargers as a loss leader. Perhaps they would add to the businesses that the chargers are near. I see it as being something like the local hardware store giving out free popcorn. I have not checked to see if the superchargers are reported as a separate division in the Tesla year end report. The electrical power still has to be purchased and you can only move so many cars through during the day. Let’s start with the capital cost of the charger installation, an estimate on how many charges you can put through in a day, the average charge cost per kWhr and the average electricity cost per kWhr. I’ll bet Tesla loses money on every charge.

 

[JeffKeryk]

Excellent idea!

Why not add more demand to a system already strained with capacity and reliability issues?

Do you have data to support your claim? I am always open to new information.
The Tesla Supercharger network is very reliable. Other networks have suffered; perhaps that's what you are referring to?
What's nice is the software will show you the number of chargers (and level), number in use and number not in service. It will route you to an appropriate location. Of course I do not know if the Ford application will do the same.

Tesla continually adds capacity. Allowing Ford, and other makes, will accelerate the build out. Basically, Tesla won the standardization and owns most of the gas stations. That's a dominant business position.

 

[JeffKeryk]

Will this help reduce the 300+ day supply of new Mustang Mach- Es sitting on Ford dealership parking lots?

Amazed how poor selling the Mach- E is. Actually, nobody should be surprised for numerous key reasons.

It will likely help somewhat, as the #1 issue with EVs is charging issues. But the product itself is likely the reason they are not selling well.
Wait till the big boys get in, right?

 

[JeffKeryk]

Given that a lot of chargers are outright paid for by tax payers money, the large cost of installing Tesla chargers, and the ability of home owners to charge at home, I see public chargers as a loss leader. Perhaps they would add to the businesses that the chargers are near. I see it as being something like the local hardware store giving out free popcorn. I have not checked to see if the superchargers are reported as a separate division in the Tesla year end report. The electrical power still has to be purchased and you can only move so many cars through during the day. Let’s start with the capital cost of the charger installation, an estimate on how many charges you can put through in a day, the average charge cost per kWhr and the average electricity cost per kWhr. I’ll bet Tesla loses money on every charge.

A key reason for Tesla's success is their Supercharger network.
They take care of all costs required for installing the chargers. Location owners also don't need to pay anything for the modification work of their property. Tesla will also pay for the electricity charges for charging the cars.

 

[ecotourist]

It is likely a billion dollar business for Tesla by 2030. They continue to add capacity based on demand and are starting to add pull through stations for the CT and Lightning.

Whether it's a good thing for Tesla owners depends on the situation. In my area (based on my limited experience) there are enough charging stations where there are chargers. But some areas and even some significant routes don't have any Superchargers. So more Superchargers especially on new routes in exchange for an occasional wait would be a fair exchange.

I do almost all my charging at home anyway so this issue would only apply on long trips.

The other important point would be that this implies acceptance of the Tesla charging system as the North American standard. And that would benefit Tesla owners in the short term and all EV owners in the medium to long term. I say that because the existing Supercharger system is very reliable.

 

[2strokeNorthstar]

Do you have data to support your claim? I am always open to new information.
The Tesla Supercharger network is very reliable. Other networks have suffered; perhaps that's what you are referring to?
What's nice is the software will show you the number of chargers (and level), number in use and number not in service. It will route you to an appropriate location. Of course I do not know if the Ford application will do the same.

Tesla continually adds capacity. Allowing Ford, and other makes, will accelerate the build out. Basically, Tesla won the standardization and owns most of the gas stations. That's a dominant business position.

Do you have data to support your claim that Tesla owns most of the gas stations?

 

[JeffKeryk]

Do you have data to support your claim that Tesla owns most of the gas stations?

Yes. Look at a Supercharger map. The NACS is being adopted by most of the EV companies.

 

[y_p_w]

The other important point would be that this implies acceptance of the Tesla charging system as the North American standard. And that would benefit Tesla owners in the short term and all EV owners in the medium to long term. I say that because the existing Supercharger system is very reliable.

Part of the reason for this is the 2021 infrastructure law passed by the US Congress that allocated $7.5 billion to adding more charging infrastructure. But one of the conditions was making the charging equipment (and maybe networks?) available to multiple vehicle brands. The goal was to have charging available at least every 50 miles along major highways.

 

[GrumpyCat]

Given that a lot of chargers are outright paid for by tax payers money, the large cost of installing Tesla chargers, and the ability of home owners to charge at home, I see public chargers as a loss leader.

No Tesla Superchargers are paid for or subsidized by the government. All paid for outright by Tesla. Government would not assist Tesla because Superchargers were a one-make solution.

You are confusing Superchargers with Electrify America, which was funded explicitly to spend VW diesel fines. Is run badly. Is unreliable and spotty.

 

[GrumpyCat]

It will likely help somewhat, as the #1 issue with EVs is charging issues. But the product itself is likely the reason they are not selling well.
Wait till the big boys get in, right?

Not really. The Gas Station Model doesn't work for EVs but ICEheads can't get that out of their system.

I have little need for "gas stations" when I start every morning with a full charge (well, I set it to 70% which is more than enough for most days). Cost at home is 1/3rd the cost at a Supercharger, and only takes 15 seconds to connect at night, 15 seconds to disconnect in the morning. No re-routing to a gas station. No inconvenient 5 minutes to fill the tank.

Misguided people have been told they can operate an EV just like an ICE. Sometimes works, for a little bit, then blows up as happened this winter in Chicago.

On the other hand when visiting Barber Vintage Motorsports Museum 116 miles away I can get there and back on one charge but why bother when I can stop at Buc-ees which has (16) 250 kW Superchargers?

 

[GrumpyCat]

A key reason for Tesla's success is their Supercharger network.
They take care of all costs required for installing the chargers. Location owners also don't need to pay anything for the modification work of their property. Tesla will also pay for the electricity charges for charging the cars.

No. The Tesla automobiles are simply excellent EVs while everyone else is mediocre to bad.

Yes, Tesla pays all costs to install Superchargers.

Yes, Tesla pays for the electricity but then bills the user. Free Lifetime Supercharging was only offered in the early years but I've heard they are offering it once again on the S and X.

 

[GrumpyCat]

Do you have data to support your claim that Tesla owns most of the gas stations?

Tesla's SEC filings. Tesla owns all of them. Leases space for most but owns the installation.

 

[andrew_j]

Excellent idea!

Why not add more demand to a system already strained with capacity and reliability issues?

I thinks it’s great idea. In NH/maine/VT those Tesla superchargers/chargers are rarely ever full. Just sitting about 50% full at best.

 

[JeffKeryk]

Not really. The Gas Station Model doesn't work for EVs but ICEheads can't get that out of their system.

I have little need for "gas stations" when I start every morning with a full charge (well, I set it to 70% which is more than enough for most days). Cost at home is 1/3rd the cost at a Supercharger, and only takes 15 seconds to connect at night, 15 seconds to disconnect in the morning. No re-routing to a gas station. No inconvenient 5 minutes to fill the tank.

Misguided people have been told they can operate an EV just like an ICE. Sometimes works, for a little bit, then blows up as happened this winter in Chicago.

On the other hand when visiting Barber Vintage Motorsports Museum 116 miles away I can get there and back on one charge but why bother when I can stop at Buc-ees which has (16) 250 kW Superchargers?

The ability to piggyback on the Tesla Supercharger network has to help Mach-e sales, at least somewhat, as it partially alleviates non-NACS charging issues. The Tesla charging network is the most reliable and biggest available.
Simply put, it opens up more charging options for Ford and other EVs.

It will also accelerate the growth of Superchargers, as demand increases.
It also helps Tesla as a company, because they get more value out of their asset.

 

[y_p_w]

No Tesla Superchargers are paid for or subsidized by the government. All paid for outright by Tesla. Government would not assist Tesla because Superchargers were a one-make solution.

You are confusing Superchargers with Electrify America, which was funded explicitly to spend VW diesel fines. Is run badly. Is unreliable and spotty.

They’re accepting federal subsidies now.

https://www.reuters.com/technology/tesla-open-us-charging-network-rivals-75-bln-federal-program-white-house-2023-02-15/

 

[Snagglefoot]

No Tesla Superchargers are paid for or subsidized by the government. All paid for outright by Tesla. Government would not assist Tesla because Superchargers were a one-make solution.

You are confusing Superchargers with Electrify America, which was funded explicitly to spend VW diesel fines. Is run badly. Is unreliable and spotty.

I wasn’t talking about Tesla being subsidized. A lot of Tesla’s competitors are.