Europe has fallen behind America and the gap is growing

[Trav]

I am not sure who you are talking about, but the CA University System generates more engineers, doctors and technical grads than anywhere in the world. Grads win the most Nobel Prizes and Patents; there is so much more.

By the way, I am proof the education exists. I am a product of it; I got my 1st degree at 40. Anywhere else I would likely have been relagated to a much different life. Education is definitely here. Come visit our Community Colleges. They are packed with people investing in themselves. Many are fresh out of the military, like my grand niece. Nursing, automotive tech, computer science, agriculture; the opportunities go on and on. Life long education as well; I just attended an Astronomy lecture at Foorhill College.

Mostly false. MA easily rivals CA even though it is one of the worst states to live in just like CA.

Which state graduates the most doctors?


In 2021, the number of people who graduated from medical schools across the United States amounted to 28,337 graduates. During that year, the State of New York recorded the highest number of medical school graduates with 1.9 thousand, followed by Texas and California.Jun 8, 2022

https://www.bestmastersprograms.org/most-nobel-prize-winners/

https://milkeninstitute.org/article...-technology-and-science-says-milken-institute

https://www.businessinsider.com/california-worst-quality-of-life-2018-3

 

[mbres2000]

We have expensive fuel you have expensive healthcare. We have tax break on long commutes. And less car centric citys with better public transport...

2. Dryers are not used because they wear out clothes unnecessarily, I use my dryer for bedding and towels only.
3. Stop looking at advertisements

Yes, public transportation is great, but the narrow crowded roads not so much. My English friends who live north of London say free medical care is not completely free. And unless you're deathly ill, it takes a long time to see a doctor, who was probably trained in a third world country. Surely you jest about clothes dryers wearing out clothes. Has there been a scientific study by UK bureaucrats? Sounds more like something an EU committee would research, and then publish guidelines for doing laundry.

 

[mbres2000]

Who would want to live in a place with walkable cities full of authentic old structures still in daily use as shops and apartments, good public transit, convenient and comfortable intercity rail service, really cheap airlines for longer trips, lots of vacation for all workers as well as healthcare provision for all as a right, not a privilege?
There is much to recommend our country and there is also much to admire about Europe.
Neither model is bad, only different. Our country will never become Europe, nor will Europe ever become the US.
I for one grow weary of a landscape filled with housing developments, strip malls, gas stations, fast food outlets and car repair shops and dealers as well as the need to drive everywhere you might want or need to go.

Sounds like you're living in the perfect place. Good for you.

 

[brianl703]

No thanks. I've served with some extremely undisciplined folks who I wouldn't trust to operate a tape dispenser or a mop, much less a rifle.

Wonder if they were given a choice of "military or jail".

 

[Pew]

Wonder if they were given a choice of "military or jail".

I nor anybody I served with has known to serve with somebody else who was given that choice - although I heard a lot were given that choice during the Vietnam War. I guess if you need bodies to fight a war.....

 

[IndyIan]

Mostly false. MA easily rivals CA even though it is one of the worst states to live in just like CA.


https://www.bestmastersprograms.org/most-nobel-prize-winners/

https://milkeninstitute.org/article...-technology-and-science-says-milken-institute

https://www.businessinsider.com/california-worst-quality-of-life-2018-3

North Dakota has the best quality of life? in all of the US? I guess by some metrics sure. And if you don't have a big whack of money you can get a nice house with few neighbors for pretty cheap.
I think most people in California like it their better though? My sister already tried living in southern manitoba, and she likes California better, but everyone is different.

 

[Pew]

North Dakota has the best quality of life? in all of the US? I guess by some metrics sure. And if you don't have a big whack of money you can get a nice house with few neighbors for pretty cheap.
I think most people in California like it their better though? My sister already tried living in southern manitoba, and she likes California better, but everyone is different.

Depends on the metrics used. ND is #1 purely based off the cost-of-living adjustment. California has the highest life expentancy.

https://uh.edu/news-events/stories/...t-u.s.-states-would-provide-the-best-life.php

Massachusetts and Minnesota were the two states with the highest living standards in the U.S., according to the study. Neither state has the highest cost-of-living adjusted consumption (that’s North Dakota); this is a measure of what you can buy with your income. Nor do they have the highest life expectancy (that’s California and Hawaii) or even the most leisure time (Mississippi and West Virginia). But Massachusetts and Minnesota, the economists posit, have the best balance across components of a living standard metric, also known as a welfare measure.

 

[brianl703]

I nor anybody I served with has known to serve with somebody else who was given that choice - although I heard a lot were given that choice during the Vietnam War. I guess if you need bodies to fight a war.....

Guess it was more common years ago, my cousin who entered the Army in the late 80s served with some people who were given that choice. He didn't think much of them.

 

[billt460]

Stop with the political hit job. No one twists arms to take out loans. In fact, I am a proponent of teaching personal finance starting in grade school so people have an idea what they are getting into. That's another reason education is key. I worked 50+ hours per week and took 3 and 4 classes per week. I pressured my companies to pay for part or all of my tuition.
I am a fiscal conservative and teach family and friends how to prepare for the future. And I pay more taxes than most people make. It's a great problem to have.
Taking extreme cases and considering them the norm shows a lack of understanding.

And yet today we have more kids in debt from student loans than ever before. Why? Because college is being pushed on them like there is no tomorrow. While trade schools are all but begging for students. Who is pumping these kids heads full of this slop?

It's not a, "political hit job". It's a FACT. Just look around. The evidence is everywhere. And spare me the nonsense of how, "college costs more today". EVERYTHING costs more today. When it gets too expensive people stop buying. Be it $100K pickup trucks, or overpriced houses.

But kids just keep borrowing more to go. Where is the common sense? Where are their parents to stop them from putting themselves into these no win financial positions? Many are as dumb, or dumber than the kids they're raising. ALL of it is financial insanity. And a hell of a way to start out in life.

https://www.cnbc.com/select/student-debt-hits-another-record-high-what-you-need-to-know/

https://www.pgpf.org/blog/2021/10/s...enfold-over-the-last-couple-decades-heres-why

"At the end of 2021, roughly 3 million people — close to 7% of all student loan borrowers — were in default."

 

[JeffKeryk]

And yet today we have more kids in debt from student loans than ever before. Why? Because college is being pushed on them like there is no tomorrow. While trade schools are all but begging for students. Who is pumping these kids heads full of this slop?

It's not a, "political hit job". It's a FACT. Just look around. The evidence is everywhere. And spare me the nonsense of how, "college costs more today". EVERYTHING costs more today. When it gets too expensive people stop buying. Be it $100K pickup trucks, or overpriced houses.

But kids just keep borrowing more to go. Where is the common sense? Where are their parents to stop them from putting themselves into these no win financial positions? Many are as dumb, or dumber than the kids they're raising. ALL of it is financial insanity. And a hell of a way to start out in life.

https://www.cnbc.com/select/student-debt-hits-another-record-high-what-you-need-to-know/

https://www.pgpf.org/blog/2021/10/s...enfold-over-the-last-couple-decades-heres-why

"At the end of 2021, roughly 3 million people — close to 7% of all student loan borrowers — were in default."

Did I say I was in favor of debt? Quite the opposite.
Trade school programs at our local Community Colleges are impacted; they turn out qualified workers with a top notch, low cost education. For example, De Anza College where I attended offers 77 2 year Degrees in Accounting, Law Enforcement, Automotive Tech (just added EV stuff), Business Adminsitration and Management, Computer Technology (from hardware to programming and more), Machinist and CAD, Nursing and Medical Lab, Paralegal, Real Estate and so much more. These workers fuel Silicon Valley. De Anza is in the process of adding 4 year degrees in some of the various Nursing concentrations. All low cost programs.

You mentioned a political party even though we all agreed not to do so on this sight. And yes, it was a political hit job.

You and I are saying many of the same things, to a large degree. I have no idea what you are doing about it, but I help family and friends with financial planning and execution. It is amazing to see people, especially young people, take the reins and move forward in a responsible manner. Results count.

 

[fdcg27]

Sounds like you're living in the perfect place. Good for you.

No, I was just responding to the "EU sucks" crowd.
As I noted in my post, both the US and the EU have much to recommend them and neither will ever become the other.
For example, the walkable city with good public transit horse has long since fled the barn in our country.
The EU has its downsides too and I tried to highlight what Europe has done right while recognizing that we here have done much right as well.
I am very happy to be living in this country but that doesn't mean that we can't learn from the examples of others.

 

[Trav]

Did I say I was in favor of debt? Quite the opposite.
Trade school programs at our local Community Colleges are impacted; they turn out qualified workers with a top notch, low cost education. For example, De Anza College where I attended offers 77 2 year Degrees in Accounting, Law Enforcement, Automotive Tech (just added EV stuff), Business Adminsitration and Management, Computer Technology (from hardware to programming and more), Machinist and CAD, Nursing and Medical Lab, Paralegal, Real Estate and so much more. These workers fuel Silicon Valley. De Anza is in the process of adding 4 year degrees in some of the various Nursing concentrations. All low cost programs.

You mentioned a political party even though we all agreed not to do so on this sight. And yes, it was a political hit job.

You and I are saying many of the same things, to a large degree. I have no idea what you are doing about it, but I help family and friends with financial planning and execution. It is amazing to see people, especially young people, take the reins and move forward in a responsible manner. Results count.

So what is your point? Schools like that are available in every state. It certainly was not a political hit job, it was the stone cold truth.

 

[JeffKeryk]

So what is your point? Schools like that are available in every state. It certainly was not a political hit job, it was the stone cold truth.

The issue between @billt460 and me was the cost of college, people taking out extravagant loans, etc.
My point is, there are alternatives; personally I am very opposed to debt, as I believe he is from his posts.
There was also the issue of trade schools; my point is Community Colleges offer great opportunity in hundreds of trades and are well received. Some of the most sought after here are electrician, auto technology and health services, primarily nursing and administration.

Yep, these schools are available, you are making my point.

The political hit job was claiming a political party was responsible. On BITOG we agreed to not discuss politics, yet people seem to forget what they agreed to.

Read the posts if you want more detail.

 

[billt460]

........The political hit job was claiming a political party was responsible.......

Who is fighting to forgive student loan debt? Do you honestly think that is going to do anything to discourage these kids from taking out these ridiculously large loans?

 

[SC Maintenance]

I like parts of Europe, but its a large and diverse place. Much like our states, there are good and bad.

Like it or not, in the USA were all connected - same federal laws, same interstate system, same currency. We can disagree on things but once something passes as law, were all in on it, by hook or by crook.

In Europe they tried to do the currency, so all that happened is countries like Greece and Italy can borrow at the same interest rate as Germany. They never got any of the other stuff coordinated. This has propped them up for a number of years - benefitting Germany and bankrupting Italy and Greece. When globalism was expanding and capital was cheap, there system was designed to take advantage of it. So its not too surprising there starting to fall behind, given globalism is now in decline and capital is expensive. Add a war to the mix and here we are.

Our time to suck will come - sooner or later for one reason or the other. Nothing lasts forever.

 

[billt460]

Our time to suck will come - sooner or later for one reason or the other. Nothing lasts forever.

This country's social, financial, and political landscape is going to change drastically between now, and a year from next January. (If it takes that long). At present we're like an overloaded semi on cruise control..... With the driver sound asleep behind the wheel.

 

[KrisZ]

Always nice to see a nuanced and insightful POV on any subject.

Yeah, it’s hard to go into the heart of their issue without getting this thread locked or banned.

All I’m goin to say is they showed their true, tyrannical colors during rona. Same with Canada, especially during the trucker protests. I’m glad I left.

 

[Hillbilly Deluxe]

You miss my point. Education is key.

I've heard and seen people like you exclaim the merits of "education" for 30+ years.

Exactly what do you / they mean when you speak of "education"? I'm pretty sure I know what y'all mean.... a minimum of a 4-year degree, preferably from some institution you've heard of.

Well that is EXACTLY what has gone wrong in the US the last 30 years - people going and paying blindly for some sort of degree because a few people were screaming that they needed an education.

Colleges and Universities have been running on blank checks for 30 years. They've had free reign on anything they want to do and it shows. Multi-billion dollars of new buildings across campuses, colleges themselves "investing" in luxurious apartment complexes that students lease, social engineering/justice indoctrination classes made mandatory, no oversight on teaching, courses, course material or subject.

Here we are.

 

[Hillbilly Deluxe]

On BITOG we agreed to not discuss politics, yet people seem to forget what they agreed to.

This is always the issue. People like you like to poke and bait folks that charge back at you with the real answers. Your side seems to always come out unscathed in these incidents on these forums that won't allow real conversations to take place.

 

[alarmguy]

I don't believe in being free and free will to vote? Did you see any of the post from other members who want to restrict voting rights with literacy test like we're in the 1900s again and yet you want to tell me my views are backwards? ...

Here you go again with the heresy agenda, void of reality and facts. I cant have a discussion with you. Look at your own posts, just because you can dig up someone who wants to do something (in this case literacy tests)is pathetically void of reality because it will never happen.

But groups who indoctrinate younger people (because they are smarter than the younger people) get them to believe their cause is about voting rights and literacy testing. Yet no proof what so ever anything like this ever, ever would possibly, remotely take place means nothing, because people get convinced that its an actual threat. This is how you control any group of people, using fear that doesnt exist but convince them that it does. Its so laughable I'll stay out of this. You really want to rule the world and people buy this stuff and why I know I lived in the greatest time in this nation and chances are I wont be here when thinking like this takes it down. Wow, will many young people learn a lesson at that time. We already know we are moving from individual freedom to "group collective" governed by mis-information from an indoctrinated public. One just need read up on the last hundred or so years on rise of dictators in the history books to see how the population is moved into committing some of the most horrific atrocities thinking it's ok.
Yet the USA was still there to take them down and free the people.

Bottom line-
You have to show your divers license OR state ID to buy cigarettes, drink or use it for any legal matter in the USA. It's perfectly sane to expect the same when voting, to keep the system fair to everyone.