Europe has fallen behind America and the gap is growing

[JeffKeryk]

Yes I’ve heard that story many times and I applaud your success. It started with you. The college facilitated your success but it took initiative on your part.

Todays colleges are eager to take $100k from a youngster and give them a degree that doesn’t get them far. A degree in Greek Philosophy might get someone a job in a gyro sandwich shop. Then that person gripes that it’s not fair.

Look at the Asian students in particular, getting degrees in subjects like medicine, science, engineering and so on.

I an not sure my education started with me, except maybe out of desperation. It started with Police who arrested me and judges who were gonna put me away. They were right and I was wrong. And homelessness ain't no fun, so there's that. What happened? I found out that if you play by the rules life gets really easy.

You have a point about the Asian students and workers in general, at least from what I've seen. They out work others, who seem to feel entitled. I just don't get it. In my case, a desk job in an air conditioned office was such a change. All the chicks running around wasn't bad either. I ran with it.

You mention someone with a Philosophy Degree; that they complain. I see complainers all over the place, including here. If you don't have enough money, I suggest stop blaiming others and go do something about it. I did. Homelessness makes you tough; makes you willing. Schools give you the tools and I support that. As you say, it is up to each of us to pick up those tools and use them.

 

[fdcg27]

Most of us here are probably in the upper end of the income scale, at least those not retired.
We enjoy predictable hours, probably flex, as well as a decent income and plenty of PTO along with employer paid healthcare, as well as some sort of retirement plan.
None of this is true for those lower on the scale. They are often on call for work with no pay for that, enjoy no PTO, have no benefits either retirement or healthcare.
This is probably not good socially or economically. When the least among us do better society as a whole does better. Nobody ever said with any conviction that the employment and compensation practices of venture capital MBAs should dictate the employment standards of our country.

 

[Dave Hess]

I an not sure my education started with me, except maybe out of desperation. It started with Police who arrested me and judges who were gonna put me away. They were right and I was wrong. And homelessness ain't no fun, so there's that. What happened? I found out that if you play by the rules life gets really easy.

You have a point about the Asian students and workers in general, at least from what I've seen. They out work others, who seem to feel entitled. I just don't get it. In my case, a desk job in an air conditioned office was such a change. All the chicks running around wasn't bad either. I ran with it.

You mention someone with a Philosophy Degree; that they complain. I see complainers all over the place, including here. If you don't have enough money, I suggest stop blaiming others and go do something about it. I did. Homelessness makes you tough; makes you willing. Schools give you the tools and I support that. As you say, it is up to each of us to pick up those tools and use them.

I hate to ask this but you mentioned your past and drinking many times….

Why did you start drinking in the first place ?

 

[KrisZ]

EU sucks! Take your healthcare, nobody cares about it anyways. Those that have money will buy it from US anyways.
Soon you will tax yourselves out of existence and you will be happy about it.

 

[alarmguy]

Nitpicking data is just cheap and doesn't prove your point, honestly, if you want me to delve into the subject, you will see that you are not making a strong case - ''The U.S. has the lowest life expectancy at birth, the highest death rates for avoidable or treatable conditions, the highest maternal and infant mortality, and among the highest suicide rates. The U.S. has the highest rate of people with multiple chronic conditions and an obesity rate nearly twice the OECD average.''

U.S. Health Care from a Global Perspective, 2022: Accelerating Spending, Worsening Outcomes

This cross-national comparison of health care systems assesses U.S. health spending, outcomes, status, and service use relative to 12 other high-income countries.

www.commonwealthfund.org

You are also focusing on inputs (MRI wait time), you need to look at outcomes (see bold above) as that's ultimately what matters. For example the UK has a higher life expectancy at birth, so maybe you should flock there to have a baby, forget your teeth. Further, healthcare is only a portion of what is meant by quality of life, not sure why you jumped on that. I am talking big picture here.

Now, I have no agenda, so let me say I have personally received much better care in the US when I could afford a high priced PPO and self refer (and still ended up paying at least 25-30K for surgeries etc) and I have heard horror stories here in Sweden about healthcare, but, their outcomes vs the US paints a different picture to my own experience. My wife (a nurse in both countries) and I often ***** about the quality of care here. I am not saying one system is perfect, so let's not nitpick a few data point out of thousands.

Quality for me, it's less stress, higher contentment, less crime, more time off, and more time to enjoy the simple things like bickering on an oil forum. Truth is, if you haven't actually lived in the EU and experienced the subjective things, for at least a year, you can't get a sense of things. Numbers do not tell the tale. For me, it's way better here and I had it **** good in the US, better than most.


Saying the average overall quality of life for the average citizen is higher in the EU, is not bashing on the US, don't take it personally, I just believe that is what the data shows (open to data if you have something contradicting that on a broad scale). I also find it strange that whenever this subject comes up people, from all countries, but particularly the US, seem to take it personally (not saying you are)

Couple of links if you want :

https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/rankings/quality-of-life

Standard of Living by Country 2023 - Wisevoter

The world is home to a wide range of countries that differ greatly in terms of standard of living, as measured by the Human Development Index (HDI). The HDI looks at a nation’s wealth, health and education levels to determine its ranking. Depending on the country, its population could be...

wisevoter.com

Yeah, your response is media stories.
The most unreliable void of facts information source out there.

The quality of life is much better here in the United States and equal to and better then the top three countries listed in the chart I posted previously.
As far as the income, we are tied for first place. Come on you’re ready we will never convince each other otherwise so I’ll bow out of this to be with you.

How can I take a personal?
All you have to do is look at the factual income chart that I posted in my previous post.
So, instead of listening to media reports which sadly the public does, one needs to look up the factual data.

By the way, how many people in the United States look to go to the EU for surgery? LOL!
The wealthy EU residents come to the United States and that is fact.
Actually the rest of the world looks to come here too, with political repercussions from their home country but the USA health care system is a mess right?

 

[billt460]

You don't need July 4th as a federal holiday either, or any of the other 10 federal holidays.

The 4th celebrates a nation, not a specific group or race. Why can't we simply have, "History Month"? Why does it have to commemorate a specific race or gender?

 

[fdcg27]

EU sucks! Take your healthcare, nobody cares about it anyways. Those that have money will buy it from US anyways.
Soon you will tax yourselves out of existence and you will be happy about it.

Always nice to see a nuanced and insightful POV on any subject.

 

[JeffKeryk]

The Preamble to the Constitution:
We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

That means all of us.

 

[JeffKeryk]

The 4th celebrates a nation, not a specific group or race. Why can't we simply have, "History Month"? Why does it have to commemorate a specific race or gender?

If I don't want to celebrate something, I don't celebrate it.

 

[Pew]

The 4th celebrates a nation, not a specific group or race. Why can't we simply have, "History Month"? Why does it have to commemorate a specific race or gender?

Then don't celebrate it if it means nothing to you. That's the great thing about freedom. For the rest it's a history lesson.

 

[SC Maintenance]

You don't need July 4th as a federal holiday either, or any of the other 10 federal holidays.

I only get 8? What am I missing?

Anyway, in SC there is no requirement to give anyone or pay for any federal holiday. Most employers do as its customary and they need to compete with companies that do.

Private employers in South Carolina are not required to close on any of the listed holidays. Additionally, private employers are not required to allow employees to take either paid or unpaid time off on the holidays nor are they required to pay employees any premium wage rates to employees who work on the holidays.

.

 

[Pew]

I only get 8? What am I missing?

Anyway, in SC there is no requirement to give anyone or pay for any federal holiday. Most employers do as its customary and they need to compete with companies that do.

Private employers in South Carolina are not required to close on any of the listed holidays. Additionally, private employers are not required to allow employees to take either paid or unpaid time off on the holidays nor are they required to pay employees any premium wage rates to employees who work on the holidays.

.

You're getting jipped! Washington's Birthday is usually missed and Juneteenth started this year. I "only" get 5 for my current company but my schedule is so flexible that I don't mind it.

 

[SC Maintenance]

You're getting jipped! Washington's Birthday is usually missed and Juneteenth started this year. I "only" get 5 for my current company but my schedule is so flexible that I don't mind it.

Ha. I actually get 6 and 2 floaters to cover any holiday's your state might have - so everyone in the country all gets the same.

 

[CanAmAndMore]

Some have mentioned over and over that all this education is so important.
As a high school drop out, grade 9, I strongly disagree.
Many people do just fine without all the fancy college or university degrees.
We went out and got good paying jobs, an education in life and common sense.
Being so judgmental against those without a degree, or even a high school diploma, actually is showing your ignorance.
Not everyone wants to be a dentist, lawyer, accountant, or engineer.
As I type this, wrestling is on the tv in the background.
Those wrestlers probably make more in a year than your typical college graduate does, no degree required.

 

[PimTac]

Some have mentioned over and over that all this education is so important.
As a high school drop out, grade 9, I strongly disagree.
Many people do just fine without all the fancy college or university degrees.
We went out and got good paying jobs, an education in life and common sense.
Being so judgmental against those without a degree, or even a high school diploma, actually is showing your ignorance.
Not everyone wants to be a dentist, lawyer, accountant, or engineer.
As I type this, wrestling is on the tv in the background.
Those wrestlers probably make more in a year than your typical college graduate does, no degree required.

I graduated from high school during a time when college was not necessary. One could go right into factories or warehouses and earn a decent wage. Trade schools and apprenticeships were available. If you wanted to get ahead you could no matter what your financial ability was.

 

[clinebarger]

Some have mentioned over and over that all this education is so important.
As a high school drop out, grade 9, I strongly disagree.
Many people do just fine without all the fancy college or university degrees.
We went out and got good paying jobs, an education in life and common sense.
Being so judgmental against those without a degree, or even a high school diploma, actually is showing your ignorance.
Not everyone wants to be a dentist, lawyer, accountant, or engineer.
As I type this, wrestling is on the tv in the background.
Those wrestlers probably make more in a year than your typical college graduate does, no degree required.

I graduated HS, But that's it other than training & seminars. The last 2-3 years of HS was a waste of time for me.

 

[JeffKeryk]

Some have mentioned over and over that all this education is so important.
As a high school drop out, grade 9, I strongly disagree.
Many people do just fine without all the fancy college or university degrees.
We went out and got good paying jobs, an education in life and common sense.
Being so judgmental against those without a degree, or even a high school diploma, actually is showing your ignorance.
Not everyone wants to be a dentist, lawyer, accountant, or engineer.
As I type this, wrestling is on the tv in the background.
Those wrestlers probably make more in a year than your typical college graduate does, no degree required.

I never said college is for everyone. But if our country fails education you had better start speaking another language.
@PimTac mentioned the Asian work ethic. They will kick our behinds.
Please don't minimize the importance of quality education, starting with K12.

It takes all kinds; we all contribute to our Great Country. "We the people".
I do not doubt your capabilities. I apologize if my words sounded otherwise.

 

[Pew]

Some have mentioned over and over that all this education is so important.
As a high school drop out, grade 9, I strongly disagree.
Many people do just fine without all the fancy college or university degrees.
We went out and got good paying jobs, an education in life and common sense.
Being so judgmental against those without a degree, or even a high school diploma, actually is showing your ignorance.
Not everyone wants to be a dentist, lawyer, accountant, or engineer.
As I type this, wrestling is on the tv in the background.
Those wrestlers probably make more in a year than your typical college graduate does, no degree required.

You can absolutely do good in life without a HS or college degree. I'm the only one in my family without a college degree/going to college but I'm doing better than my siblings are. It's more so the folks that look down at those who decide to further their education, like as if their own choice not continuing education is something to validate themselves with.

 

[99Saturn]

People should be planning for, and saving towards their own retirement plan by age 25.
Only a fool relies on government.

IRAs can be opened as soon as someone has earned income.... just saying, get those 14 year olds an IRA no need to wait.

 

[billt460]

I never said college is for everyone. But if our country fails education you had better start speaking another language.

"Our country" doesn't educate anyone. Nor should they have to pay to do it.... Or "forgive" loans to people who borrow money from them to attend, then fail to pay it back.

Public schools are funded by the taxpayers. Private schools are funded by private citizens who pay tuition to go there. And if you attend the latter, you don't get the money back you already gave to support the first one.