Sense euro oils tend to run with higher zddp levels, you would think they are safe to run in older american v8s such as ford 302?
Euro syn in older US engines ok?
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As safe as you 70 something year old's drinking modern water!
Originally Posted by JohnnyJohnson
As safe as you 70 something year old's drinking modern water!
I just about guarantee that any 70 something that drinks modern water will have to get up in the middle of the night to pee.
As safe as you 70 something year old's drinking modern water!
I just about guarantee that any 70 something that drinks modern water will have to get up in the middle of the night to pee.
Don't count on high ZDDP in euro oils.
Originally Posted by ka9mnx
Don't count on high ZDDP in euro oils.
+1
Only ACEA A3/B4 oils typically have +1000ppm of ZDDP, others don't.
Don't count on high ZDDP in euro oils.
+1
Only ACEA A3/B4 oils typically have +1000ppm of ZDDP, others don't.
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That 302 would be perfectly happy on something like Valvoline VR1 10W-30.
No need for fancy expensive synthetics, in fact many older engines show higher iron wear on synthetics than dino.
No need for fancy expensive synthetics, in fact many older engines show higher iron wear on synthetics than dino.
Jackson_Slugger
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I would just run something like Mobil 1 HM 10W-30, ACEA A3 rated. Assuming you actually need higher ZDDP levels...
Correct me if I am wrong, the OP is actually trying to figure out a better answer then running modern spec oil in older vehicles? IMO something oil guys should be doing, instead of this race to the bottom and what can I get away with garbage strategy, but actually try and find answers for engines that ran on older oil formulations with more stout additives. One might suggest anyone without a di turbo should at least consider it or research it.
Originally Posted by Jackson_Slugger
I would just run something like Mobil 1 HM 10W-30, ACEA A3 rated. Assuming you actually need higher ZDDP levels...
I agree on that choice but M1 HM 10w-30 doesn't have higher ZDDP levels. It's limited by it's API SN rating. It has a nice HTHS though.
Unless your 302 has been modified, you are chasing your tail looking for a high ZDDP oil. Not needed in ANY stock flat tappet cam.
I would just run something like Mobil 1 HM 10W-30, ACEA A3 rated. Assuming you actually need higher ZDDP levels...
I agree on that choice but M1 HM 10w-30 doesn't have higher ZDDP levels. It's limited by it's API SN rating. It has a nice HTHS though.
Unless your 302 has been modified, you are chasing your tail looking for a high ZDDP oil. Not needed in ANY stock flat tappet cam.
Jackson_Slugger
$50 Site Donor 2022
Originally Posted by burla
Correct me if I am wrong, the OP is actually trying to figure out a better answer then running modern spec oil in older vehicles? IMO something oil guys should be doing, instead of this race to the bottom and what can I get away with garbage strategy, but actually try and find answers for engines that ran on older oil formulations with more stout additives. One might suggest anyone without a di turbo should at least consider it or research it.
What oils were available during the day his 302 was hatched? Were they better than virtually any oil you can buy today?
Correct me if I am wrong, the OP is actually trying to figure out a better answer then running modern spec oil in older vehicles? IMO something oil guys should be doing, instead of this race to the bottom and what can I get away with garbage strategy, but actually try and find answers for engines that ran on older oil formulations with more stout additives. One might suggest anyone without a di turbo should at least consider it or research it.
What oils were available during the day his 302 was hatched? Were they better than virtually any oil you can buy today?
This is a 302 from a 1988 F-150. I like to experiment with it so I got some euro 5w40 amazing basics just to see how it performs. Well I'm not sure what happened but the oil filter just have gotten stopped up after 2k. It was a purolator classic. It tapped extremely loud on Startup for 5 seconds then the oil pressure would bounce between high and low. One day in left it idling and it was overheating and in can hear scraping sounds from the engine. Assuming something was wrong with the filter I took it off and cut it open. Did not see any dirt or sludge. I I installed a short version of the fl1a that I had laying around, sense then nothing crazy though my oil guage does seem to bounce around alot. Im assuming the filter was defective or the oil didn't agree. I dunno.
Originally Posted by Jackson_Slugger
Originally Posted by burla
Correct me if I am wrong, the OP is actually trying to figure out a better answer then running modern spec oil in older vehicles? IMO something oil guys should be doing, instead of this race to the bottom and what can I get away with garbage strategy, but actually try and find answers for engines that ran on older oil formulations with more stout additives. One might suggest anyone without a di turbo should at least consider it or research it.
What oils were available during the day his 302 was hatched? Were they better than virtually any oil you can buy today?
All of those oils had higher aw/ep additives and usually were thicker visc. 2002 most oils were 1200ppm zddp, now you can beat 800 and get gf-5. How does sn+ which is made for di turbo help an old v8? How does low saps oils help an old v8? Absent CAT considerations those oils protected metal better, thus why they are having magor issues trying to get to a new spec because timing chain wear is simply horrible. When gf-6 drops, expect more issues then ever. Look at FCA, cam/lifter issues, bearing issues that make them use high viscosity oil then when released, FORD passing on new diesel specs, the list goes on and on and on, if trouble yourself to look. New oils are not better, they are made as a grand bargain to protect modern engines, they do nothing better for older engines.
Originally Posted by burla
Correct me if I am wrong, the OP is actually trying to figure out a better answer then running modern spec oil in older vehicles? IMO something oil guys should be doing, instead of this race to the bottom and what can I get away with garbage strategy, but actually try and find answers for engines that ran on older oil formulations with more stout additives. One might suggest anyone without a di turbo should at least consider it or research it.
What oils were available during the day his 302 was hatched? Were they better than virtually any oil you can buy today?
All of those oils had higher aw/ep additives and usually were thicker visc. 2002 most oils were 1200ppm zddp, now you can beat 800 and get gf-5. How does sn+ which is made for di turbo help an old v8? How does low saps oils help an old v8? Absent CAT considerations those oils protected metal better, thus why they are having magor issues trying to get to a new spec because timing chain wear is simply horrible. When gf-6 drops, expect more issues then ever. Look at FCA, cam/lifter issues, bearing issues that make them use high viscosity oil then when released, FORD passing on new diesel specs, the list goes on and on and on, if trouble yourself to look. New oils are not better, they are made as a grand bargain to protect modern engines, they do nothing better for older engines.
Jackson_Slugger
$50 Site Donor 2022
Originally Posted by burla
Originally Posted by Jackson_Slugger
Originally Posted by burla
Correct me if I am wrong, the OP is actually trying to figure out a better answer then running modern spec oil in older vehicles? IMO something oil guys should be doing, instead of this race to the bottom and what can I get away with garbage strategy, but actually try and find answers for engines that ran on older oil formulations with more stout additives. One might suggest anyone without a di turbo should at least consider it or research it.
What oils were available during the day his 302 was hatched? Were they better than virtually any oil you can buy today?
All of those oils had higher aw/ep additives and usually were thicker visc. 2002 most oils were 1200ppm zddp, now you can beat 800 and get gf-5. How does sn+ which is made for di turbo help an old v8? How does low saps oils help an old v8? Absent CAT considerations those oils protected metal better, thus why they are having magor issues trying to get to a new spec because timing chain wear is simply horrible. When gf-6 drops, expect more issues then ever. Look at FCA, cam/lifter issues, bearing issues that make them use high viscosity oil then when released, FORD passing on new diesel specs, the list goes on and on and on, if trouble yourself to look. New oils are not better, they are made as a grand bargain to protect modern engines, they do nothing better for older engines.
Nearing 1,100 posts here and you really believe the Group I slugging swill of yesteryear is better than today's oil because it's designed for turbos? LOL Not enough zinc? The 5.0 never really required 1200 PPM and reason they put that much is was the base oil was rather poor...
Originally Posted by Jackson_Slugger
Originally Posted by burla
Correct me if I am wrong, the OP is actually trying to figure out a better answer then running modern spec oil in older vehicles? IMO something oil guys should be doing, instead of this race to the bottom and what can I get away with garbage strategy, but actually try and find answers for engines that ran on older oil formulations with more stout additives. One might suggest anyone without a di turbo should at least consider it or research it.
What oils were available during the day his 302 was hatched? Were they better than virtually any oil you can buy today?
All of those oils had higher aw/ep additives and usually were thicker visc. 2002 most oils were 1200ppm zddp, now you can beat 800 and get gf-5. How does sn+ which is made for di turbo help an old v8? How does low saps oils help an old v8? Absent CAT considerations those oils protected metal better, thus why they are having magor issues trying to get to a new spec because timing chain wear is simply horrible. When gf-6 drops, expect more issues then ever. Look at FCA, cam/lifter issues, bearing issues that make them use high viscosity oil then when released, FORD passing on new diesel specs, the list goes on and on and on, if trouble yourself to look. New oils are not better, they are made as a grand bargain to protect modern engines, they do nothing better for older engines.
Nearing 1,100 posts here and you really believe the Group I slugging swill of yesteryear is better than today's oil because it's designed for turbos? LOL Not enough zinc? The 5.0 never really required 1200 PPM and reason they put that much is was the base oil was rather poor...
Originally Posted by burla
Correct me if I am wrong, the OP is actually trying to figure out a better answer then running modern spec oil in older vehicles? IMO something oil guys should be doing, instead of this race to the bottom and what can I get away with garbage strategy, but actually try and find answers for engines that ran on older oil formulations with more stout additives. One might suggest anyone without a di turbo should at least consider it or research it.
It's not a race to the bottom, just pointing out a cheaper option that would work just as well.
Correct me if I am wrong, the OP is actually trying to figure out a better answer then running modern spec oil in older vehicles? IMO something oil guys should be doing, instead of this race to the bottom and what can I get away with garbage strategy, but actually try and find answers for engines that ran on older oil formulations with more stout additives. One might suggest anyone without a di turbo should at least consider it or research it.
It's not a race to the bottom, just pointing out a cheaper option that would work just as well.
Didn't the 302 have roller lifters by 1988?
Car 302's had the rollers by 87. Truck 302 didn't have them sometime in the 90s. I confirmed this on my 88 f150 with a cast iron gear on the distributor.
I've used lots of euro synthetic 5w40 and 0w40 in my flat tappet 76 Olds v8 over the years and I only switched to 10w30 synthetic because it's quieter with it. Other engines may be quieter with thicker oil. Mine doesn't notice the difference between synthetic and conventional either but I feel better running synthetic. So far I've gotten over 100k miles in the last 12 years out of my junkyard engine that had nothing but a timing chain, and some gaskets before it went into my car. I'm hoping it will last forever.
Originally Posted by RamFan
Originally Posted by FordCapriDriver
in fact many older engines show higher iron wear on synthetics than dino.
Say what now?
My theory behind that is that the synthetic is maybe cleaning out more buildup which may have caught debris from wear particles. That's the only thing that makes sense in my mind.
Personally I'd use either a euro 0w40 like Mobil 1 (if you're in a colder climate) or possibly something like a 10w30 high mileage a3/b4 rated. Is that the best choice, I don't know. But it's what I would go with out of what is readily available to me.
Originally Posted by FordCapriDriver
in fact many older engines show higher iron wear on synthetics than dino.
Say what now?
My theory behind that is that the synthetic is maybe cleaning out more buildup which may have caught debris from wear particles. That's the only thing that makes sense in my mind.
Personally I'd use either a euro 0w40 like Mobil 1 (if you're in a colder climate) or possibly something like a 10w30 high mileage a3/b4 rated. Is that the best choice, I don't know. But it's what I would go with out of what is readily available to me.
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