Ethics of Eating Meat

[PandaBear]

Originally Posted By: edhackett
Sacred cows make the best hamburger. Real and figurative.

Ed


Nope, good chef makes the best hamburger.

 

[Slick17601]

I like meat, it's my choice.

 

[uc50ic4more]

I have no problem with eating meat; although I have immeasurable disdain for industrialized farming and avoid its filth however and whenever I can.

I enjoy hunting (deer), and as soon as our municipal Big Brother removes a ban on keeping chickens within the city limits, my family intends to keep a few.

Originally Posted By: tig1
This ain't India.


Where is it?

 

[Cristobal]

My buddy in New Jersey will not eat beef from the store. He hunts whitetails whenever possible and has a freezer full of venison. He is a physician and thinks that prion disease (like mad cow) in domestic beef is a significant risk. He knows there is some prion disease in wild ungulates but thinks it is not dangerous so far, but he is concerned that it may eventually be; some such diseases are in present elk herds in the Rockies of Colorado.

 

[Cristobal]

Human evolution and eating habits produced some interesting body plans.

We are the Modern Homo Sapiens, and are omnivorous. There are not many things we cannot eat. Some things though need preparation to be usable; potatos must be cooked, and manioc (tapioca) must be processed to get rid of the cyanide in it. Some animal food must be processed by a trained person, like fugu. Only a few poisonous foods cannot be rendered harmless to us (e.g. certain mushrooms).

The Neanderthals, a side branch of Homo who left SOME heritage in our DNA, were for the most part totally carnivorous.

Paranthropus Boisei, a close relative of Homo, had the biggest molar teeth of any primate, far bigger than those of chimps. P. Boisei ate for the most part vegetation and reposed in comfort under circumstances where our ancestors were stalked by starvation. He could get by on foods more suitable to cows.

But types like us won out in the end, as we could eat most things out there. So famine was less likely to hit us.

 

[tom slick]

I'm not opposed to eating anything, not because I'm ignorant of farming practices, but because I'm educated in them. I find no reason not to eat horses, cats, dogs, and any other fuzzy cute friendly animals. My friends and I raised show livestock when in school and they became almost pets because you worked with them everyday for months but you also helped load them in the slaughter truck when you were done.

 

[Liquid_Turbo]

Originally Posted By: tom slick
I'm not opposed to eating anything, not because I'm ignorant of farming practices, but because I'm educated in them. I find no reason not to eat horses, cats, dogs, and any other fuzzy cute friendly animals. My friends and I raised show livestock when in school and they became almost pets because you worked with them everyday for months but you also helped load them in the slaughter truck when you were done.


At least you are being consistent! So you have absolutely zero issues with other cultures eating farming and eating dog?

I'm still slightly uncomfortable with the idea but I guess I can find no flaw to the argument.

As for those who state that Dogs are 'higher' animals, that's not true. A pig is perfectly capable of performing all the tricks that a dog can learn.

Example.

 

[Liquid_Turbo]

Originally Posted By: Tempest
Originally Posted By: ddrumman2004
The way I see it....a long time ago, man hunted food to survive and they found that meat taste better than a tree leaf, especially when cooked.


That's it. Humans have K-9 teeth. We are supposed to eat meat.

Is a tiger evil or unethical for killing it's prey?

The tiger is using the means at it's disposal for survival...as are we. We just do it differently.


Humans have canine teeth? I don't think so.

You cannot compare this:

With this:
(Carnivorous Hyena)

 

[Shannow]

Could also look at others.

What did our ancient ancestors do before flaxssed oil and brewer's yeast were available ?

Do cows gain any benefit from the snails/slugs, etc. that bring essential elements into their diet ?

 

[Silk]

By the look of the jaw bone and molars,he was chewing some pretty tough stuff.Probably chewed a cud while relaxing in the cave on evenings.

 

[Shannow]

Originally Posted By: Volvo_ST1
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
I think certain animals like fish, poultry, cattle and pigs are lower on the food chain. Most of those animals are prey. Animals like dogs and cats are more intelligent and are predators. So I see it as being the level on the food chain and dogs and cats and other intelligent animals or predators are a different matter.


If you eat animals based on their perceived low intelligence, then why do you list pigs? Pigs are on par with dogs in terms of intelligence.


Are dumb big dogs OK then ?

especially those that seem to have grown agricultural traits of easy handling, large litters, and high growth rates ?

http://www.aapn.org/stbernard.html

 

[tonycarguy]

Originally Posted By: mechanicx
I think certain animals like fish, poultry, cattle and pigs are lower on the food chain. Most of those animals are prey. Animals like dogs and cats are more intelligent and are predators. So I see it as being the level on the food chain and dogs and cats and other intelligent animals or predators are a different matter.


But many seafood that humans eat are predatory: shark, tuna, swordfish, chilean seabass, halibut & octopus. Some, like octopus, are very intelligent. Sharks and tuna are at top of the aquatic food chain, yet tuna is one of the most eaten fish.

I think it has more to do with human pscyhology than a species' ranking on the food chain. Humans interact socially with dogs, cats & horses but don't with sharks and tuna, so that's why people don't accept dogs as lunch but are ok with tuna.

 

[tonycarguy]

I personally wouldn't eat dogs and cats, but I respect other cultures' eating of them. Just as other cultures probably find it disgusting that we eat certain animals that they revere.

My only rule is that I won't eat threatened/endangered species like bluefin tuna.

 

[QuadDriver]

Originally Posted By: Liquid_Turbo
This is not a thread about vegetarianism.

It just got me thinking after a discussion with a few friends.

What makes it suitable to factory farm cows and pigs and slaughter them on such massive scale? Is the same things suitable to say, Dogs or Cats?

What gives us the right to enjoy our bacon, but to frown on other cultures consuming dogs? Aren't we being hypocrites?
Keep in mind, in India, the cow is revered at a sacred animal, and they would absolutely be disgusted at how we eat them, the same way we (North Americans) view dog eating.

Would like to hear your thoughts on your matter.


It must have a cloven hoof and chew the cud to be considered meat.

oh wait thats kosher law, which makes this religious and therefore throw away the thread ;-)

anyways, aint supposed to eat pig, dog, cat, rat, snake etc.

and the fish must live in cold water and have scales. ooops, more kosher law...

 

[Spazdog]

Originally Posted By: Liquid_Turbo


Humans have canine teeth? I don't think so.

Not included? Scavengers.

There is a school of thought that we descend from scavengers.

Big brains require protein. Our predecessors were able to develop the big brains we have by coming down from the trees and scavenging predator kills and consuming lots of protein.

It's as simple as this, our species would not have developed a large protein hungry brain on nuts and berries. We'd still be in the trees cowering from and/or flinging poo at predators without the development that protein provided.

So I reject the above chart as vegan nonsense.

 

[Volvo_ST1]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: Volvo_ST1
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
I think certain animals like fish, poultry, cattle and pigs are lower on the food chain. Most of those animals are prey. Animals like dogs and cats are more intelligent and are predators. So I see it as being the level on the food chain and dogs and cats and other intelligent animals or predators are a different matter.


If you eat animals based on their perceived low intelligence, then why do you list pigs? Pigs are on par with dogs in terms of intelligence.


Are dumb big dogs OK then ?

especially those that seem to have grown agricultural traits of easy handling, large litters, and high growth rates ?

http://www.aapn.org/stbernard.html



You should ask mechanix that question. He is the one who chooses his food by its perceived level of intelligence. I don't do that.

 

[mechanicx]

This debate is just getting stupid. Dogs are intelligent predators and high on the food chain. Herbivores like cattle are not. I guess some people think everything is gray and indeterminate. I'm not even sure what your point is, you would eat any and every animal, no animals, or is just OK for other cultures to eat any animal but you wouldn't?

 

[dnewton3]

I don't know about the rest of you, but I don't eat to feed my ethics. I eat food to sustain my existience, at a minimum, and for pleasure, as a maximum.

As long as my food source didn't long suffer greatly at the hands of some indignant, cruel master, I don't care. Hunting in the woods (as I do) simply cuts out the middle-man of hunting at the local food mart. I've ate a great variety of animals in my days, and some were delicious, while others were not. I don't question where they fell in the food-chain-of-command; don't care, either.

My affinity for medium-rare animal flesh is probably just as lost on some people as why to I can't fathom the commitment of others to 3k mile synthetic OCI's ...

 

[PandaBear]

Originally Posted By: Spazdog
Big brains require protein. Our predecessors were able to develop the big brains we have by coming down from the trees and scavenging predator kills and consuming lots of protein.

It's as simple as this, our species would not have developed a large protein hungry brain on nuts and berries. We'd still be in the trees cowering from and/or flinging poo at predators without the development that protein provided.


Careful there. Those who have a tendency to reject eating horses but accept eating tuna may regard your opinion as religion (or anti religion).

I'd rather keep the rule simple: if it taste good and is gathered in the least suffering way possible, and it doesn't get you sick or killed, it is ok to eat.

 

[Cutehumor]

yeah, when we run out of animals to eat for meat, people will eat other people. It's the perfect solution for our world population growing out of control.