Ester based motorcycle oil

[Pablo]

It also does NOT show a whole bunch of functional additives like corrosion inhibitors, anti foams, really anything organic, amines, etc

 

[kschachn]

@Pablo please explain it to me. I am like a kid who's lost in school, and the teacher keeps trying to give hints. Are you saying that the oil analysis doesn’t show the base oils used (e.g., ester)?

No. That would take FTIR or perhaps gas chromatography. You're looking at organic compounds and a spectrographic analysis shows mostly metallic elements, not compounds. It does not test for carbon or hydrogen, and even if it did it doesn't show compounds.

Lots of imagination sometimes on what a VOA/UOA shows and does not show and then the equally imaginative predictions made on past or future performance.

Do you even know what an ester is and what they do (or don't do) in a formulated motor oil? Or are you just hitched onto them because of what you read on some Internet site? As in: Ester Good! Group III Bad!

 

[kschachn]

It also does NOT show a whole bunch of functional additives like corrosion inhibitors, anti foams, really anything organic, amines, etc

Some of which are uniquely important in motorcycle oils.

 

[bioilcurious]

@kschachn what oil do I buy?
@Pablo do I buy AMSOIL and just never think about oil again?

 

[Pablo]

@kschachn what oil do I buy?
@Pablo do I buy AMSOIL and just never think about oil again?

Once hooked you will stay up late thinking about oil. Brand selection won’t stop that

 

[bioilcurious]

Once hooked you will stay up late thinking about oil. Brand selection won’t stop that

You're right.

 

[Pablo]

You're right.

Hahhahahaha

 

[BusyLittleShop]

I've employed 10W30 MC Amsoil and compare it to 5W30 Auto Mobil 1 in my Honda RC45 and recorded virtually the same wear rates...

 

[TrialKid]

I've employed 10W30 MC Amsoil and compare it to 5W30 Auto Mobil 1 in my Honda RC45 and recorded virtually the same wear rates...

View attachment 270371

This MC is that one ?

 

[bioilcurious]

Question for the oil experts: If my manual specifies a 10W-30 and wants it run for 8,000 miles, but after 3,300 miles it sheared down to a 20 grade, am I still using a 10W-30?

 

[kschachn]

Question for the oil experts: If my manual specifies a 10W-30 and wants it run for 8,000 miles, but after 3,300 miles it sheared down to a 20 grade, am I still using a 10W-30?

Has it done that? Which oil is this?

 

[bioilcurious]

Has it done that? Which oil is this?

V

Thread '2012 CBR 1000RR GN4 10w-30'

Mar 23, 2017

Here are a set of UOA's from every oil change since the bike was new. Every fill was Honda GN4 10w-30. The oil was sampled for the sake of my own curiosity. None of them are terribly exciting, but maybe worth sharing.

• V1
• Replies: 33
• Forum: Used Oil Analysis - Motorcycle and PowerSports

This guy was using 10w30 GN4, the recommended oil. And there was not 1 UOA in the 30 grade.
Does it matter in the end? I am not sure, obviously the Honda engineers know what their oil is doing...I hope!

 

[kschachn]

And here we go again with using a Blackstone analysis to claim an oil has had the VM sheared.

 

[bioilcurious]

And here we go again with using a Blackstone analysis to claim an oil has had the VM sheared.

@kschachn I am not an oil expert. explain it to me, why is this Blackstone incorrect?

 

[kschachn]

@kschachn I am not an oil expert. explain it to me, why is this Blackstone incorrect?

Blackstone is utterly incapable of determining whether a viscosity deviation is due to fuel dilution or mechanical shear of the VM. They have been shown to be not only “off” in their fuel estimations but wildly wrong.

Plus we have seen significant discrepancies in their ability to even measure viscosity.

 

[bioilcurious]

Alright, here is a 10,000-foot view of how I got here. The owner’s manual recommends a 10W-30 Honda GN4 oil, which costs about $8 a quart. Alright, I’ll use that. But when shopping, I noticed Honda also sells an HP4S oil for $13 a quart, and in their own product literature, they talk about how superior it is to their GN4 oil. Alright, fine, I’ll use that. But then I also saw a Honda HP4RU oil that claims to be the best oil ever created, priced at $23 a quart. Alright, that’s a little expensive, but I’ll use that. However, if the GN4 oil was so great, why did they make the HP4S? And if the HP4S is so great, why did they make the HP4RU? Is the HP4RU filling a gap that the HP4S can’t provide? As a consumer, I don’t know. So, I started looking at Used Oil Analysis (UOA) reports, but now I see those don’t tell the full story. So, what does one do? Someone riding a Goldwing like a grandma is not the same as me redlining my cbr going 160 mph on the racetrack. I want an oil that was made to do the latter.

 

[Pablo]

Alright, here is a 10,000-foot view of how I got here. The owner’s manual recommends a 10W-30 Honda GN4 oil, which costs about $8 a quart. Alright, I’ll use that. But when shopping, I noticed Honda also sells an HP4S oil for $13 a quart, and in their own product literature, they talk about how superior it is to their GN4 oil. Alright, fine, I’ll use that. But then I also saw a Honda HP4RU oil that claims to be the best oil ever created, priced at $23 a quart. Alright, that’s a little expensive, but I’ll use that. However, if the GN4 oil was so great, why did they make the HP4S? And if the HP4S is so great, why did they make the HP4RU? Is the HP4RU filling a gap that the HP4S can’t provide? As a consumer, I don’t know. So, I started looking at Used Oil Analysis (UOA) reports, but now I see those don’t tell the full story. So, what does one do? Someone riding a Goldwing like a grandma is not the same as me redlining my cbr going 160 mph on the racetrack. I want an oil that was made to do the latter.

The only difference really to your engine? How long you can leave the chosen oil in the engine.

 

[bioilcurious]

The only difference really to your engine? How long you can leave the chosen oil in the engine.

How does one go about determining the length I can keep it in my motor? The Honda manual calls for GN4 and says 8,000 miles or 1 year. Am I to believe this is true? They also say this detail: "Engine oil consumption varies, and oil quality deteriorates according to riding conditions and time elapsed. Check the engine oil level regularly, and add the recommended engine oil if necessary. Dirty oil or old oil should be changed as soon as possible." How does one know what dirty oil is?

 

[Pablo]

How does one go about determining the length I can keep it in my motor? The Honda manual calls for GN4 and says 8,000 miles or 1 year. Am I to believe this is true? They also say this detail: "Engine oil consumption varies, and oil quality deteriorates according to riding conditions and time elapsed. Check the engine oil level regularly, and add the recommended engine oil if necessary. Dirty oil or old oil should be changed as soon as possible." How does one know what dirty oil is?

Well to some extent, a decent lab, over time can tell you how the oil is holding up, and again over time can alert to you to GROSS engine problems. But don't read a UOA (or VOA) as an oil comparison tool, rookie, amateur mistake - like saying "11 ppm v 9 ppm iron, 9 ppm wins". Silly bonehead thinking.

 

[bioilcurious]

Well to some extent, a decent lab, over time can tell you how the oil is holding up, and again over time can alert to you to GROSS engine problems. But don't read a UOA (or VOA) as an oil comparison tool, rookie, amateur mistake - like saying "11 ppm v 9 ppm iron, 9 ppm wins". Silly bonehead thinking.

Okay, say I buy the Amsoil kit for 40 bucks. The current oil I have in there is the HP4RU and it has about 3500miles on it. Is it worth doing a UOA on it? Or do I need to multiple?