Dumbing up of Automobiles

[440Magnum]

Since this thread has started to revolve around climate control, I would have to point out that my favorite automatic climate control system I've ever used was also the very first one I ever saw- in my wife's old 1993 Chrysler LH car. The algorithms they used to compensate for solar loading (via a sun sensor on the dash) to skew the actual air temperature (sensed by a thermistor out of direct light) and move air flow between floor, dash, and defrost worked much better than most of the ones I've had since, including other Chrysler systems. On that old car, when the sun came out from behind a cloud the fan would speed up a tick or the air would bias more toward the dash vents so that my skin wouldn't feel so much hotter. Almost all the time I could punch the "auto" button, set the temp, and that system would do the right thing without me messing with it.

Many of the newer ones do OK in winter, but in the summer they just won't run the fan fast enough to offset the sun shining on me, or won't switch out of bi-level to move more air across passengers' arms and faces. And the old LH system had BUTTONS and KNOBS. One button for full auto and a knob for temp, and then adjusting any other function (ie. fan speed, air directed to dash, floor, or defroster) would take that ONE function out of auto mode but leave everything else automated. So if you were comfy but your feet needed more air, you could just push the bi-level button and the fan speed and temp would hold the same, but the air flow wouldn't be re-directed based on temperature or sunlight anymore. I loved that system. Loved the whole vehicle, actually, but at 250k miles we'd gotten everything out of it that really made sense.

 

[440Magnum]

Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
I don't think most of the people here preferring simple controls in automobiles hate " new technology" it is more about whether or not it is appropriate in an automobile where complications and distractions can end up killing someone.

Do you get that?

I personally love to use new tech where it is reasonable and logical.


That's ABSOLUTELY my opinion! I wouldn't go back to carburetors or pure mechanical fuel injection. I wouldn't go back to 3-speed full hydraulic automatic transmissions. I wouldn't get rid of automatic climate control, for that matter. But touch-screens are not APPROPRIATE for "while-driving" controls, even if they're not turn-signals or gear shifts. People DO change radio stations, and they DO change temp settings while driving- so those functions should be tactile. You shouldn't have to navigate menus. That's all I am saying.

 

[TallPaul]

I also don't like the digital odometer. Give me everything in analog readout. I like to be able to see the numbers when it is not running, like my 2001 Ranger (bonus separate trip meter from the odomoter):

Along with that I'll take manual transmission, manual locks, manual windows. I do appreciate power steering, power brakes and air conditioning though. Some tech is good, other tech is not appropriate.

 

[01rangerxl]

Originally Posted By: Hokiefyd
The problem with DRLs and automatic headlamps is becoming dangerously pervasive. Now that nearly every vehicle has dashboards that are always lit, there is rarely a visual prompt for the inattentive driver to turn on the headlamps. And "inattentive" is the key. People see two dim orbs of light in front of them from their DRLs and I guess that registers with them that their headlamps are on. Never mind that they can't see anything on the road. A lady pulled out in front of me last night in a black Maxima. No lights, no DRLs even. Completely invisible except for the shiny paint in street lights. I pray that these people don't get killed every time I see them.

We pull up at a traffic signal. She's behind somebody, and the back of that car is completely dark. She has no idea her lights are out. I roll up and roll down my window and honk. She's looking down at her phone, texting somebody. I suggest that she turn on her headlamps. "Oh, he he, I like totally forgot."

I really try to limit my night driving lately. Every time I'm out at night, I can count multiple vehicles without running lights. Many of these cars have automatic lamps, but I think folks turn them off.


I've been noticing this too. A LOT more people are driving with no lights or inadequate (DRL) lights at night. I see it regularly now, and 9 times out of 10, it's a newer car where the dash is lit up like a Christmas tree at all times.

What's really bad is when they have NO taillights, it's pitch black out, but the driver seems to think everything is peachy because their DRLs are putting out barely enough light to see the road in front of them.

 

[cptbarkey]

in the case of bmw, its pretty much fact that they have over engineered for (profit) service after the sale. i do not think that will be a continuing trend with everything, but more features always has a downside.

i just recently read in my subaru magazine that the new eyesight system highly recommends that you purchase your replacement windshield with OEM only, otherwise your eyesight system (auto adapting cruise control) may just slam your car into the one ahead of you.

enjoy technology.

 

[grampi]

As far as I'm concerned, they can get rid of all the useless gizmos and give me a practical vehicle with usable space inside that gets 100 MPG...or better yet, runs on renewable energy....

 

[SwampSurvivor]

A lot of people are driving around with just DRLs ... dim headlights and no tail lights.

I had a 2008 Taurus X rental car for a day. I could *NOT* figure out how to turn on the HVAC in it. I just knew how to turn it hotter (shut the window) or colder (open the window). What a PITA!

I like 3 knobs or 3 levers. Simple, to the point and does the job easily!

 

[Vikas]

I put the blame squarely on auto manufacturer for people driving without headlight after dusk. There are NO visual clues in late model car that you forgot to turn on the headlights. Your instrument cluster is nicely lit up regardless whether the headlights are on or off. I think they should do what Toyota did with the Camry. You have no choice to NOT turn on the light. It has a sensor and when it realizes that it is time to turn on the headlamp, as soon as you put the vehicle in the gear, the lights get turned on. There is no special "auto" setting on stalk.

I also hate not being able to get both trip and odo at the same time.

 

[supton]

Wife's Camry has a light that comes on when the headlights are on. It's not very obvious, but it is there.

But I recall owning a Saturn which had a light to tell me the DRL's were on. Which I joked was the light to tell me that the headlights were off.

 

[hypervish]

Both of my Lexus' show a light when the headlights are on. I usually don't use the AUTO feature on either one, I like to manually turn them on. Especially, since in NJ it's a state law to turn the headlights on, anytime the wipers are on.

I personally love the auto climate control, it work's perfect in both of my cars that have it. Just set the temp, and you're good.

 

[HTSS_TR]

The first high tech gadget that universally hated was the I-Drive in BMW 7-series some years ago. It was so complicated that the first time driver had to be shown how to start the engine and shift to gear.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Some mfgr's have it worked out quite well. My cars CC has an infra red sensor and has very accurate temp control. Plus it has a compressor button so you don't have to run it in the winter. Factor in the wifey can set her side up her way, gosh I don't think any husband would want to be without it!


The G and the Audi have the compressor button. Unfortunately, the Town Car did not. However, it's system worked so well I could forgive that.

 

[TallPaul]

Originally Posted By: ClutchDisc
I actually told the guy I bought my S-10 from, that I probably would not have bought the truck if it didn't have manual door locks, windows, and mirrors.
Hee hee. I told the lady I bought my Ranger from that if it didn't have crank windows and manual locks, I probably would not have bought it. That is how much I can't stand power windows and power locks (same for automatic transmissions). In fact I have a '92 Aerostar sitting in the driveway that has power windows or did. The drivers is no longer power and no longer goes down. Crank would still be working in all likelihood.

Bottom line, the more tech stuff and power stuff the more you better lease and dump it before things start to act up.

 

[sciphi]

Originally Posted By: hypervish
Both of my Lexus' show a light when the headlights are on. I usually don't use the AUTO feature on either one, I like to manually turn them on. Especially, since in NJ it's a state law to turn the headlights on, anytime the wipers are on.


The Cruze automatically turns the headlights on after 8 wipes of the wipers. Sort of nice. It has an icon for the DRL being active, and another icon on the opposite side of the gauge cluster to indicate the headlights are on.

I also like the digital speedometer displayed dead center in front of me on the cluster since the analog speedo is graded only every 5 mph in tiny little tick marks. It's hard to read at a glance since it's slightly offset to the right.

Not all technology is bad.

 

[Spazdog]

Originally Posted By: Miller88
A lot of people are driving around with just DRLs ... dim headlights and no tail lights.


That's been going on for years.

My former mother in law would do that in her Sunfire. She would drive right up against the steering wheel and could "see the headlights on". Instrument panel is completely black but she's pressed up against the windshield.
"Your headlights are off."
"No they aren't! I can see them on."
The darker it got the closer she would press her face to the windshield.

Now, cars come with backlighted instrument clusters anytime the ignition is on. Came across a Sonic running down the freeway at 10:30 at night, no taillights. Instrument cluster and DRLs on but nothing else. I guess the Sonic doesn't have automatic lights or the "Headlights suggested" prompt like the Grand Prix had.

First time I drove a Toyota Echo, I kept trying to turn the headlights on. Everytime I looked down at the the dash in front of me, it was dark because the instrument cluster is in the center of the dash. I would instinctively twist the end of the turn signal stalk. Same thing with the Saturn Ion. Ironically, never did that with a Jeep. CJ or M151.

 

[Jarlaxle]

Originally Posted By: itguy08
Originally Posted By: eljefino
The automatic AC bugs me more than most stuff. MPG and performance drag. Most other gadgets don't do that.


Negligible to no MPG penalty with a modern demand based AC system. No performance penalty as all within the last, say 20 years disengage at WOT or close to it.

I love the tech. In the SHO the lights come on when it's dark, the wipers come on when it rains, it will back off the speed if someone cuts me off with cruise on. I can press a button on the steering wheel and tell it Sirius 9 and it will tune to the station. I can tell it temp 70 and it will do it. I can have it dial the wife, friend, etc. I can tell it to program a destination in the nav while going down the road. That's even better than knobs as I have to memorize 1 button on the steering wheel.

I always get all the do-dads and have not had an issue with them yet on any of my cars.


I would pay a premium to NOT get any of that junk. Offhand, automatic HVAC is an instant deal-killer for me. I want airflow where I set it, not where the car thinks I want it! I am seriously considering retrofitting my Caddy with manual HVAC.

 

[mva]

I hate the push button selectors for typical HVAC controls. My favorite was the levers on my 1973 Pontiac that allowed my to blend as much or as little as I wanted down to my feet.

My 2000 BMW also has a dial that allows me to adjust how much defrost verses heat to the floor which works well but I don't drive it in the winter.

Also, in winter, a lever to adjust the amount of recirc is much better than a recirc button. The only vehicle I have owned that had this feature was a 1990 Pathfinder.

 

[TallPaul]

One more issue with modern cars here

 

[TallPaul]

Originally Posted By: Jarlaxle
I would pay a premium to NOT get any of that junk.


Yep, I am willing to pay extra for a simple layout, manual tranny, etc. If that's what it takes to keep manual transmission on the assembly line, fine.

 

[sciphi]

Chevy added MT's back into the Cruze lineup since the demand was there. Initially only the base LS and mpg queen Eco models had manuals. Now one can get a gussied-up 2LT model with a manual.