Defensive Rifle Zero Distance, Dont think that military zero is correct for you!

[Hohn]

There’s nothing I will need to shoot with an AR inside 200y that I will miss because of a 50y zero.

Every rifle I own is either zeroed at 50y or 100y. 50y for the rifles I will not dial on the windage or elevation. 100y for all the rifles that might have a “firing solution” entered.

 

[Elkins45]

I never said that. You’re the one applying the constraints. Saying the only viable range is hallway distance otherwise it’s off to prison with you. False dichotomy.

99.9% chance vs 0.1% chance is a dichotomy to be sure, but it doesn’t feel all that false to me. I’ve watched a bunch of defensive shootings on YouTube and I’ve yet to see one involving a rifle or distances greater than 25 yards that didn’t involve a police officer.

 

[I<3oil]

I just don’t get the 25/300 zero. I suppose it falls into the “There is the right way, the wrong way, and the Army way” when the USMC, Navy, and SOF zero at 50/200.

Look, if you’re shooting past 200, you have time to figure hold over, but if you have a 25/300 yard zero and are engaging at 100, you are a lot farther off from POA than the 50/200 solution.

So, for bad breath distance? Sure - 25 yard zero, who cares, it’s close enough. But for medium range? For variety of ranges? I think there are better choices…

Idk what the USMC is doing now but as of 2012, they were training on a 100m zero

https://www.trngcmd.marines.mil/Portals/207/Docs/wtbn/MCRP 3-01A.pdf

 

[burbguy82]

Idk what the USMC is doing now but as of 2012, they were training on a 100m zero

https://www.trngcmd.marines.mil/Portals/207/Docs/wtbn/MCRP 3-01A.pdf

100 m for the RCO or (ACOG), 36 for the BUIS. This is partly (36m) due to the M4 as opposed to the M16A4.....assuming I am reading the TM right, section 8

the 36 yard is better than the 25, but IMO still represents a "military use" zero, and not really practical for the civilian use. Nice TM. Were you in the Corps?

 

[I<3oil]

100 m for the RCO or (ACOG), 36 for the BUIS. This is partly (36m) due to the M4 as opposed to the M16A4.....assuming I am reading the TM right, section 8

Yes

the 36 yard is better than the 25, but IMO still represents a "military use" zero, and not really practical for the civilian use. Nice TM. Were you in the Corps?

God no. Crayons taste horrible and Koolaid even worse. I was 11B in the Big Green Weenie.

 

[Pew]

100 m for the RCO or (ACOG), 36 for the BUIS. This is partly (36m) due to the M4 as opposed to the M16A4.....assuming I am reading the TM right, section 8

the 36 yard is better than the 25, but IMO still represents a "military use" zero, and not really practical for the civilian use. Nice TM. Were you in the Corps?

When I got out in 2014, we were still using iron sights for qual, zeroed at 200. Not sure if they still are. Downside is having to redo your zero twice, one for iron sights then back to the rco.

But we rarely had ammo for the second zero.

 

[Nuclear_42]

People overthink this stuff way too much. Whatever your sight graduation is just follow the OEM set up. AR/AK iron sights just dial it in at 100 and it should be dead on no matter where you move the distance setting. As you may have seen In the current war in Europe it’s just trench warfare with no fancy gadgets. There’s more important things to worry about that all these “what if” scenarios. Average combat situations are 300 meters or less. You can go back as far as WW2 and most soldiers wouldn’t even mess with sight graduations. Just aimed for the belt buckle and the rest is history.

 

[BISCUT]

Depends on caliber and application. My HD/SD 300blk 9” MPX 8” and M4 16” are all zeroed at 25. 300&9mm MPX run a dot and this M4 is old school irons.

I do not shoot my 300 sub. I use Hornady 110 black. MPX is 124 HST and 5.56 is LE Tap OTM.

I am dead at 25yards. At 100 yards all 3 are minute of man. Each rings a 12x8 piece of steel CONSISTENTLY.

Figure out your needs first. I know I need 30ft max for my home interior. Outdoor max would be 200 yards but I’d never take one that long unless war came to me.

 

[WeyounDS9]

I always been a freind of the 50m=200m zero which means no holdover /under up to 250m.
Assuming your ballistics curve approximates the classic M4 /M855 combination.

 

[burbguy82]

But we rarely had ammo for the second zero.

which is ridiculous

Outdoor max would be 200 yards but I’d never take one that long unless war came to me.

And hopefully it doesnt,

 

[Pew]

which is ridiculous

If we were lucky we'd get 10 rounds to zero with .

 

[Ws6]

My 6.5mmanbun is zeroed for 264 yards. Its job is to reach out and touch coyotes from up to a half mile away. That way I get a hit out to about 360yd which is the edge of my property without having to worry about over shooting or under shooting.
264 is the bore diameter in thousands of an inch and is about where the zero happens to be so it's rememberable.
My 30-30 is zeroed for 150 yards. So I can take shots out to about 200yard without having to think about it.
Picking the zero is a combination of something you can remember, what the rifle is capable of and terrain or just zero everything at 100.
There is no right way most of the time.
For something like an A2 sighting system you're kind of stuck with 25 and 300, you can get a blank A2 elevation wheel and stamp your own numbers on it if you're super hard core or firing a round that drops like a 22LR.

You're shooting coyotes at nearly 900 yards?

 

[Ws6]

@OVERKILL ...off topic

what do you think the chances of yall being able to have Ar15s in the near future?

I intend to have mine until the day I die. Ymmv.

 

[Ws6]

I zero the mfal, lpvo, and piggyback rds at 100 yards. 100 yard zero really smoothes out the hold over for the rds, the mfal is so close to the bore it doesn't much matter, and a 100 yard zero is a very good basis for dialing dope or holding mils with the lpvo. I use this rifle for home defense, hunting deer, and varmint/predator control. 200m is the longest distance I can laser range on my property.

 

[oil pan 4]

You're shooting coyotes at nearly 900 yards?

I try.

 

[burbguy82]

I try.

with what?

 

[oil pan 4]

with what?

6.5mmanbun with ziess 50mm 4x16 scope on a bergara b14 hmr.

 

[Revving2Redline]

Old fart argument is the AR is only needed to get back to 1911. Zeroed in at 50yrds,i like to 1-2in high or low theory on 25 & 75. If i need a direct zeroing my marine daughter and son in law who is GSP now can zero it in. Like stag arms, still have carry handle like M&P would use.

 

[WeyounDS9]

Not meaning to be a jerk here, but I fail to see the practical use of this for a defensive rifle. In all the news reports and videos of civilian shootings I’ve never seen a report of a non-military defensive use of a firearm at a significant distance outdoors.

Good luck avoiding prison if you shoot someone who is 25 yards away, unless your living room is 76 feet wide. And if they are outside your efforts are probably better spent seeking cover.

When you own a tactical rifle you ought to know how to use it and what it can and cannot do.
If you are not willing to be competent to engage beyond pistol ranges, then there would be no point owning this type tool.

So your argument could really be boiled down to "Only buy pistols for personal defense, since you dont need capability at more than close-up range, as a "civilian" engaged in personal defense".

Owning/operating tactical rifles, is exactly what "our betters" would love us to refrain from and have spent a lot of political capital and money to deter us from.
That alone, is reason to get an AR15 or similar class rifle and to know how to use it properly.

 

[burbguy82]

Owning/operating tactical rifles, is exactly what "our betters" would love us to refrain from and have spent a lot of political capital and money to deter us from.
That alone, is reason to get an AR15 or similar class rifle and to know how to use it properly.

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