BMW Dealership using BG Products for Driveline & Brakes

CleanSump

Site Donor 2022
Joined
Dec 13, 2019
Messages
868
Location
Bolivia
The BMW dealership nearest to me sells BG products in the parts department. I only buy parts there when I don't want to wait for shipping. I have no knowledge of their services or upselling flushes or anything.
 
Joined
Apr 13, 2013
Messages
8,813
Location
FL, USA
Dear Volkswagen Owner:
As part of Volkswagen’s ongoing commitment to customer satisfaction, we are informing you of our
decision to extend the warranty for the heater core in your vehicle under specific conditions to 10 years
or 120,000 miles, whichever occurs first, from the vehicle's original in-service date.
The vehicle's original in-service date is defined as the date the vehicle was delivered to either the
original purchaser or the original lessee; or if the vehicle was first placed in service as a "demonstrator"
or "company" car, on the date such vehicle was first placed in service.
What is the Problem?
An occupant may notice that the cabin heating output is insufficient on the passenger side.
What Will Volkswagen Do?
In our continuing efforts to assure proper performance of Volkswagen vehicles, your dealer will diagnose
and replace the heater core, if necessary, at no cost to you as long as the vehicle remains within the time
and mileage limits of this warranty extension. Please keep this letter with your Warranty booklet and
deliver it to any new owner, along with the owner’s manual.
What Does This Warranty Extension Cover?
This warranty extension covers the diagnosis and replacement of the heater core in cases where there
is insufficient heating output on the passenger side of the vehicle. Should you ever sell the vehicle, this
warranty extension is fully transferable to subsequent owners.
What is Not Covered Under This Warranty Extension?
This warranty extension will not cover damage or malfunctions caused by outside influence, such as
damage due to an accident, or vehicle misuse or neglect as well as repairs that are (1) necessary for
proper diagnosis of these other conditions or (2) required to bring the vehicle up to factory specifications
are not covered by this warranty extension.
Lease Vehicles & Address Changes
If you are the lessor and registered owner of the vehicle identified in this warranty extension, please
forward this information immediately via first-class mail to the lessee within ten (10) days of receipt of
this notification. If you have changed your address or sold the vehicle, please fill out the enclosed
prepaid owner reply card and mail it to us so we can update our records.

Yea-not an issue with VW heater cores.....
There are SPECIFIC models with heater core issues. Not across the board. Kind of like certain GM models with timing chain issues...not across the board. Or certain Hondas with fuel dilution issues, not across the board. Many others that could be mentioned.
 
Joined
Sep 20, 2002
Messages
736
Location
New York, NY
Hello! Recently bought a 2017 BMW X5 with 50k miles on it. About 4 months ago the previous owner got a 50k miles service done at the dealership. Upon closer inspection to what was actually performed on the vehicle, it looks like the dealer used BG products from the front and rear differentials, transfer case and brakes. I would have thought a BMW dealership would use BMW products...

Front Diff spec is BMW Rear Hypoid Oil G2 75w-85 GL-5, they filled it with BG Ultra-Guard LS 75w-140 GL-5.
Front Diff spec is BMW Rear Hypoid Oil G3 75w-80 GL-5, they filled it with BG Ultra-Guard LS 75w-140 GL-5.
Holy efficiency loss! I am going to get some 75w-85 GL-5 and redo both.

Transfer case spec is Shell S-Tech TF0870, and they filled it with Synchro Shift II 75w-80 GL-4. Here's the synchro shift PDS https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/attachments/792_spec-2017-new-pdf.168172/

Brake fluid was BG DOT 4, but they also added some sort of "conditioner". Further they added some "ethanol treatment" fuel additive.

I'm really surprised a BMW dealership would be using off brand and out-of-spec products. Should I be worried about the transfer case fluid at all? I know that has a chain drive and wet clutch so I am thinking the fluid friction properties might be particularly important for clutch wear.
BG are among the best product on the market.
Infiniti dealers use them as well for some applications.
 
Joined
Apr 15, 2010
Messages
7,844
Location
Atlanta,GA
From what I have figured it is push by company that owns bunch of dealerships.
My dealership is owned by Sonic and they had a display of ZMax. I called BMWNA about it and the dealer pulled the display but it was back out the next time I was in their for service. This happened years ago and they're still selling it.
 
Joined
Apr 26, 2005
Messages
1,018
Location
Under the hood
Here is this brake fluid conditioner:

So, they advise to use BG brake service and then add conditioner. What is the problem? They can’t make brake fluid like everyone else so they have to make separate product?

Because BG is so “known” in braking industry, adding their conditioner is what someone needs. I am wondering why Endless, Motul, Pagid, ATE, Brembo, and others didn’t think of it?

I'll give them credit for promoting what is basically a brake flush procedure with their name on it, especially when it's such a neglected maintenance item, but the conditioner that "maximizes performance" and the "Brake fluid has been known to deteriorate before manufacturer-recommended brake service intervals" reeks of snake oil, or the dealer's desire for a nicer boat, as Click & Clack always used to joke about.

"Has been known," and "notorious" are some of the most common, and laziest terms used in internet auto parts marketing.

The little company Alfred Teves started more than a century ago, and a major industry supplier of braking systems missed the boat, so to speak, on this one.

It's surprising that franchisees representing BMW (a brand that strongly advises against things like additives, and applied fear-mongering decals to its cars warning of consequences if they are modified, or deviate from official procedure, long before OEM approvals became a a common thing) would approve of its dealers servicing its vehicles with third-party products.

But, as the OEMs often like to remind angry customers, dealers are independent businesses that they don't have control over, at least when it's the dealer who farks something up, so take it up with them, not us.

No doubt it's a nice profit center, like the extra stuff glomed onto new cars, whether the customer might want them or not.

I remember my Volvo dealer, 35 years ago, charging $20 for a can of BG fuel system cleaner that they added on service visits. It had a reputation as a potent, and effective cleaner, so I didn't have much of a problem with its use. What I did have an issue with was being billed for and not receiving the product during service, which the service writer sheepishly rectified after I pointed out I only provided them with the ignition key, not the one for the gas cap, so where exactly did they put the cleaner I was charged for?

My curiosity of what this miracle conditioner costs wasn't revealed after a cursory search. But I wouldn't be surprised if it was comparable to that of a container of fresh, quality brake fluid, which, used as prescribed, at regualr intervals, unquestionably provides all the benefits claimed by the BG product.
 
Joined
Sep 23, 2006
Messages
487
Location
757 Virginia, USA
My curiosity of what this miracle conditioner costs wasn't revealed after a cursory search. But I wouldn't be surprised if it was comparable to that of a container of fresh, quality brake fluid, which, used as prescribed, at regualr intervals, unquestionably provides all the benefits claimed by the BG product.
It is more egregious than you would think. I found a Toyota dealership that sells the 1 fluid ounce bottle online for a discounted price of $18. The listed MSRP was $25! BG's arrangements with dealerships and service facilities are only designed for maximum profit margin.

By the way, the $20 can of BG fuel additive was probably their flagship 44K product. It has been touted since the 1980's. While I agree it is an extremely potent fuel system cleaning agent (more so than Techron and Redline SI-1), it is not worth the current MSRP of $27 per can.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Mar 8, 2012
Messages
15,755
Location
Colorado Springs
I'll give them credit for promoting what is basically a brake flush procedure with their name on it, especially when it's such a neglected maintenance item, but the conditioner that "maximizes performance" and the "Brake fluid has been known to deteriorate before manufacturer-recommended brake service intervals" reeks of snake oil, or the dealer's desire for a nicer boat, as Click & Clack always used to joke about.

"Has been known," and "notorious" are some of the most common, and laziest terms used in internet auto parts marketing.

The little company Alfred Teves started more than a century ago, and a major industry supplier of braking systems missed the boat, so to speak, on this one.

It's surprising that franchisees representing BMW (a brand that strongly advises against things like additives, and applied fear-mongering decals to its cars warning of consequences if they are modified, or deviate from official procedure, long before OEM approvals became a a common thing) would approve of its dealers servicing its vehicles with third-party products.

But, as the OEMs often like to remind angry customers, dealers are independent businesses that they don't have control over, at least when it's the dealer who farks something up, so take it up with them, not us.

No doubt it's a nice profit center, like the extra stuff glomed onto new cars, whether the customer might want them or not.

I remember my Volvo dealer, 35 years ago, charging $20 for a can of BG fuel system cleaner that they added on service visits. It had a reputation as a potent, and effective cleaner, so I didn't have much of a problem with its use. What I did have an issue with was being billed for and not receiving the product during service, which the service writer sheepishly rectified after I pointed out I only provided them with the ignition key, not the one for the gas cap, so where exactly did they put the cleaner I was charged for?

My curiosity of what this miracle conditioner costs wasn't revealed after a cursory search. But I wouldn't be surprised if it was comparable to that of a container of fresh, quality brake fluid, which, used as prescribed, at regualr intervals, unquestionably provides all the benefits claimed by the BG product.
That sums it up.
 
Joined
Mar 3, 2011
Messages
2,516
Location
California's Central Coast Wine Country
Here is this brake fluid conditioner:

So, they advise to use BG brake service and then add conditioner. What is the problem? They can’t make brake fluid like everyone else so they have to make separate product?

Because BG is so “known” in braking industry, adding their conditioner is what someone needs. I am wondering why Endless, Motul, Pagid, ATE, Brembo, and others didn’t think of it?
I feel dirty after viewing their website and reading that product description.

I simply refuse to use products like these. Quality products that meet specifications along with proper service intervals are all I need.

Scott
 

randomhero439

Thread starter
Joined
Jul 21, 2012
Messages
1,352
Location
Ohio
I spoke with someone at my work who specializes in torque vectoring axles and wet clutches. He mentioned that OEM's are usually quite picky with the friction modifier formulations and concentrations for wet clutches. I'm sure this BG Syncroshift MTF does not meet whatever the TF0780 spec is. I suspect it might not be terrible because it is a GL-4 and has friction modifier for the transmission syncro friction material. I'm going to change it out to the TF0780 at this next oil change. It will only have been in there for about 5,000 miles and he didn't think that is a big deal for wear or performance.

Also gonna change out the brake fluid for the Pentosin DOT4 LV and the diffs to 75w-85 before winter.
 
Joined
Apr 15, 2010
Messages
7,608
Location
Connecticut
I guess my question is would a 2017 with 50k miles still be under warranty?

If not, they can upsell you whatever special profit generating fluids they want, which is essentially what the BG fluids and services are compared to regular OE approved fluids. I wouldn't really question the fluids used besides the XDrive transfer case fluid, but it's also a reason I do all my own work. The local independent BMW shop which has a very good reputation only uses approved fluids.
 
Joined
Mar 8, 2012
Messages
15,755
Location
Colorado Springs
I spoke with someone at my work who specializes in torque vectoring axles and wet clutches. He mentioned that OEM's are usually quite picky with the friction modifier formulations and concentrations for wet clutches. I'm sure this BG Syncroshift MTF does not meet whatever the TF0780 spec is. I suspect it might not be terrible because it is a GL-4 and has friction modifier for the transmission syncro friction material. I'm going to change it out to the TF0780 at this next oil change. It will only have been in there for about 5,000 miles and he didn't think that is a big deal for wear or performance.

Also gonna change out the brake fluid for the Pentosin DOT4 LV and the diffs to 75w-85 before winter.
I was on their web site looking products, and besides mentioning “best” every third sentence, I couldn’t get any meaningful info.
 
Joined
Aug 30, 2004
Messages
27,579
Location
CA
I was on their web site looking products, and besides mentioning “best” every third sentence, I couldn’t get any meaningful info.
Of the snake oil companies, BG is probably the most legitimate one. Some of their stuff does work.

MOC has most of the market share around here, partly due to Sonic. 🤮
 
Joined
Jan 2, 2004
Messages
9,563
Location
California
IIRC, BMW uses a either a BorgWarner or Magna(former New Venture Gear) t-case, not far off but not a one-to-one similarity to the same units on a F-150/Expedition/Navigator or Tundra/Sequoia(BW) or a GM/Mopar truck(Magna) that calls for ATF(GM/Ford/Mopar) or 75W GL-4 oil(Toyota, and they sell it as Transfer Oil LT). Red Line says their MTF/MTL works in the BMW and Toyota cases.
 
Joined
Apr 26, 2005
Messages
1,018
Location
Under the hood
It is more egregious than you would think. I found a Toyota dealership that sells the 1 fluid ounce bottle online for a discounted price of $18. The listed MSRP was $25! BG's arrangements with dealerships and service facilities are only designed for maximum profit margin.

By the way, the $20 can of BG fuel additive was probably their flagship 44K product. It has been touted since the 1980's. While I agree it is an extremely potent fuel system cleaning agent (more so than Techron and Redline SI-1), it is not worth the current MSRP of $27 per can.

I figured it had to be around a Jackson.

Meanwhile, a liter of ATE Typ200, 5.1, SL.6, or Bosch ESI6 ranges from ~$14-22 on BezosLand, depending on whether one needs a LV fluid or not.

Because they're packaged in cans, they have a five year shelf life unopened, and three years in service.

In the overall scheme of things, cheap insurance for a critical safety system, even if one were to shorten the intervals.

Finally, a lot of BMW dealers don't enjoy a good reputation to begin with, so the use of aftermarket fluids would only make them an even less appealing option.
 
Joined
Mar 10, 2017
Messages
970
Location
South Wales, UK
An awful lot of scaremongering on this thread, especially towards what is effectivley a reputable manafacturer.

Doesn't the transfer case have an oil quality sensor also? Surley if there was an issue with this lubricant it would have flagged a fault and/or there would be driveability issues.

Two cans of BG 244 saved me from a £2,000 turbo replacement back in 2014. For that alone I'm not one to talk bad of their products.
 
Joined
Dec 26, 2005
Messages
22,247
Location
Upper Midwest
An awful lot of scaremongering on this thread, especially towards what is effectivley a reputable manafacturer.

Doesn't the transfer case have an oil quality sensor also? Surley if there was an issue with this lubricant it would have flagged a fault and/or there would be driveability issues.

Two cans of BG 244 saved me from a £2,000 turbo replacement back in 2014. For that alone I'm not one to talk bad of their products.
But on the other hand, one of the marks of a reputable company is one that backs up their products with the results of standardized tests and specifications. Those tests result in licenses and approvals, do the BG Products referenced in this thread have licenses, specifications and approvals?
 
Joined
Mar 10, 2017
Messages
970
Location
South Wales, UK
But on the other hand, one of the marks of a reputable company is one that backs up their products with the results of standardized tests and specifications. Those tests result in licenses and approvals, do the BG Products referenced in this thread have licenses, specifications and approvals?

People love Amsoil and Redline who skirt around approvals. Why is BG any different?

FYI, I only buy lubricants with actual approvals. The thought that third-party testing has taken place gives me peace of mind.
 
Joined
Dec 26, 2005
Messages
22,247
Location
Upper Midwest
People love Amsoil and Redline who skirt around approvals. Why is BG any different?

FYI, I only buy lubricants with actual approvals. The thought that third-party testing has taken place gives me peace of mind.
For one thing, both Amsoil and Red Line at least give a list of specifications and approvals for which they consider a product to be suitable or recommended. And in the case of Amsoil some of their products do have actual approvals and licenses.
 
Top