Are the days of the 10k OCI over with?

[IndyIan]

I run around 6k miles OCI on the Outback although I'm fine with the odd 7-8k one if we've been doing lots of long trips and its not convenient to do a change, especially now that I'm running 5W30 or 0W30 and its not DI either.
The Focus gets 10-12k OCI's now as its now clear its going to rust out before wearing out.

 

[53' Stude]

What in my post is a wives tail? Absolutely nothing. The yawn emojis are very rude.

Like I really care. Just like my real dad: wasting perfect oil at 3-5 OCI’s.

It would blow your mind if you saw our work vehicles that go 7-8k OCI’s on Safety Kleen oils.

Yawn emoji isn’t rude it means folks are tired of whining and dumb posts. Grow up!

 

[53' Stude]

so use ignore. I have had 23 people on ignore that used to trigger me here. I'm happier and so are the Mod(s).


That just sounds like a kid. For one the EPA doesnt have any knowledge about why Toyota picked an OCI.. I might be "rude" to mention it, but you are not believable.

My advice back up cool down and use ignore on selected people.(even if its me).

RAND: I don’t believe 90-95% of what AutoMechanic says personally. Lots of his things he heard are false. I don’t care anymore. Most of us actually knowledgeable folks know what we are talking about.

 

[pghvolvo]

Hanging over the years on the Prius board will give you religion when it comes to the recommended 5K and the revised 10k oil changes. The third Gen Prius had oil ring issues in the 2010-2013's. A lot of these cars where the owners went to 10K mile oil changes started to see a lot of oil usage around 100K miles and higher. It's not always the case but a majority of the cars involved with high oil consumption, the owners had gone to the revised 10k mile oil changes. My 2010 gets an oil change every six months (4200 miles) and at 115K miles I have zero oil consumption issues.

If the car is used a majority of the time at highway speeds I'd say yes to 10k mile oil changes. If the car is used as a daily driver with a lot of short trips and urban low speed driving I would stay in the 5K-6K oil change camp.

 

[Vern_in_IL]

I would do 10k on a naturally aspirated motor, but seeing most engines going turbo, DI, or twin turbo to satisfy EPA regulations, I would scale it back.

 

[AmBeRnEcTaR]

I'm once a year which currently works out to 4xxx miles. I go by the OCI which seems to be both time and distance based as my annual shows somewhere 5-7% life remaining. So unless my miles jump way up I'll stick to annual.

This^^^ for me as well.
Exactly.
Zero freeway driving, all city stop and go. One year usually nets~7-8000km max then the oil and filter gets changed. Not more in over 35 years, this program has worked well for me.

 

[Slow Car Sport Mode]

Now for another eternal question.. IS it prudent to get a UOA on the 11k+ miles oil, so it can be analyzed.. or are UOAs "useless"?

There is a crowd on here that is basically anti-UOA (and wonders why there is a section for such) and I have to wonder if they have a point. Would a filter cut-open be a better judge of engine health than a UOA? (This specifically as it pertains to an extended drain.) Maybe to determine TBN, if nothing else? Though for cost of it, you could have changed the oil...

Then there is "engine feels GREAT!" although that technically isn't a valid test, either..

@AutoMechanic The negativity, real or not.. please don't give in.. it's a guaranteed lose, okay... I personally DON'T use Ignore myself (you still see that a post was made and you'll probably read it anyway. The post you don’t want to see doesn't go away or not get posted just because you don't want it to.. follow the double negatives, a negative of a negative is a positive in math, even number of negatives = positive, odd number = negative, remember. In English a double negative means positive or affirmative, so another way of saying it is "The post you don't want to see is visible whether you want it to be or not, you really think you're not going to read it?" And that's why ignore largely doesn't work, so, be like me, train yourself to not use it and realize that it's just not worth it to engage. This will get you farther. They want you to fail is why they say "Use ignore." Train your brain so that it won't matter.)

I might be talked into a UOA on the Taurus oil.. might run it out to about 20k on oil for about 9-10k on the filter and a cut-open to follow in @wwillson footsteps like he has done with the beautiful Durango..

Oh, and about Toyota. Though I get chided by folks that think I was a janitor or cleaned the toilets or something at my time there. I was involved with the production of vehicles. I saw the 0W-16 drums, really saw every part of the car assembled and heads firsthand from my co-workers at "East Weld".. Toyota REALLY isn't what they used to be. They will get their car to last the warranty period and then MAY last longer.. really like most any other auto manufacturer. This isn't your 1993 4AFE Corolla, which was essentially a VERY small tiny car made to VERY high standards like the Infiniti Y32 chassis of the time (simply amazing construction build quality) and the Toyota is a slow, boring vehicle that was based on reputation... like an Acura RL of the last generation, they fumbled. Now they are trying desperately to say "We are different!" And it ain't working. Marty McFly had a Toyota pickup.. even that V6 wasn't stellar, read up. But that's just my take.

 

[cptbarkey]

Hanging over the years on the Prius board will give you religion when it comes to the recommended 5K and the revised 10k oil changes. The third Gen Prius had oil ring issues in the 2010-2013's. A lot of these cars where the owners went to 10K mile oil changes started to see a lot of oil usage around 100K miles and higher. It's not always the case but a majority of the cars involved with high oil consumption, the owners had gone to the revised 10k mile oil changes. My 2010 gets an oil change every six months (4200 miles) and at 115K miles I have zero oil consumption issues.

If the car is used a majority of the time at highway speeds I'd say yes to 10k mile oil changes. If the car is used as a daily driver with a lot of short trips and urban low speed driving I would stay in the 5K-6K oil change camp.

Car care nut on youtube has showcased a few Toyotas, and the Lexus vintage of the prius same years that developed consumption for extended oci’s, as well as same year RAV4s. Like with many things, different engines tolerate it, some don’t. DI or port injected. My takeaway is It’s not a good idea to have a blanket rule for every situation.

 

[OilUzer]

It's like potato chips, the bags get bigger or stay the same size but they reduce the chips and add more compressed air. lol

If happens with MANY products if you pay attention or read the weight of the product, you see the weight slowly decreasing, container will stay the same size and the price slowly increasing.

That's how they raise the prices without you knowing by adding air. Also it's the biz world way of dealing with inflation and the increasing cost of material and labor ... by passing it on to the consumer without alerting them!

Now back to the oil, I think op maybe correct. I have been reading some threads that some oils (e.g. The Manly Oil), reducing ester or ANs and not being as strong or as cleaning as before ...

Not generalizing based on one thread, but when companies want to increase profits or keep the cost down, they cut corners (meet the min required), reduce quality or quantity ...

You pump some air into 30 weight oil, it will get lighter (now 20 weight) and you also increase the price and it's a win win situation!

 

[doublebase]

In my book, it depends on the engine (specifically the fuel system DI vs PI, turbo or not, sump capacity). Stuff like that. I wouldn’t do 10,000 mile intervals on a DI engine.

On a port injection system I’ve change my opinion; I used to be a strict 5,000 mile interval, guy, now I’ve changed my mind. I think 7,500-10,000 is ok depending on driving style and if you check your oil levels consistently. Reason I say this is because on multiple occasions I’ve taken vehicles to higher mileage (on 5,000 mile intervals), and on EACH occasion my engines ended up consuming oil when I got over/around 200,000 miles. The shorter intervals did nothing to help.

And now I‘d just like to see just how good these newer oils are, and I like to push them to the distance. Plus, I own a 2016 Toyota Avalon - I don’t really like the car all that much, I own it, it has 125,000 trouble free miles on it, I drive a ton, and I could care less if in three years at 200,000 miles I have to get rid of this thing. I want to experiment with extended intervals. In my book this is the perfect car to do that.

 

[supton]

I like 5k, works with my tire rotation on my FWD vehicles. My PFI's were likely fine with 10k but eh, too many cars don't seem to tolerate it, and by the time you find out, it's too late. Probably the best engines to tolerate 10k+ have *cough* timing belts.

If I were to pick up a used older PFI car with no history of problems on 10k, I might do 10k... but I might not. Not when it's older and in who knows what condition internally.

 

[53' Stude]

Guess no one has followed member Stumpy and his long OCI’s. If I’m doubt go 5k and test the oil, then determine if you can go farther. Obviously if you have a DI engine I’d say 4-5k max. That’s what we do at work with Safety Kleen oils.

 

[nomas]

When my Titan was under warranty , 5k OCI's were required . The maintenance reminder was factory set for 5k . Since almost all of my driving is short trips , I'm going to leave everything as is .
My wife's 2012 CX-9 has been getting oil changes at around 4-5k since day one and the vehicle has been trouble free . Not going to change what works .

 

[zerosoma]

Huh ?

I thought I explained the question, twice?

 

[zerosoma]

I agree completely. I would never go beyond 5K on any oil. I don't care what is printed on the bottle or jug. I never saw the logic of trusting a $40K+ vehicle to some lettering printed on the bottle, or box the oil filter came in.

It just never made any sense to me. Why push it? And what's the big reward if you do? Driving around with dirty oil, that you saved $25 bucks on by not changing it? When it takes over twice as much just to fill the gas tank. Oil changes are about the cheapest and best protection that you can give a vehicle on a regular basis.

And I totally agree that A LOT of this longer, extended OCI business is being pushed for environmental reasons. The same way CAFE is pushing ultra thin motor oils down the public's throat.... Not because the oils today are all of a sudden so great.

Ah the “cheap insurance” argument.

 

[zerosoma]

I think you're equating low metallic additives as weaker. I don't think that is the case. Oils have become better. When those additives are removed or lowered in quantity, others are added in their place. It's not as if they remove things and just let it go... I think it's a combination of things. 10k and beyond is certainly doable in many engines backed up by oil analysis. There are lot more GDI turbo engines on the market now too.

Yeah I get what you are saying with replacement additives. However. Pennzoil Plat High Mileage, SP formulation, has a ridiculously bad looking additive package all around. AND a TBN of 5 something which is like…***.

Someone said TBN is outdated. I’d like someone to explain that to me and also what other things are outdated now? Do we even trust oil analysis anymore?

 

[zerosoma]

No offense intended, but your premise is 100 percent wrong. You say, disparagingly, “capitalism at its finest “ insinuating that capitalism and a wide variety of choices are somehow mutually exclusive. Wrong. It’s the free markets that provide myriad choices. Free markets allow the consumer to choose which brands win. Everyone complains about the government because they insist on choosing for you. Consumers have seen everything from gasoline to dishwashing detergent to lighter fluid becoming demonstrably worse and are naturally suspicious. Capitalism gives you choices, it doesn’t limit them. State run nations aren’t known for wide variety because they don’t have to offer choice. The government picks the winners. And when the government picks the winner you get Pemex and Ma Bell.

This dude knows exactly what I’m talking about.

 

[zerosoma]

View attachment 169239

Care to elaborate or just post Star Trek memes?

 

[zerosoma]

I change my gas every 500 miles...

And the frequent tow bills to the nearest gas station are adding up!

 

[4WD]

I thought I explained the question, twice?

That was over your comments on direct injection …