2009 Lexus RX 350 3.5L 2GR FE piston slap/VVTI ticking

Status
Not open for further replies.

Robert Scalchi

Thread starter
Messages
34
All of that is really something. I don’t know what, but something. Very hard to make any of it out except I think there’s a lot of misconceptions flowing around in the mix.

I don’t know how you kept it straight yourself.
Can you kindly elaborate? Not sure what you are getting at? Misconceptions at the way I am attempting to tackle this issue? Or other users reading my posts?
I read the first third or so of the OP. Skip all the oil additives and try some M1 EP High Mileage with the recommended viscosity. I'd also try some Gumout Regane High Mileage fuel cleaner. Both available at Walmart with a rebate on the M1. One of these two things helped solve the 1 second start up grind on '12 Camry.
Will attempt next OCI thank you
 

Robert Scalchi

Thread starter
Messages
34
Yep … my 2010 5.3L slapped on 5w30 or 15w40
My L83 5.3L is quiet on 0w20 … both were …
Interesting it slapped on thicker or OEM spec most likely. But the thinner oil it didn't slap. Any shavings in the OCI drain? Increased fuel economy I take it?
 
Messages
17,591
Location
Upper Midwest
Can you kindly elaborate? Not sure what you are getting at? Misconceptions at the way I am attempting to tackle this issue? Or other users reading my posts?
If it is piston slap, no oil will change or correct that. You have no "cold flow" issue unless your oil has a winter rating that is entirely unsuitable for your expected starting conditions (which you don't) or unless you have a mechanical issue with the engine such as a defective oil pump. Otherwise there is no "cold flow" problem.

The additives aren't doing a thing and "film strength" is not the problem. Toyota "back specing" 0W-20 has nothing to do with ring clearances. Nano technologies is a set of buzzwords that don't fix mechanical problems either, assuming your vehicle has one. "Viscosities, film strength, additives such as boron, moly" aren't your problem in regards to "acceptable wear metal tolerances" whatever that means. And the UOA isn't going to help unless you are looking for coolant intrusion or other contamination since a UOA won't give you the information you think you're going to get. It's not that useful actually.

If you have a mechanical problem no oil is going to correct it. You need to properly diagnose the issue (if there is one) and fix it.
 
Last edited:
Messages
7,555
Location
North America
OK from your 1st post - you purchased a used, 160k vehicle. Immediately went to a 10k interval without a UOA or any observation. Tried numerous additives and oils to try and stop the startup noise (which some have said could be normal)

I didn't see where you mentioned what filter you're using. Has it been the same type all the way through? There have been documented cases on here of engines having startup noise on one filter but not another.

Some inside-the-valvecover pics might be helpful to assess the condition; the previous owner could have neglected it causing sludge, and that would be good to find out

It's your call but if it were me, I'd drop the additives completely, back down the interval to 5k and take a sample at that point to rule out mechanical issues. I would switch to a different brand of filter and use a 0w-30 to help with initial flow.

If all of that is good, I agree - just drive it.
 
Messages
457
Location
virginia
My Daughter has an '07 Rav 4 V6 which we bought used w/142K mi. about 5 yrs ago. I've done all the oil/filters changes since then. Used Castrol Edge/Magnetic 5w-30 oil w/ twice yearly oil changes. Recently tried Mobil 1 Extended 5 Qts. 5w-30 w/1.4 Qt. High Mileage Mobil 1 Extended. Excellent oil! Try this oil. With the current Mobil rebates a 5 qt. jug is less than $10. How many miles on the spark plugs? On our engine 4 of the plugs were not snug at all. One was so loose I could remove by hand. (This cylinder required a new Denso coil pack.) Put new Denso Iridium plugs in and oh my....sweet engine even sweeter. I agree w/the previous posters, I personally would use any oil additives.
 

Robert Scalchi

Thread starter
Messages
34
OK from your 1st post - you purchased a used, 160k vehicle. Immediately went to a 10k interval without a UOA or any observation. Tried numerous additives and oils to try and stop the startup noise (which some have said could be normal)

I didn't see where you mentioned what filter you're using. Has it been the same type all the way through? There have been documented cases on here of engines having startup noise on one filter but not another.

Some inside-the-valvecover pics might be helpful to assess the condition; the previous owner could have neglected it causing sludge, and that would be good to find out

It's your call but if it were me, I'd drop the additives completely, back down the interval to 5k and take a sample at that point to rule out mechanical issues. I would switch to a different brand of filter and use a 0w-30 to help with initial flow.

If all of that is good, I agree - just drive it.
I agree. I'm dropping the additives. I was anticipating someone here to ask about filter media since I realized its the one detail I left out. Been using new Lexus/Toyota OEM filters in every change. 04152-YZZA1. Except the 10K OCI. In which I ran MB 1 M1C- 251 for the 10k OCI. Didn't immediately go to a 10k interval. Did that on the 4th OCI (Correct without UOA.) Because I read from other users running same synth oil/motor setup that it was practical to do so. May have made incorrect decision without analysis on that one. Otherwise. OCI'S have been as I listed. 3k, 3k, 10k, 8k, 6k, 6k, 2k, 5k. (Manufacturer suggests 5k.) I have thumbed across some users on here with same motor having startup flow issues on one filter medium and not another. May have to revisit. It would probably be good not only for me to assess inside the valve covers for sludge, but the VVTI pickup screens as well to ensure no obstruction. I find it peculiar that the noise goes away once the oil and engine gets nice and warm/hot within operating temps.
 
Messages
198
My 2008 Sienna does the same thing, I plan to run it till she blows and upgrade to a new van. Its a mechanical flaw and various potions don't seem to do much, if anything.
 
Messages
17,633
Location
...
No it was present just running straight synthetics only. I'm trying to get away from additives.


But you dumped Rislone, STP, MMO, Lucas and HyperLube into the sump? If you are trying to get away from additives you are going in the wrong direction.
 
Messages
847
Location
MA
Normally I would concur but. Dont think you've read up on the subject material as much as I have in the last 6 months which spans across multiple forums. BITOG, Toyota, Lexus, ETC...Many users of the 2GR FE motor has reported the same issues from brand new off the showroom floor across all different Toyota/Scion/Lexus models. 08- 17s are mostly affected. AS I LISTED IN MY POST. Sienna, RX 350, RAV 4, Tacoma, and many others. Ill find the TSB from one of the users here later. No conspiracy here.
I haven’t read up on it because why would I care if my vehicle with 212k miles and a little extra start up noise ran well? I have a 2019 RX 350 and I get in it, start it and usually the radio is on and so I don’t really listen to the engine. At 10k miles per year if I get 212k miles and another 20 years out of it that’s a win in my book. Thank you, Toyota! You did your job!
 
Messages
3,902
Location
WI.
we really don't know how cold your starts are because you don't bother to display a location...your TC-W3 equation is wrong please correct it.
 
Messages
461
Location
PA
Just my experience with the 2GR-FE so far: I have been running Shell Gas/Truck 0W20 full synthetic exclusively since we purchased our 2010 RX350 in late 2019 with good results (I haven't noticed any unusual engine noises). It had 90K dealer maintained miles on it at the time and is now at 108K. I change it at 5K with Mahle or Toyota/Lexus filters.
 

Robert Scalchi

Thread starter
Messages
34
we really don't know how cold your starts are because you don't bother to display a location...your TC-W3 equation is wrong please correct it.
I am new here and just joined yesterday. Location is North East NJ. As far as the TC-W3 equation being wrong? I am going off of what other multiple drivers have tested and stated over 10k mi. Why do you think it is wrong? And what is the correction and why?
 

Robert Scalchi

Thread starter
Messages
34
I haven’t read up on it because why would I care if my vehicle with 212k miles and a little extra start up noise ran well? I have a 2019 RX 350 and I get in it, start it and usually the radio is on and so I don’t really listen to the engine. At 10k miles per year if I get 212k miles and another 20 years out of it that’s a win in my book. Thank you, Toyota! You did your job!
That's great! Im happy for you that you are having such a good experience in the newer Lexus. It's a great vehicle IMO. But if you don't care about another older Lexus owner posting questions for possible solutions on how to mitigate better durability and driveability and performance, than why are you here posting on this thread?
 
Messages
3,902
Location
WI.
'I am also running a verified experiment where I am putting 2 stroke TCW3 rated oil in the gas at a ratio of 500:1 or 5 ounces per every 5 gallons of gas to clean up the ring packs, valve seats, fuel injectors, combustion chamber, etc.'

Conflicted ratio statement.
 
Messages
3,902
Location
WI.
P1030055.JPG



My Honda 500 after 10yrs. on 640:1 TC-W3 E091 fuel. I'd say it works well.
 

Robert Scalchi

Thread starter
Messages
34
I believe from what I have gathered and read across multiple Toyota and Lexus forums. The 2010 and newer RX 350's 2GRFE are spec'd specifically for 0W 20 possibly due to tighter ring landing clearances. What's speculative to me is whether the 2009 year was tooled abd fitted to operate in the 0W 20 range rather than the 5W30. Depending on where it was produced, assembled, and what time of the year in 2009. It has been suggested but not confirmed. Glad you are having a good experience though. I may consider that.
Just my experience with the 2GR-FE so far: I have been running Shell Gas/Truck 0W20 full synthetic exclusively since we purchased our 2010 RX350 in late 2019 with good results (I haven't noticed any unusual engine noises). It had 90K dealer maintained miles on it at the time and is now at 108K. I change it at 5K with Mahle or Toyota/Lexus filters.
 

Robert Scalchi

Thread starter
Messages
34
'I am also running a verified experiment where I am putting 2 stroke TCW3 rated oil in the gas at a ratio of 500:1 or 5 ounces per every 5 gallons of gas to clean up the ring packs, valve seats, fuel injectors, combustion chamber, etc.'

Conflicted ratio statement.
Ok so you are saying 500:1 is not 1 ounce to every 5 gallon of gas? When I first read that also on other forums, I thought that the ratio to ounces didn't seem right either and questioned it. Will look into it further. But it is emphasized as rule of thumb on other forums that 1oz. to every 5 gallons is what's to be followed. Oh wait? I see I wrote it backwards in my previous post. 5 ounces of oil to 5 gallons of gas. My bad.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top