Is there any advantage to using something like an M1, Fram Ultra, etc. when running standard 4-5k intervals? Is it worth spending the extra money when not using these for 10-15-20k ?
Thanks!
Thanks!
Advantage for using "premium extended filters" when not doing extended OCI's?
- Thread starter Johnny248
- Start date
Better build quality usually, better efficiency.
Unless you are extremely tight on money and can't afford a few dollars more then I see absolutely zero reason to cheap out on an oil filter unless you are running some kind of engine cleaner/flush product like BG.
You certainly do not want to go for cheap junk like Protec.
Unless you are extremely tight on money and can't afford a few dollars more then I see absolutely zero reason to cheap out on an oil filter unless you are running some kind of engine cleaner/flush product like BG.
You certainly do not want to go for cheap junk like Protec.
They say it gives you "peace of mind"...
These days like the premium filters because the quality of the cheaper ones is all over the place. The orange can Fram's lately have had horrible pleat spacing, Mann-Hummel is just all over the place, tearing media, sliced ADBVs, piss poor threads, you never know what brand's filter you're gonna get in what box, other than the Hyundai OEM filter made by Mann-Hummel Korea, I wouldn't touch anything made by Purolator/Wix/Mann/Motorcraft. The cheap-o champ jobbers seem to be the most consistent but they occasionally don't get the fiber end caps centered very well on the varieties that still use the combo valve. The Champ XLs, the mid tier Premium Gaurd, the Fram Synthetic Endurance/Royal Purple filters seem a lot more consistent andin the Fram Endurance's case it's pretty well impossible for the media to tear because of the reinforced media.
The majority of the manufacturing cost is the quality control.
Quality is not just from the material view point but also from the manufacturing view point.
For example, the premium filter have better material (more efficient, less tear, etc) but the better material is useless if the manufacturing is not good (less tear, better gluing, etc).
So, hopefully, the higher priced aka premium filter have not just better material but better manufacturing and quality control.
Quality is not just from the material view point but also from the manufacturing view point.
For example, the premium filter have better material (more efficient, less tear, etc) but the better material is useless if the manufacturing is not good (less tear, better gluing, etc).
So, hopefully, the higher priced aka premium filter have not just better material but better manufacturing and quality control.
This exactly. For a couple dollars more you get a higher quality filter that is generally more robust.
I've had two ACDELCO PF1237's tear on me using 5K intervals, even posted one example here on BITOG. Ran multiple Tough Guards and Ultras and never an issue with tearing. Was worth the few extra dollars even for 5K intervals.
Last edited:
Very good point. Even when/if filters tear, is it likely to have a significant impact on engine life? I have my doubts.
Irony is, a) when someone cuts open a filter and finds 'bad signs', they've been using that filter on their engine for who knows how long and b) they probably have already put the same brand filter right back on the car 'cause they aren't cutting these open until after the oil change is done.
- Joined
- Apr 10, 2023
- Messages
- 6
As crazy as it sounds, filters work better while getting dirty. Efficiency when new is lower than when is used for 1K, 2K, 3K etc.
From my perspective you are wasting money with a filter that is only used 40% of their life time.
From my perspective you are wasting money with a filter that is only used 40% of their life time.
Air filters work better once used and they form a dust cake, but I don't think I've seen any studies that make any similar suggestion for oil filters, in fact with oil filters the greater the media gets saturated the greater pressure drop and the more pressure is applied to the remaining openings in the media that may actually drop the efficiency.
Some filters achieve higher milage ratings with lower efficiency. I believe wix xp and Purolator boss are ones to avoid for this application.
dnewton3
Staff member
Well, I've got news for you ...
We've seen expensive filter also have:
- tears
- uneven pleats
- contamination such as paint chips and metal filings inside the filter
- questionable examples of construction such as poor crimps at the baseplate
For a "normal" 5k mile OCI, there is essentially no real, tangible benefit to a super-duper filter.
* the large holding capacity goes woefully unused
* the efficiency delta isn't proven to make a statistically significant difference in engine wear (say 95% vs 99% at 20um, such as EG vs XG for example)
* the promise of "better" construction has been suspect, as I noted above
* there are bazillions of cars which run inexpensive filters for "normal" use, and the engines never have a problem
I'm not saying premium filters aren't useful or a good idea; they are great for extended FCIs or multiple OCIs.
Even when we see filters with tears in the media (probably the more prevelant failure mode we see from filter disections), there's never any correlation to a failed engine within any sensible timeframe. And, if we assume that the media tears we discover are only a fraction of tears which are not discovered, then it's only goes to show how this problem is overblown in terms of actual engine damage.
I'm not saying these failure modes are desirable; we'd all agree here. But using a super-premium filter for 5k miles is just as big of a waste as running a super-premium syn for that same 5k miles.
There's zero proof that these premium products have any reasonable ROI in 5k miles. When I say "proof", I mean credible data and not mythology and rhetoric.
Filters on both my vehicles are a pita to charge without removing the front shield. I like the 15k filters so I don’t have to change them every OCI
