2025 so far EV sales up 28%

[alarmguy]

Still struggling but the stock price doesnt care! Go figure I certainly cannot other than suggest it's a short term trading stock since the price is now only coming close to matching or beating its high from 3 years ago.

"Tesla Model Y Assembly Workers Told To Stay Home For A Week"​

"Tesla’s demand issues seem to have taken a turn for the worse, with its most successful product being the latest victim. Some assembly workers responsible for building the Model Y crossover–the brand’s best-selling model–were told to stay home for the week of Memorial Day, according to several employees quoted by Business Insider."

Source =
https://insideevs.com/news/759265/tesla-model-y-cybertruck-line-workers-stay-home/

 

[alarmguy]

Has either company ever met a date target on an EV?

I find equal distaste for the gander as I do the goose.

I think Tesla gets the trophy for its Cybertruck fiasco.
Other than that I do not have the knowledge to track their production promises going back over ten years. However here we are over one decade later they still struggle to turn a substantial steady profit which has only been a couple years.

Also their production and sales growth has not been close to what they told the public around 2022

I dont understand the "gander" line, I guess that is a west coast thing. So not sure ..
But the OP says a 28% increase in global EV sales this year. Even though in my mind only the USA matters. We are a unique country.
However 2025 Tesla is not participating in that sales increase. Their sales are in the toilet and down, not up.
I stated many times I have nothing at all against Tesla, except the truth which can get skewed in forums and media at times.

"Tesla sales plunged 13% in the first three months of this year, the largest drop in deliveries in its history, as backlash against CEO Elon Musk and growing competition took a large bite out of demand for its EVs."
https://www.cnn.com/2025/04/02/business/tesla-sales/index.html

 

[UncleDave]

I think Tesla gets the trophy for its Cybertruck fiasco.
Other than that I do not have the knowledge to track their production promises going back over ten years. However here we are over one decade later they still struggle to turn a substantial steady profit which has only been a couple years.

Also their production and sales growth has not been close to what they told the public around 2022

I dont understand the "gander" line, I guess that is a west coast thing. So not sure ..
But the OP says a 28% increase in global EV sales this year. Even though in my mind only the USA matters. We are a unique country.
However 2025 Tesla is not participating in that sales increase. Their sales are in the toilet and down, not up.
I stated many times I have nothing at all against Tesla, except the truth which can get skewed in forums and media at times.

"Tesla sales plunged 13% in the first three months of this year, the largest drop in deliveries in its history, as backlash against CEO Elon Musk and growing competition took a large bite out of demand for its EVs."
https://www.cnn.com/2025/04/02/business/tesla-sales/index.html

I am the OP.

The growth statement was America only and not so much any praise of Telsa or any brand specifically, but data to demonstrate the narrative that EV's in general are shrinking is simply false.

I'm from the midwest and I grew up hearing the saying "whats good for the goose is good for the gander".

Ive got problem with both of these manufacturers as well as many others.

It's rare for GM to make a product almost no one wants like the cybertruck, which is what you get when dont stand up to the boss.

Im still reeling that GM's core market of small block trucks and SUV's is suffering an enormous recall.
If GM cant make a small block that stays together they are in big trouble.

Its true tesla is not growing their sales they still hold the vast majority of the market share although this will shrink over time.
Its also true they were in the middle of a changeover of their core auto the model Y, and although the new one is an upgrade they may never return to the market position they once held.

Outside of the 9000LB truck Im disappointed in the ultiums.

We were promised and waited for cutting edge EV tech, and what we got out of GM isn't equivalent to a 14 year old Tesla.

 

[alarmguy]

I am the OP.

The growth statement was America only and not so much any praise of Telsa or any brand specifically, but data to demonstrate the narrative that EV's in general are shrinking is simply false.

I'm from the midwest and I grew up hearing the saying "whats good for the goose is good for the gander".

Ive got problem with both of these manufacturers as well as many others.

It's rare for GM to make a product almost no one wants like the cybertruck, which is what you get when dont stand up to the boss.

Im still reeling that GM's core market of small block trucks and SUV's is suffering an enormous recall.
If GM cant make a small block that stays together they are in big trouble.

Its true tesla is not growing their sales they still hold the vast majority of the market share although this will shrink over time.
Its also true they were in the middle of a changeover of their core auto the model Y, and although the new one is an upgrade they may never return to the market position they once held.

Outside of the 9000LB truck Im disappointed in the ultiums.

We were promised and waited for cutting edge EV tech, and what we got out of GM isn't equivalent to a 14 year old Tesla.

Just so we’re clear I never presented a narrative that electric vehicle sales are shrinking. You may be aware of this. I’m not sure.

Tesla’s market share has been shrinking enormously and is currently taking place

Your opinion of GM is just that. A three year recall for a certain engine is not unheard It is not going to put them out of business . Though I’m glad I got a six
The fact is GM electric vehicle sales are growing rapidly and taking market share from Tesla because they produce SUV style cars that Americans want is my opinion

The Midwest, now I get it I may have heard that in some western movies!

 

[UncleDave]

Just so we’re clear I never presented a narrative that electric vehicle sales are shrinking. You may be aware of this. I’m not sure.

Tesla’s market share has been shrinking enormously and is currently taking place

Your opinion of GM is just that. A three year recall for a certain engine is not unheard It is not going to put them out of business . Though I’m glad I got a six
The fact is GM electric vehicle sales are growing rapidly and taking market share from Tesla because they produce SUV style cars that Americans want is my opinion

The Midwest, now I get it I may have heard that in some western movies!

I wasn't addressing you specifically on the " shrinking" narrative, but some grab any headline about any pullback in the sector and gleefully position the entire market as shrinking or dying or even dead.

Teslas market share could only shrink, that was a mathematical certainly, but that does not mean they cannot grow.
(A big if made worse by their global representative)

Market share by itself is a poor metric of success. One can be a global market share leader and still go bankrupt -like GM did.

It's not my opinion that an enormous engine recall will affect GM's bottom line.
I would agree it wont put them out of business - but it will not help them in any way, the question is how much harm will it bring?

I wish to see all American companies succeed against global rivals vs. many that would love to see Tesla fail.

 

[alarmguy]

I wasn't addressing you specifically on the " shrinking" narrative, but some grab any headline about any pullback in the sector and gleefully position the entire market as shrinking or dying or even dead.

Teslas market share could only shrink, that was a mathematical certainly, but that does not mean they cannot grow.
(A big if made worse by their global representative)

Market share by itself is a poor metric of success. One can be a global market share leader and still go bankrupt -like GM did.

It's not my opinion that an enormous engine recall will affect GM's bottom line.
I would agree it wont put them out of business - but it will not help them in any way, the question is how much harm will it bring?

I wish to see all American companies succeed against global rivals vs. many that would love to see Tesla fail.

The engine recall is to examine the engine and replace if necessary. It’s not going to put a dent in profits as much as it might seem in the media.
That’s my opinion Gerald motors is alive and doing very well

I only reference market share because when Tesla was the darling of the industry, even in this forum, the word market share was beat into my head with almost every post maybe we should skip the market chair and just figure out why sales are declining while GM is growing

 

[UncleDave]

The engine recall is to examine the engine and replace if necessary. It’s not going to put a dent in profits as much as it might seem in the media.
That’s my opinion Gerald motors is alive and doing very well

I only reference market share because when Tesla was the darling of the industry, even in this forum, the word market share was beat into my head with almost every post maybe we should skip the market chair and just figure out why sales are declining while GM is growing

Tesla has two excuses that hold water. The rest of them are just that, excuses.
1. Model changeover, and leadership. they fixed one of these.
The new Y is now shipping. Everything but the performance version.

2. They really need to send Elon packing, which I doubt they will do and this could forever hobble them.
I thought it was impossible to dislike him more, but he found a way to do just that.

On Gm

Their market share is growing, but it's still tiny.
It's easy to grow starting from nothing, especially with some of the lease deals I've seen.
The real test is Year on Year quarter on quarter growth. Year 3 specifically.

GM needs to get with the aluminum program and put these cars on a diet, and at the same time fix their sowftware and HVAC problems as well as put a competitive charge curve into the cars.

These cars have bigger batteries than their competition and have to because they deliver lower MPKW on the whole.

The cars look great though and for some thats enough.

 

[Torrid]

Still struggling but the stock price doesnt care! Go figure I certainly cannot other than suggest it's a short term trading stock since the price is now only coming close to matching or beating its high from 3 years ago.

"Tesla Model Y Assembly Workers Told To Stay Home For A Week"​

"Tesla’s demand issues seem to have taken a turn for the worse, with its most successful product being the latest victim. Some assembly workers responsible for building the Model Y crossover–the brand’s best-selling model–were told to stay home for the week of Memorial Day, according to several employees quoted by Business Insider."

Source =
https://insideevs.com/news/759265/tesla-model-y-cybertruck-line-workers-stay-home/

I thought this new Y was supposed to be in huge demand? Whoops. There's 17 in stock between the two delivery centers I used for my cars. That's not a good sign.

 

[UncleDave]

I thought this new Y was supposed to be in huge demand? Whoops. There's 17 in stock between the two delivery centers I used for my cars. That's not a good sign.

I just ran a build on a new Y and it said 3 weeks?

What I really like is the Lucid Air Gravity.

 

[alarmguy]

Tesla has two excuses that hold water. The rest of them are just that, excuses.
1. Model changeover, and leadership. they fixed one of these.
The new Y is now shipping. Everything but the performance version.

2. They really need to send Elon packing, which I doubt they will do and this could forever hobble them.
I thought it was impossible to dislike him more, but he found a way to do just that.

On Gm

Their market share is growing, but it's still tiny.
It's easy to grow starting from nothing, especially with some of the lease deals I've seen.
The real test is Year on Year quarter on quarter growth. Year 3 specifically.

GM needs to get with the aluminum program and put these cars on a diet, and at the same time fix their sowftware and HVAC problems as well as put a competitive charge curve into the cars.

These cars have bigger batteries than their competition and have to because they deliver lower MPKW on the whole.

The cars look great though and for some thats enough.

For sure, their EV market share is tiny but growing significantly where it stops we do not know.
GM already knows that Americans are not as accepting of batteryelectric vehicles as much as everybody was promoting just three or four years ago.

 

[alarmguy]

I thought this new Y was supposed to be in huge demand? Whoops. There's 17 in stock between the two delivery centers I used for my cars. That's not a good sign.

Everyone in this forum can always count on your honest real life experiences regarding Tesla.
It’s truly a help listening to someone who gives such balanced appraisals of a vehicle.

It actually adds credibility to the Tesla nameplate knowing how good the good is and the bad not so bad

 

[Torrid]

I just ran a build on a new Y and it said 3 weeks?

What I really like is the Lucid Air Gravity.

If you order one built, that sounds about right. You can search prebuilt inventory on the website too. I ordered the Model 3, but I bought my Y from inventory so I didn’t have to wait longer for it. There’s nearly every possible variation of the Y Long Range available in my area between colors and wheel choices.

 

[Torrid]

Everyone in this forum can always count on your honest real life experiences regarding Tesla.
It’s truly a help listening to someone who gives such balanced appraisals of a vehicle.

It actually adds credibility to the Tesla nameplate knowing how good the good is and the bad not so bad

I just don’t think it does any good to wax on just because I like a brand. I always buy different brands so I’ve seen the differences in software application. Tesla’s software is pretty good, but there’s definitely some issues that come across gimmicky where they could have made improvements.

It’s definitely easy to use above all else, but if anything the simplicity builds a bit too much confidence.

I have my thoughts on the Y not selling as well as they seemed to project and I don’t think the car is the issue, it’s all the other stuff going on now.

 

[UncleDave]

If you order one built, that sounds about right. You can search prebuilt inventory on the website too. I ordered the Model 3, but I bought my Y from inventory so I didn’t have to wait longer for it. There’s nearly every possible variation of the Y Long Range available in my area between colors and wheel choices.

I just checked and do indeed find a bunch of grey AWD units when I checked.

I clicked white paint and it was 3-4 weeks. All my vehicles are white - only way to keep them cool.

The cheap one (RWD) is also harder to get.

 

[buster]

GM already knows that Americans are not as accepting of batteryelectric vehicles as much as everybody was promoting just three or four years ago.

I would expect battery tech to keep improving which will make EVs more attractive. I think market will remain mixed for quite some time, but you really never know.

GM is making their own batteries.

https://www.wired.com/story/gms-new-battery-tech-could-be-a-breakthrough-for-affordable-evs/

 

[Torrid]

I just checked and do indeed find a bunch of grey AWD units when I checked.

I clicked white paint and it was 3-4 weeks. All my vehicles are white - only way to keep them cool.

The cheap one (RWD) is also harder to get.

I don’t think a single RWD has been delivered yet. I’m pretty sure they just allowed it for order last week.

There are two white ones available here. The only color I didn’t see available here was black.

 

[JeffKeryk]

EV sales growth continues to take market share from ICE, but things are changing...
As the tax credits expire, the market will have to adjust accordingly. Tesla can absorb some of the lost revenue; it has to hurt. But GM and others will be in deep yogurt because they already lose money on every EV they sell.

Car manufacturers have seen cost to manufacture, their variable cost, rise due to inflated material prices. Certainly some are affected more than others.

Interesting times ahead...

 

[alarmguy]

EV sales growth continues to take market share from ICE, but things are changing...
As the tax credits expire, the market will have to adjust accordingly. Tesla can absorb some of the lost revenue; it has to hurt. But GM and others will be in deep yogurt because they already lose money on every EV they sell.

Car manufacturers have seen cost to manufacture, their variable cost, rise due to inflated material prices. Certainly some are affected more than others.

Interesting times ahead...

General Motors might disagree with you.
If you think about it, it’s amazing that it took them just a few years to become profitable on a product.
It took Tesla well over a decade to become profitable.

And since GM has two types of propulsion systems, gasoline, and electric in all this time, they have always been profitable while developing the electric vehicle line.
Just as Mary has said, they have reached a milestone on time in 2025, actually ahead of time she said the EV line would become profitable in 2025. I put her credibility when she makes a statement far above Elon Musk.

No disrespect, but you’re making predictions based on your feelings, not reality. Right now, Tesla is suffering dearly.

“GM EVs Are Profitable At Last”​

Source =
https://www.topspeed.com/gm-ev-profitability/

 

[Torrid]

General Motors might disagree with you.
If you think about it, it’s amazing that it took them just a few years to become profitable on a product.
It took Tesla well over a decade to become profitable.

And since GM has two types of propulsion systems, gasoline, and electric in all this time, they have always been profitable while developing the electric vehicle line.
Just as Mary has said, they have reached a milestone on time in 2025, actually ahead of time she said the EV line would become profitable in 2025. I put her credibility when she makes a statement far above Elon Musk.

No disrespect, but you’re making predictions based on your feelings, not reality. Right now, Tesla is suffering dearly.

“GM EVs Are Profitable At Last”​

Source =
https://www.topspeed.com/gm-ev-profitability/

At this point I'm more likely to buy a GM EV than a Tesla the next time around. They're not my style performance wise to be honest, but I started out with GMs and I think it's only a matter of time before they make the right vehicle for me. The Blazer SS is a maybe for me, but I have no plans to buy anything else for awhile. I asked my wife and she said if she was buying right now, she would want a Ford Mustang Mach-E GT.

There's just more options available now. If we had gotten the ID.4 we initially ordered I don't think I would have considered Tesla. We wrote off Tesla at first, but my wife was determined to get an EV and only Tesla could get us a test drive. She was sold immediately 5 minutes into the test drive. I didn't even drive it then. I very specifically remember the conversation being that Elon was a tool, but the car was good. I had no interest in owning an EV at the time even though I liked the idea of an EV and it was her decision anyway. She was at least interested in the Toyota BZ4X, but they couldn't get us a test drive either. We know how much of a mess those have been. If we had gotten the ID.4 I would have bought a new Golf R at the end of last year instead of the Model Y Performance. I won't say I was anti Tesla back then, I just didn't really care for Elon's social media outreach. It's only gotten worse, but I think after really experiencing the cars they speak for themselves, Cybertruck not included as far as I'm concerned.

 

[JeffKeryk]

General Motors might disagree with you.
If you think about it, it’s amazing that it took them just a few years to become profitable on a product.
It took Tesla well over a decade to become profitable.

And since GM has two types of propulsion systems, gasoline, and electric in all this time, they have always been profitable while developing the electric vehicle line.
Just as Mary has said, they have reached a milestone on time in 2025, actually ahead of time she said the EV line would become profitable in 2025. I put her credibility when she makes a statement far above Elon Musk.

No disrespect, but you’re making predictions based on your feelings, not reality. Right now, Tesla is suffering dearly.

“GM EVs Are Profitable At Last”​

Source =
https://www.topspeed.com/gm-ev-profitability/

AG, GM is not profitable in their EV business; they have never claimed to be. I mentioned "variable cost" in my post in reference to CEO Barra's announcement.
Couple that with the recent material cost inflation and the loss of business in China and they may now be underwater in their Cost to Manufacture which is a component of the margin calculation.

Not sure if you are familiar with Cost Accounting, but CEO Barra claimed "variable profitability" which does not include all costs involved to deliver product. It is good to hear GM's staggering investments in the EV business are starting to pay off. It is a huge milestone.

I would, and do, find it interesting to see what costs go into GM, and others, cost calculation. I can tell you the resulting numbers can be misleading without detail.

We know Tesla includes the sale of credits to other companies in their profit-loss numbers. Without this knowledge, one might be led to believe that their profit-loss is solely based on product sales, which would be incorrect and misleading. My question to CEO Barra is why don't you break out your EV business (ala CEO Farley) in detail instead of burying it in the overall numbers? Citing "variable profit" is an important milestone but is also a play on words to the uninformed.

Varaible Cost, aka Cost to Manufacture generally includes direct material, labor and overhead. It probably does not include warranty/recall cost, royalty costs, factory fixed costs, equipment costs, etc.

GM started its EV business in 1990 with the EV1. The newer cars like the Bolt benefited from other platforms. Using parts from other platforms reduces development time and cost.