2025 so far EV sales up 28%

[JeffKeryk]

Oh, they’ll definitely become profitable on their electric vehicles in a much faster time period than Tesla did.
After all, they are already profitable on the electric vehicles they turn out, but not yet on the investment of the electric vehicle. Still light years ahead of what Tesla did.
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a63608612/gm-stops-losing-money-on-evs/
But to an investor, who cares? GM is cranking out higher profits than Tesla can dream of for the last decade.
After all GM manufactures automobiles. I don’t think right now anybody knows what direction Tesla is going in.

Going forward as an investment, my money is on TSLA. Even with the YTD pains, I've still nearly doubled my investment.
Now, if I had bought stock instead of the car in Dec 2018... 15x the investment! Sheesh!

I wish GM and the other car companies well in their EV endeavours. I am dying to see the Neue Klasse which is scheduled for later this year... A purpose built BMW EV; cool!

 

[02SE]

Do you have the 2025 Model Y? Do you have to be in the waiting list to order?

'25 Model S Plaid. I waited a couple weeks to take delivery.

I'll reevaluate whether to keep it, when it's a year old (I use it strictly for my consulting business). Or sooner, if there are any issues.

 

[ME_Andy]

I think the stock pop was due to robotaxis being on schedule.

 

[UncleDave]

Investors want to see profits and GM is delivering.
As spectators, we want to see breakdowns of specific model cars, they can do what they want with that but the bottom line is the bottom line

One thing for sure that I’m willing to bet is they will be showing a profit about 10 to 12 years ahead of what it took Tesla to break even on their electric vehicles. GMs CEO is a pretty standup lady and she was predicting as soon as 2025.

At the same time, its profits are hands over feet higher than Tesla for the last decade. So until proven.otherwise we have to give GM the benefit of the doubt. Where Tesla for unknown reasons hides their USA sales data and has not lived up to their statements on growth and profitability. Not even close.

Just playing devils advocate

I can only hope the General can catch up and beat tesla and take back what rightfully should have been theirs all along - but the architecture they just delivered after a seriously long wait is more disappointing than Water World.

They both shoot off their mouth and underdeliver, the difference is GM lis likable.
I didnt think Elon could get more bad press but he amazed even himself in this last round.

We dont need either to tell us what they sell where as numerous third parties get all the registration data and rat everyone out.

 

[dogememe]

I can only hope the General can catch up and beat tesla and take back what rightfully should have been theirs all along - but the architecture they just delivered after a seriously long wait is more disappointing than Water World.

They both shoot off their mouth and underdeliver, the difference is GM lis likable.
I didnt think Elon could get more bad press but he amazed even himself in this last round.

We dont need either to tell us what they sell where as numerous third parties get all the registration data and rat everyone out.

What is disappointing about Ultium? It is fine. LFP versions are coming which will further lower costs. The expensive vehicles can charge super fast while the mainstream stuff charges good enough. Yes it’s a little on the heavy side but long term the batteries will be repairable as they can be disassembled.

If Ultium was junk I wouldn’t have two of them in my driveway.

 

[Torrid]

I flat out love our M3P; 100% satisfied. I would buy another tomorrow. On the other hand, I find the Model Y Juniper kinda ugly having seen a number of them on the road. Wifey will keep her Lex RX...

100%. I'm glad I didn't wait. I'm not loving the Juniper redesign, plus I would have still been waiting for the Performance even now.

 

[Torrid]

Going forward as an investment, my money is on TSLA. Even with the YTD pains, I've still nearly doubled my investment.
Now, if I had bought stock instead of the car in Dec 2018... 15x the investment! Sheesh!

I wish GM and the other car companies well in their EV endeavours. I am dying to see the Neue Klasse which is scheduled for later this year... A purpose built BMW EV; cool!
View attachment 275158

I'm sure the BMW will be awesome and likely/unfortunately $80k+. It's not that it wouldn't be worth that, but to put the miles I do on a depreciating asset that depreciates as much as an EV, I think that puts it in the "do not buy" category for me.

I think as long as Tesla keeps winning the value for money category for EVs, I won't be buying anything else regardless of some of the flaws I've pointed out with them. Even the Hyundai Ioniq 5 N being nearly $70k doesn't make sense for 20k miles a year. My use makes leasing unattractive for my mileage costs. I plan to drive my Model Y Performance until the battery is no more well outside the warranty unless something amazing pops up at a price that I can't say no to. Of course I reserve the right to change my mind at any step.

 

[alarmguy]

I can only hope the General can catch up and beat tesla and take back what rightfully should have been theirs all along - but the architecture they just delivered after a seriously long wait is more disappointing than Water World.

They both shoot off their mouth and underdeliver, the difference is GM lis likable.
I didnt think Elon could get more bad press but he amazed even himself in this last round.

We dont need either to tell us what they sell where as numerous third parties get all the registration data and rat everyone out.

All good, as long as GM stays #1 in sales like they have for 60 years I’m ok. Meaning it doesn’t matter to me if they beat Tesla in EVs as long as they hold the #1 title for vehicles. However I’m not a loyal customer to any brand if someone produces something that better suits me.

For you, you dont need Tesla to tell you and that is ok.
However, it's the underdog who hides their numbers. Why? easy, every quarter when they release their sales numbers, they do not want their USA business to be compared with GM and Ford. It's that simple, it's done intentionally as it will show how little they sell compared to the others. Sure after market companies report the numbers but we are talking about the quarterly conference call from the company itself. They dont have to get into sales comparison with the big guys.

Another example in another thread would be Harley Davidson and Indian motorcycles. Indian just reports North American sales which the company is in the toilet.

It's all good, but we know this is intentional by Tesla. Very simple, they hide the number then they dont have to discuss. it.

 

[cptbarkey]

Musk's role in the government audit and departmental restructuring will be tapering off at the beginning of summer.

Of all the lies that has been publicly spoken, this one is rather loud and obvious.

 

[97prizm]

Well, Tesla is where Musk's money is. And his Mea Culpa talk gave TSLA a jump. Tesla makes the best EVs and is the most innovative car company.

Tesla has been close to demise since before I bought our 2018 Mid Range; that hasn't changed. Yet they are still, by far, the most valuable car company in the world.

The future? Time will tell.

I would say innovative to an extent. Alot of Teslas engineering is just designed to be overly complicated and Musk claims "It's an upgrade" Unfortunately things like having to remove a panel under a piece of plastic and then pull a wire to Escape from the back of a model y isn't innovative it's dangerous. That's not intuitive and unnecessary. The fact that you had to buy an aftermarket turn signal is crazy to me. It's unfortunate that it couldn't have been wired into the vehicle somehow. Value is only what you place on an object. Tesla is quickly losing its luster.

 

[UncleDave]

What is disappointing about Ultium? It is fine. LFP versions are coming which will further lower costs. The expensive vehicles can charge super fast while the mainstream stuff charges good enough. Yes it’s a little on the heavy side but long term the batteries will be repairable as they can be disassembled.

If Ultium was junk I wouldn’t have two of them in my driveway.

I wouldn't go so far as to say it's junk.

It's heavy, as much as 1000LB per vehicle heavier.

It's 10-80 time is mid pack at best making its travel time uncompetitive.
It gets whomped in travel time metrics by both Hyundai and Tesla (leaving porsche out)
We've seen hints of impaired hot weather charging (turn off AC for consistent fast charging) , but need more data.

Its electronic architecture is a mix of component level firmware and OTA. It's not a unified control system and its packaging is old school so you are missing things like a frunk in AWD models.

After all the promises, the waiting, and all the talk from guys like Lutz about how nobody had any advantage and everything was going to be equal its not.

It's just not class leading in any way except maybe being the cheapest 300 mile car.

The truck is probably the leading vehicle in the lineup offering a truly unique range under load.

 

[97prizm]

I can only hope the General can catch up and beat tesla and take back what rightfully should have been theirs all along - but the architecture they just delivered after a seriously long wait is more disappointing than Water World.

They both shoot off their mouth and underdeliver, the difference is GM lis likable.
I didnt think Elon could get more bad press but he amazed even himself in this last round.

We dont need either to tell us what they sell where as numerous third parties get all the registration data and rat everyone out.

If one of the directors at GM so many years ago didn't go nuts for hydrogen Tesla maybe wouldn't exist. The GM EV1 was out what a decade plus before Tesla even was a concept. GM can really shine when they buckle down. Look at the new ZR-1.

 

[JeffKeryk]

100%. I'm glad I didn't wait. I'm not loving the Juniper redesign, plus I would have still been waiting for the Performance even now.

The looks don't work so well for me; I was also not a big fan of the earlier cars. But from an overall standpoint, the new Teslas are on another level. That's the bottom line. Our Highland is a much better car than our '18 Mid-Range.

I bet new Model Y Juniper owners will flat-out love their cars.

Just my 2 cents...

 

[UncleDave]

If one of the directors at GM so many years ago didn't go nuts for hydrogen Tesla maybe wouldn't exist. The GM EV1 was out what a decade plus before Tesla even was a concept. GM can really shine when they buckle down. Look at the new ZR-1.

I agree about the ev1 and where GM could have gone. Every studio head had an EV 1 when they came out and they all looked them. The held view at the time is that with 200 miles of range it could change the world.
I've repeated for years shortsightedness at GM is why Teslas exists at all.

That said starting a ground up company allowed them to do things that would just never happen at any existing place.
Sandy Munroe talks a lot about how working holistically removed the department based thinking that plagues the old guard.

Love the new vette.

 

[Brons2]

Tesla is quickly losing its luster.

They're still a status symbol item for all the India tech bros around me, but I wonder if tech visas get banned, will they still be? A ban on tech visas would disproportionately impact people from India.

It's something that Musk is against because he needs engineers for his businesses, and we aren't producing enough domestically. My own personal preference is to go ahead and ban the visas, but that's for selfish reasons, i.e., the pay in my field is likely to increase if we cut off this supply of engineers from other countries.

 

[UncleDave]

All good, as long as GM stays #1 in sales like they have for 60 years I’m ok. Meaning it doesn’t matter to me if they beat Tesla in EVs as long as they hold the #1 title for vehicles. However I’m not a loyal customer to any brand if someone produces something that better suits me.

For you, you dont need Tesla to tell you and that is ok.
However, it's the underdog who hides their numbers. Why? easy, every quarter when they release their sales numbers, they do not want their USA business to be compared with GM and Ford. It's that simple, it's done intentionally as it will show how little they sell compared to the others. Sure after market companies report the numbers but we are talking about the quarterly conference call from the company itself. They dont have to get into sales comparison with the big guys.

Another example in another thread would be Harley Davidson and Indian motorcycles. Indian just reports North American sales which the company is in the toilet.

It's all good, but we know this is intentional by Tesla. Very simple, they hide the number then they dont have to discuss. it.

Personally I dont care that much about stuff I can learn from 3rd parties, but I get how some people do.

I worry about stuff I cant otherwise find out about without direct disclosure.

The General is hiding his numbers.

Why not be transparent like Ford is and show us the P&L for the electric division so shareholders can see how well they executed ?

 

[buster]

What are the negatives of buying a used Tesla? Looks like they only give you a 1 year warranty, so that's not great. The performance though for the money is top. $27k for a car that does 0-60 in 3.5 seconds.

https://www.tesla.com/my/order/5YJYGDEF0MF305203?titleStatus=used&redirect=no#overview

 

[alarmguy]

Personally I dont care that much about stuff I can learn from 3rd parties, but I get how some people do.

I worry about stuff I cant otherwise find out about without direct disclosure.

The General is hiding his numbers.

Why not be transparent like Ford is and show us the P&L for the electric division so shareholders can see how well they executed ?

I find it hard to trust a company like Tesla, since it’s inception has never met a goal or a target
It operates under a veil of secrecy and cannot even disclose the USA sales numbers.
The fact of the matter is they hide it and that’s why they don’t disclose it

 

[UncleDave]

I find it hard to trust a company like Tesla, since it’s inception has never met a goal or a target
It operates under a veil of secrecy and cannot even disclose the USA sales numbers.
The fact of the matter is they hide it and that’s why they don’t disclose it

Has either company ever met a date target on an EV?

I find equal distaste for the gander as I do the goose.

 

[JeffKeryk]

I'd buy a used Tesla in a heartbeat. Whoever got our '18 Mid Range got a great car. I wish I would have kept it or given it to a friend or family.