2021 Tesla Model S, is it now the best Tesla choice?

[Cujet]

We've been so conditioned to believe that newer is better, we think that a modern version of a 10 year old model is somehow substandard.

I've mentioned this many times, but our high end car fleet may be full of the latest and greatest Mercedes products, but as a driving enthusiast, I'd much rather drive a Tesla. Just a quick look the suspension design of the Model S and Model 3 should bring up thoughts of race-car like unequal length control arms.

So, just what is it about the other cars that you find so much better? Fit and finish really does not matter all that much. Interior creature comforts?

Let's call out the real problem. Tesla fudges it's range numbers (hint, they use a different CF, or correction factor) and real world high speed highway range is 200 miles, at which point you'd best start looking for a charging station.

 

[Job]

No more $7500 tax credit and those rich folks don't seem to stop buying Teslas. It is more of a game for a really rich person to get tax incentives and rebates of such small, to them, amounts. It's like getting excited about $7 worth of free shipping to a more average person. I like the WA idea of limiting rebates to under 45k sales price. This means lower cost ev's will be bought more. The rebate money comes from average people the most, so why should they be funding a wealthy person's bank account? You don't need my help to buy a luxury car, buy it on your own.

 

[dareo]

I support the EV tax credits regardless of a persons wealth. It's not about helping them afford or not afford, its to steer them into the EV. A rich person could buy a high end gas luxury car OR a high end EV. The fuel cost of operating a $100k vehicle does not matter to those who can afford it. The more EVs the better. It will advance our power grid, solar installs, ect. I know someone who got a tax credit on two Chev Volts. They could afford it either way but the credit pushed them into the EV space for the first, and subsequently second purchase.

 

[dareo]

I guess the Model 3 just got an update to include more range, heat pump hvac, same price in USA. Some Euro countries got a price cut on the 3.

Model 3 Performance now 3.1 0-60, 315 miles, pretty good for $54,990.

 

[JeffKeryk]

I guess the Model 3 just got an update to include more range, heat pump hvac, same price in USA. Some Euro countries got a price cut on the 3.

Model 3 Performance now 3.1 0-60, 315 miles, pretty good for $54,990.

With that car you could make life miserable for any Porsche, Vette, Beemer, etc.
Or you could buy the Standard Range Plus for $39,490 and have almost as much fun.

 

[Skippy722]

We've been so conditioned to believe that newer is better, we think that a modern version of a 10 year old model is somehow substandard.

This! Anyone else does it an no one bats an eye... Tesla does it and it’s a problem, I don’t get it. They still look great and perform great.

 

[2EHA]

This! Anyone else does it an no one bats an eye... Tesla does it and it’s a problem, I don’t get it. They still look great and perform great.

This isn’t the 80s or 90s where you can let that stuff fly and it certainly isn’t a legacy vehicle that coexists with the latest and greatest like for example the Ram Classic.

The current Model S is still at the top of the Tesla lineup and to most people it is completely indiscernible from the launch model.

 

[Skippy722]

This isn’t the 80s or 90s where you can let that stuff fly and it certainly isn’t a legacy vehicle that coexists with the latest and greatest like for example the Ram Classic.

The current Model S is still at the top of the Tesla lineup and to most people it is completely indiscernible from the launch model.

I agree it could probably use a facelift (and obviously QC improvements), but they still catch my eye in a good way. I think they still look great, compared to some other cars that look incredibly dated compared to their newer counterparts, like a 2010 Dodge Charger vs a 2020.

 

[Jetronic]

isn't that the whole point when a manufacturer brings out a new model? make the outgoing model look instantly **** and outdated?

 

[Skippy722]

isn't that the whole point when a manufacturer brings out a new model? make the outgoing model look instantly **** and outdated?

Some age well, others not so much. Even if Tesla announced a facelift or complete new redesign of the Model S tomorrow, I think the current one will still look pretty nice.

 

[UncleDave]

I think the model S is still the only car in the US with an aluminum frame.

Model 3's got bumps today.
LR dual motor is at 350 and 0-60 dropped to 4.1
Performance is over 300 and now 3.1
Nicer center console.

 

[JeffKeryk]

The Model S and X are not Tesla's future according to Musk and Tesla's Mission Statement. These cars are stepping stones "to accelerate the advent of sustainable transport by bringing compelling mass market electric cars to market as soon as possible."
The expensive cars are learning vheicles. Musk builds the super fast versions to prove EVs can compete with any other car.
The Model 3 and now Y get them closer to their goal. Owners flat out love them.
Early adopters, like me, are supporting Tesla's efforts. I know I paid a lot for a car I didn't need.
If and when a viable $25K car materializes, watch out. Tesla just might realize their stated goal.
In the mean time, Tesla is already the most valuable car company in the world. No small feat.

 

[Wolf359]

In the mean time, Tesla is already the most valuable car company in the world. No small feat.

Ever wonder how it will end? Their PE ratio is in the 300 range and most car companies are in the 30 range.

 

[JeffKeryk]

Ever wonder how it will end? Their PE ratio is in the 300 range and most car companies are in the 30 range.

I bought TSLA, if that answers your question. I got sick and tired of watching all those gains pass me by.
Having said that, none of us know, but so far the naysayers (aka short sellers) have been painfully wrong.
Where are you on this?

 

[Wolf359]

I bought TSLA, if that answers your question. I got sick and tired of watching all those gains pass me by.
Having said that, none of us know, but so far the naysayers (aka short sellers) have been painfully wrong.
Where are you on this?

I don't really do stocks anymore. Got burned a few too many times. Just mutual fund. I'm in the Warren Buffett camp which says don't buy anything you don't understand. Don't understand how the stock makes any sense. This is probably part of the greater fool theory, just don't want to be there when that ends.

 

[DwightFrye]

Tesla has the available cash/capital coming in to build several state of the art manufacturing facilities that will only build their vehicles and batteries. Every other major automaker in the world is still building ICE vehicles, many if not most using outdated production techniques, and is trying to compete in the EV market as well. Where are they going to get the capital to build competitive manufacturing facilities ?

Ford & GM are practically bankrupt and given how much more in debt that the country is due to the stimulus spending due to Covid 19, I don't think the taxpayers will bail them out again.

Check some of the Youtube videos that show Tesla's manufacturing facilities and assembly lines. They are incredibly impressive with the use of robotics and advanced techniques. Are there anything similar in the automotive industry ? Maybe. But for most if not all of the automakers to even come close they are going to have to find Aladdin's treasure cave full of gold to fund such facilities and it will likely take them twice as long to build such plants. And in the meantime, Tesla will still be years ahead of them.

I was a little harsh on my opinion of the styling of the Model 3 and Model Y, I think just a few styling tweaks could make a lot of difference. Like a fake radiator grill or intake to make the Model 3 look less like actor Charles Dierkop

 

[JeffKeryk]

I don't really do stocks anymore. Got burned a few too many times. Just mutual fund. I'm in the Warren Buffett camp which says don't buy anything you don't understand. Don't understand how the stock makes any sense. This is probably part of the greater fool theory, just don't want to be there when that ends.

I don't buy individual stocks either, TSLA is the exception. Perhaps it will be in the S&P soon, then most of us will be owners.
Since I bought 100 shares at $360, the stock has been positive. I will wait at least a year to sell, to take advantage of capital gains.
I am guessing it will hit $500 mid 2021. Of course guessing is a lousy strategy, right?
We will just have to see. All good. Wish me luck!

 

[Wolf359]

Tesla has the available cash/capital coming in to build several state of the art manufacturing facilities that will only build their vehicles and batteries. Every other major automaker in the world is still building ICE vehicles, many if not most using outdated production techniques, and is trying to compete in the EV market as well. Where are they going to get the capital to build competitive manufacturing facilities ?

Ford & GM are practically bankrupt and given how much more in debt that the country is due to the stimulus spending due to Covid 19, I don't think the taxpayers will bail them out again.

Check some of the Youtube videos that show Tesla's manufacturing facilities and assembly lines. They are incredibly impressive with the use of robotics and advanced techniques. Are there anything similar in the automotive industry ? Maybe. But for most if not all of the automakers to even come close they are going to have to find Aladdin's treasure cave full of gold to fund such facilities and it will likely take them twice as long to build such plants. And in the meantime, Tesla will still be years ahead of them.

I was a little harsh on my opinion of the styling of the Model 3 and Model Y, I think just a few styling tweaks could make a lot of difference. Like a fake radiator grill or intake to make the Model 3 look less like actor Charles Dierkop

I think you forget that many auto manufacturers redo their lineup every 3-5 years so that their factories get reconfigured to build the new models every few years all the time. There's also other big auto makers out there like Toyota which has been making hybrids for a while. And they can get capital the same way Tesla raised 5 billion, put more stock on the market. That happens all the time. Or they might just do a line of credit, borrowing is really cheap now.

 

[JeffKeryk]

I think you forget that many auto manufacturers redo their lineup every 3-5 years so that their factories get reconfigured to build the new models every few years all the time. There's also other big auto makers out there like Toyota which has been making hybrids for a while. And they can get capital the same way Tesla raised 5 billion, put more stock on the market. That happens all the time. Or they might just do a line of credit, borrowing is really cheap now.

The "3-5 years" is a key point. Tesla does not have car years in the traditional sense.
The company improves their cars constantly; a huge advantage. Changes are enabled by the production line design.
Sandy Munro said Tesla is at least ten years ahead of the competition for its method of applying improvements on the fly to production cars.
Owner's cars get upgrades over the air due to their software based architecture.

These cars are different, this company is different.

 

[Wolf359]

The "3-5 years" is a key point. Tesla does not have car years in the traditional sense.
The company improves their cars constantly; a huge advantage. Changes are enabled by the production line design.
Sandy Munro said Tesla is at least ten years ahead of the competition for its method of applying improvements on the fly to production cars.
Owner's cars get upgrades over the air due to their software based architecture.

These cars are different, this company is different.

I'm not sure that it's that big of an advantage. New changes are made every year to a car. It's just that they do a total body platform/face lift change every 3-5 years. But year to year, you always have changes to a car. That's why they always ask you what year the car is. Sometimes they do mid year changes in which case it's important to know the date of manufacture. Like the infamous balance shaft problem on Mercedes engines, at one point in the middle of the production year they changed the part so you could figure out by the serial number of the engine if you had the bad part or not.

Two major things that I like about regular car companies is that there's a dealer network so they compete on prices. You're stuck with list price. You can also get repair manuals and 3rd party manufacturers also make parts for a car that has some volume. There's a very limited amount of parts available on rockauto for Tesla. For instance headlamps are a typical crash part, don't see those on there. You're basically stuck with the manufacturer who can charge you whatever they like.