1998 HD Sportster 1200S

[Zedhed]

Look guys -- if I have "alienated" anyone with my comments, I apologize. But you have to understand that not everyone here is going to have your same attitude toward motorcycles. Yes, the negative comments toward "some" riders are unwarranted, but others are deserved. Some guys just want to come here and hear others validate their prejudices. Here's and example:

If we are going to objectively evaluate the merits of motorcycle lubricants, how in the world do you justify using Redline or Motul oil in a TC-88 engine? When some of us try to explain how those engines have nearly all the moving parts running in roller or ball bearings and no shared-oil transmission thus no need for such expensive and esoteric oils, we are either ignored or branded as "bashers."

Whether you like to admit it or not, many HD riders have a "chip" on their shoulders simply because of what they see other like riders do.

The motorcycling world has many dimensions, everything from moto-cross, enduro, cross-country/desert racing to trials riding to long-distance endurance riding to adventure-touring to Superbike racing to sport-touring and lastly cruising.

To come here and act like everyone should ride a non-metric cruiser loaded with chrome and other expensive "doo-dads" and be into OCC and Jesse James and love super-loud (and illegal) pipes and wear fringed leathers and chaps and use unnecessary super-expensive oil does an extreme dis-service to all the other riders that are into other motorcycling venues.

In other words, before you act like you have the only valid motorcycling lifestyle and want complete validation of your hobby, stop and think.

 

[Jeff_D]

Originally Posted By: Zedhed
If we are going to objectively evaluate the merits of motorcycle lubricants, how in the world do you justify using Redline or Motul oil in a TC-88 engine? When some of us try to explain how those engines have nearly all the moving parts running in roller or ball bearings and no shared-oil transmission thus no need for such expensive and esoteric oils, we are either ignored or branded as "bashers."
You mean like this:
Quote:
I don't understand what it is with Harley riders feeling the need to pamper their bikes? If they're as good a machine as they claim they are, they should be able to withstand more abuse than a Japanese bike right? Isn't that why the shell out the big bucks?

I have to laugh at the guy across the street from me. He rides his Harley maybe three times a year to make the five mile ride to the doughnut shop. He has to stand beside the machine while he get's his gear on because the bike won't idle without stalling. However, after donning his costume, he pulls out an infrared thermometer to check his engine temperature before riding off! I'm waiting for the day he pulls out the stethoscope.

One would think he'd deal with the idling problem????? He's pretty good with a polishing rag and a thermometer though. I doubt that he even owns a screw driver.
You did give him a "+1" for that post.

This is a perfect example of why you are part of the problem here, Zed.,since you can't see the problem in that response.

 

[outoforder]

Why do you Harley guys care so much about what other people think of your bike?

 

[Jeff_D]

Originally Posted By: outoforder
Why do you Harley guys care so much about what other people think of your bike?
I don't give a flying **** what you think of my bike, but when you insult me for riding whatever bike I decide I do give a ****.

Maybe you haven't noticed but people don't care to be judge and insulted for their choices by lame brain retards who know nothing about them or why they do, or choose, what they do.

So if you're gonna insinuate I'm some villiage people [censored], or I follow like a sheep and can't think for myself, you're gonna get a reaction.

Shouldn't be that hard to understand. Do I need to get out some crayons and draw a picture for you?

Seriously, how thick can people be?

So if you want to ride a Honda, or Suzuki, or whatever, more power to you. Call me idiot, then expect a big "**** You!!"

 

[GMBoy]

Originally Posted By: Zedhed
Originally Posted By: Mr_Incredible
Originally Posted By: GMBoy
This place is starting to suck.


I agree. If the Harley bashers would mind their own business some business might get done.


Hard to mind your own business, when the guy next door fires up his 105 db straight-piped "motorcycle" at 1 in the morning to impress his drinking/riding buzz-buds. Yeah, my motorcycle riding neighbors think that's why you own a Harley -- to do drunken tire burnouts in the middle of the night. The next day they quietly polish them.....nursing their hang-overs. When I leave early to go on a long ride, they don't even hear me leave. But after I return, they go, "You rode all the way to Calif and back? What for?"



What does your neighbor have to do with this thread? Nothing. Point is we need to stick to the thread topic and leave the bashing out.

 

[EagleFTE]

I’m not sure why you are associating PAOs and POE based products with only bearings and shared sumps as if that is their sole purpose. Are they great in that regard, sure. PAO and ester based products have great high temperature stability. That is why so many use those products in air cooled engines where sump temps get quite hot (over 275 is not that uncommon) not to mention local hot spots in the engine at even higher temps. Red Line, prior to introducing an entire line of MC products mostly geared for air cooled Vtwins already had a Vtwin oil in the standard white bottle lineup. Use of Red Line in air cooled Vtwins is hardly new or without bases and they have been used for a very long time (include Amsoil and M1 as well). Heck I used Bel Ray syn 2 stroke in my 1974 Suzuki when I was a kid. If you don’t agree with the advantages of modern synthetics, particularly GIV and GVs in air cooled engines it come as no surprise to me that your post about tappets get ignored. Why you care what oil someone else buys is even more of a mystery.

Many here have had or currently own a wide variety of motorcycles. I have owned metric dirt bikes and ATVs, metric bikes with inline 4 DOHC engines, and air cooled Vtwins. So someone telling a Vtwin owner what he should be using or doing with his bike when that person has never owned one himself could be interpreted as arrogant. But in most cases around here it is really an attempt to stir up trouble or vent about ….well we really don’t understand that part at all.

“To come here and act like everyone should ride a non-metric cruiser loaded with chrome and other expensive "doo-dads" and be into OCC and Jesse James and love super-loud (and illegal) pipes and wear fringed leathers and chaps…..”

Once again who has done this? Provide examples. All I ever see is one way bashing. Your last examples were complete non players. I could not tie them to any specific product brand and no group of motorcyclists was bashed. I’m not sure this site has the memory space for me to list examples on the opposite side of this story. It doesn’t bother me except that people can’t have an exchange of information with the letters HD in it without someone trying to hijack the thread for their personal agenda.

 

[GMBoy]

Originally Posted By: Pioneer74
Picking up a low mileage 1998 Sportster 1200 Sport. A little over 10k miles. Has had all service done at dealership with HD 20w-50 oil and HD filters. Previous owners informs me that it is due for an oil change.

I would like a better alternative to overspending on a re-badged oil produced by a country with a questionable leader. I don't plan on riding much this year, maybe 3 or 5k, because of a hectic job and finishing my basement.

I guess my questions would be:

1. Do I start a synthetic oil now or keep using Dino?
2. What is a good brand after answering question #1?
3. After answering #1 and #2, what would my OCI be?
4. Can I easily get a filter to fit the bike without having to go to the dealer for it? They tend to be a little expensive.


Thank you in advance!




Just so everyone knows - THIS is the topic we should be discussing! If you guys want to bash on Harleys, Domestic cars/trucks, hate on SUV's, want to ban guns and those other liberal tendencies-fine. Just don't do it on some guys post where he is trying to get some help from we BITOG folks who know oil. I'm back to wanting to quit this place..AGAIN.

 

[GMBoy]

To Pioneer74 -

I apologize for the idiots on here. Good luck with that new bike, it'll serve you well. I've given you my advice earlier on. Hopefully from here on out you'll get more answers to your questions.

 

[Jeff_D]

Pioneer74, I'm not exactly proud of my part in stinking up your thread either, so..........

I use Amsoil's in my '84 Shovelhead. I decided to do this because Harleys are not "easy" on oils, despite what some people here say. They can run very hot, especially the newer bikes, and in stop and go traffic, without air movement or the aid of a liquid cooling system, they can easily run 250+ oil temps at the tank, Twin Cams even more so. They also do have many plain bearings. I don't know about a '98 sporty, but Shovel's and Evo's have more plain bearings than rollers, believe it or not. Cam outer, breather, oil pump, rocker, wrist pin, etc., all are plain bearings. Only roller's in those engines are crank and rod mains. Plain bearings need lube and these engines sacrifice oil pressure due to the rollers, so good lube is important for those other bearings that don't get to see much pressure.

I have an older "Ironhead" Sporty engine apart, on the bench right now, so I can show how many plain bearing are in one, if needed.

 

[EagleFTE]

I stumbled across a development for Amsoil and K&N that leads me to correct my previous post. Neither of these are carrying a recommendation for the Evo 1340 in their current web lookup. It has been dropped. The Sporster lookup is now

K&N KN-170
Amsoil EaOM135

Also I should mention that Bosch is thought to be identical to Pure One under the new ownership (well not that new anymore) and since Purolator specifically says not to use P1s on motorcycycles but to use the ML series instead you may want to take that into account....or not.

 

[Pioneer74]

Wow. I never thought there was so much animosity between bike riders. I was raised by a father that rode a Harley. He had a '77 SuperGlide until he was forced to sell it for health reasons. Before that he rode a Honda. Never did I know that the two bikes, to some people, represent a different persona.

I know some people don't like the louder pipes on the Harley's, but to me it is a choice. The pipes on mine are street legal and I will not apologize for the noise, nor do I expect the kid across the street to apologize for the muffler he has on his Honda car, that is also street legal, that wakes me up in the middle of the night.

This is my first bike. I have always wanted an Ultra Classic, and this is my way of learning to ride safely and stepping up to my dream. If that offends some people, then I am sorry.

I appreciate everybody that has tried to help me. i think I am going to go with the Mobil-1 V-twin 20w-50 and Mobil-1 M1-102 filter. Not because I don't appreciate the opinions that others have given on their choice of oil, but because it is readily available at a store close to me, and from what I have read, a good oil.

Again, thanks to all. Ride safe.

 

[EagleFTE]

Well you can't go wrong with M1 Vtwin 20W50. Great oil for that bike. I will have to say that Champion Labs, who makes the M1-102 filter has specifically said they don't recommend that filter for a Harley. Some have had flow problems on Evos. But still some use them without problems.

 

[Pioneer74]

Heard anything bad about the Purolator PL14476?

I might just use the Harley filter. There is a dealer near me that I can order them for about $8.50 apiece plus $10 flat shipping. I've added 10 to the cart and the shipping stayed the same, so that is about $9.50 per filter for chrome or about $7.00 per filter for black.

 

[cfromc]

Originally Posted By: Pioneer74
Heard anything bad about the Purolator PL14476?

I might just use the Harley filter. There is a dealer near me that I can order them for about $8.50 apiece plus $10 flat shipping. I've added 10 to the cart and the shipping stayed the same, so that is about $9.50 per filter for chrome or about $7.00 per filter for black.


I've also heard about problems with the M1 filters. Some car filters will work and some won't. I've never taken the chance and always used a filter made for the XL engine. I've been doing the once-a-year oil change for several years now and its that much easier to justify the extra cost of the synth oil and Harley or Amsoil filter.

 

[EagleFTE]

While the Pure One and M1 M-102 filters have a 3/4 thread and gasket inner dia of about 2.43 and outter dia of about 2.73 no consideration was made in their component selection for this application, primarily flow and bypass. Purolator and Champion have fielded questions from unhappy customers in the past and will say that no where in their application charts for these filters will you find the words Harley Davidson. Purolator has gone as far as to post a paragraph on thier web site saying if you think you want to use a Pure One let it be known that we the manufacturer do not recommend that. Both companies do make filter with HD on their app charts, These are not them. If you are looking for shopping convenience you can go with the Wix / NAPA filters that do list HD on their app charts. But the NAPA Gold (which is what you would want) costs about the same as the Harley filter, $7 and change out the door. What you are looking for is flow fo about 8-9 GPM and by pass of about 10 PSI.

 

[Mr_Incredible]

Originally Posted By: Pioneer74
Wow. I never thought there was so much animosity between bike riders.


Really, only a (very) vocal few. The rest of us are fairly normal guys with no axe to grind.

When you complete your ride, park, get off and turn away, the bikes smell the same and they all tick the same as they cool off. Enjoy your ride no matter what brand or type.

Happy motoring.

 

[outoforder]

Originally Posted By: Pioneer74
Wow. I never thought there was so much animosity between bike riders.



I'm too busy putting miles on my bike to worry about what other people think of my bike. If someone thinks my V-Star is the biggest piece of junk on the road, well ok then. I asked if HD riders bought their bike for their approval or the approval of others and I was immediately labeled a hater and dumb. Seriously guys, are you really that bent out of shape about what a bunch of keyboard kowboys think of your ride or of you? Your posts are only confirming the HD stereotype. Why do we pick on you? Because it's so easy ;-) Any little bit of teasing is like poking the hornets nest. Some posters wonder why we don't pick on crotch rockets or other bikes. The answer is simple. The young pups on the crotch rockets don't care what we think. Harley riders do

Side note: How can I make fun of a guy on a crotch rocket when there is always a hottie on the back?!?!?!?

 

[bigbird_1]

How come nobody picks on the scooter riders? I feel a poke at the hornet's nest coming.

 

[boraticus]

Originally Posted By: bigbird_1
How come nobody picks on the scooter riders? I feel a poke at the hornet's nest coming.


You ignored a Harley rider. That's unforgivable.

 

[Jeff_D]

Originally Posted By: outoforder
Why do we pick on you? Because it's so easy ;-) Any little bit of teasing is like poking the hornets nest.
So....... in an oil discussion you post off topic inflammatory stuff about that brand of motorcycle owners simply because you want to get a reaction out of them?

This is you then, no?

Troll: In Internet slang, a troll is someone who posts inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room or blog, with the primary intent of provoking other users into an emotional response[1] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.[2]

Sure looks like it to me.