1971 VW bus. No hose clamps on fuel filter. Fire

[wrcsixeight]

Not My vehicle, but I saw the fire start, and I put it out within 20 seconds.

I was told by someone familiar with aircooled VW's that one does not put hose clamps on plastic fuel filters.

Only damage in engine compartment appears to be wiring insulation, and of course the fuel line and vaccuum hose to brake booster, which was drinking water hose, painted matte black.

This fuel filter was plumbed after the fuel pump. It was right next to the distributor. The Distributor just had new points and condenser installed at a professional repair joint who also adjusted the carb.

I suspect the tech somehow compromised the fuel filter or the fittings in the process.

I have replaced fuel lines, vaccuum hose, and the crisped wiring to coil and Oil pressure sensor.

Am waiting on new wires and condenser and some heatshielding sleeves to slide over fuel lines.


I did not install a fuel filter post fuel pump. Still can, of course.
opinions?

I put a metal case filter in place of an existing plastic filter, which was located just below fuel tank.

I was later told these are supposed to have the filter after the fuel pump, not beforeas the extra restriction can dmage the diaphram in the fuel pump.

Does not seem wise to have plastic fuel filter in air cooled engine compartment to me.

NO hose clamps seems equally unwise, even considering the low fuel pressure of this engine.

I am no VW mechanic.

I suspect the spark plug wires were ignition source, but the alternator/ generator output stud connection was loose too.

They are getting replaced. Not sure why the professional outfit who worked on it would not attend to basic tune up items, when it was running so crusty. The contacts in the distributor cap are by no means in good condition either, and the alternator/ generator belt is cracked fairly badly.

I think if the owner were litigious, he might have a pretty good case.

 

[ediamiam]

What were the instructions the owner gave to the shop? A tuneup on the air cooled should have included rotor and distributor cap, as well as valve adjustment and ignition timing. They should have recommended the belt change, looked at the air filter and possibly a fuel filter change. This is typically what I do on my 67 4 cylinder Porsche.

Sounds like there were a number if issues that needed attending to but had been neglected or juryrigged

 

[Silk]

Pretty common on VW's back in the day, filter or no filter. The fuel hose will squirt straight on to the ignition coil, and...pooph.

 

[Billbert]

those fabric braided fuel hoses are the problem, they need to be replaced about every 2 years. the fabric covers up the dried rotting rubber, but DO NOT use regular rubber fuel hose, it is not available in the correct size.

 

[drtyler]

From your picture, what good would hose clamps have done? It looks like the filter broke off, you can see a piece in the end of the hose. Those filters should not be in a VW engine compartment!

The filter should be located before the pump outside of the engine compartment - not between the fuel pump and carb. You did it correctly.

The carb fuel inlet fitting is only pressed in, and will come loose over time.

With the proper sized braided line, you don't need hose clamps. The only place I ever install one is at the carb fuel inlet -- then I use the clamp as an aid to install stiff wire to prevent the inlet from coming out. Another fix is the thread the inlet and carb body.

And as a poster above stated, the braided line should be replaced every year or two.

 

[edwardh1]

every year or two?
is there something more modern?
my Japanese cars dont seem to need "every year or two- is that a German thing?

 

[Chris142]

The metal pipe that the fuel hose pushes onto that's pressed into the carb liked to fall out too.

 

[Astro14]

Originally Posted By: edwardh1
every year or two?
is there something more modern?
my Japanese cars dont seem to need "every year or two- is that a German thing?


What did your 1971 Japanese cars do for a filter? Probably something similar...this isn't a "German" issue...it's a "1971" issue...

 

[vwmaniaman]

I have a 1975 Westfalia that had a 2 barrel Webber on it when I got it. Had the filter like that on the top too. I put a electric low pressure pump on the bottom of the fuel take where the injector pump was mounted and added a 70's Ford filter on the inlet side. Of course it now fits american size fuel lines too.

 

[Olas]

I used NiCop brake line from the tank to the engine bay, with a couple of inches of modern 'fuel injection' rated hose to connect the NiCop to the tank and the carb.

All connections are held with Jubilee clips. The first filter is in the tank on the end of the fuel pickup, second filter in the engine bay where the hard line joins the flexible line, and the third fuel filter is between the pump outlet and the carb inlet.

Some think it's unnecessary to use three fuel filters, but the level of cleanliness in my float bowl is unmatched.

BTW the cotton braided rubber line is good for vacuum and fuel but doesn't last very long, as another poster mentioned two years is about the limit for that stuff. Worth keeping some to hand in case you find yourself stuck in a bind at the side of the road.

 

[Olas]

Originally Posted By: edwardh1
every year or two?
is there something more modern?
my Japanese cars dont seem to need "every year or two- is that a German thing?


It's a 'materials over four decades old' thing..

 

[SZR48207]

So the OP can't just find some Stant fuel lines in a similar enough size and install that in place of the braided ones?

 

[Olas]

Originally Posted By: Reddy45
So the OP can't just find some Stant fuel lines in a similar enough size and install that in place of the braided ones?



Only the OP knows what he can and can't find.

Pulling the plastic fuel lines off ANY post 1990 car will give you sufficient material to work with, if you have a scrapyard nearby.

Or spend big bucks on an lines and fittings,

 

[OleBillL]

I rebuilt a few hundred of these engines and thousands of tune-up/repairs - definitely use the braided hose, it seems to last a good decade, but use some Otiker clamps. If you want a filter put it before the pump, down under body between the engine and chassis fuel line. Yes, it has more restriction, but I never saw engines that needed a filter anyway. The factory is not put any in the engine compartment. A screen was in the fuel tank. Maybe now, if the tank is shedding a filter could be needed, but not in the 70's 80's. A plastic filter housing is looking for trouble in the engine compartment. If you must, make sure it is a pleated paper element. The brass tube will come out of the carb housing if someone tried to take off a stuck hose with vice grip pliers. Just tap it in with a small hammer. If still not tight, seek professional help.

A '71 was set way too lean and was known for getting too hot and burning valves, a slight enlargement of the carb main jets would cure that.

 

[wrcsixeight]

OP here

It does appear the fuel filter was cracked or leaking. The braided hose did not pull off the filter, as it is still stuck in the ends.

I did not know about the port in the carb falling out. I will take steps to insure it cannot wiggle itself out. I did use some needle nose vice grips to remove the old fuel line from it. It did not require much effort to do so. Did not notice any looseness of it, but did not know it was prone to falling out either.

Thanks for letting me know of this issue. I would feel horrible if it fell out and another fire started.

I used 3/16 ID fuel line from Napa. No issues getting it over fuel pump or carb fittings.

I have some braided sleeving from 'heatshield products' on order that says it reduces 60% of radiant heat and can withstand 1100F and 2000f intermittent. I was going to slide it over te fuel lines once it arrives.

This is a '73 but has a 71 engine in it, or so I am told.

Some of the wiring was quite suspect. The 12 gauge wire from alternator stud was allowed to hang and was pushed through firewall with no chafe protection, and hooked to starter. The VW was a recent purchase and this wire looked spanking new.

This wire, another wire to the voltage regulator, and the wires to coil and oil pressure sensor were just allowed to hang and rattle.

No longer.

 

[berniedd]

Whoever worked on that bus didn't have much experience with these engines. A filter between the fuel pump and carburettor was not a factory design and is a dangerous big no-no, as you have found out. Factory design there was a simple braided fuel hose without clamps (although I do admit to adding hose clamps for added security). A filter inserted into the circuit there added mass to the whole shebang and vibrated wildly when the engine was running. The sometimes unfortunate result was the brass tube it connected to the carburettor got pulled out of the carb body and started an engine fire.

Some builders would convert the press fit of this brass tube into the carb body into a threaded affair and cure the fire potential hazard possibility. There was also a metal plate one could buy and stake it between the carb and distributor so fuel drips from the carb would be deflected away from the high tension distributor.

If one wanted an additional filter, it was connected to the line before the fuel pump. Not many did, however, as there was already a fine filter sock already in the gas tank

 

[wrcsixeight]

Perhaps overkill. Perhaps justified.

Owner says it runs better now than before the fire.